Parliamentary Oversight: Public Service Commission, Chairperson of Committees, NCOP Deputy Chairperson, Research Unit with Minister of Public Service & Administration

Meeting report

This was a joint meeting of the Portfolio Committee on Public Service and Administration and the Select Committee on Cooperative Governance and Traditional Affairs. Both Co-Chairpersons welcomed the presence of Minister for Public Service and Administration, Mr Richard Baloyi.

Strengthening of the Parliamentary Oversight role
Mr Obed Bapela, House Chairperson of Committees for Oversight, Public Participation and Information Communication Technology, spoke on the importance of the oversight role performed by Parliament. He highlighted the need for parliamentary staff numbers at a research level to be increased to match those of the corresponding government departments which Parliament monitored. He noted the importance of reviewing Annual Reports based on statistics provided by Departments upon request by the committee. Mr Bapela stressed the need for parliamentary committees to make an effort to request those reports in order to properly assess the progress of a Department on a particular issue. 

The presentation explained that in the past, Parliament had dealt with many Bills in a session but that the trend had changed due to the need to promulgate effective quality Bills. Promulgating too many Bills meant that these could not be monitored properly to assess effective implementation. In the past, Bills were not always monitored well for progress at the implementation phase.

The presentation noted the need for more resources to be provided for Parliament so that its oversight role could be fully carried out without impediment. A request to present to Parliament should provide a minimum three-day preparation period before one had to appear before a committee. Mr Bapela expressed the need for parliamentary committees to have closed door meetings on occasions where sensitive information was being discussed or presented. He said that such occurrences had happened in past sessions and may occur in the future. He also noted the importance of reports not being publicised in the media until they had been seen by the relevant committee for which they were intended.     

Collaboration of institutions of governance for oversight
Ms Thandi Memela, Deputy Chairperson: National Council of Provinces (NCOP), spoke about the necessity for collaboration between the three spheres of government (local, national and provincial). The presentation noted that the work of oversight and delivery of services would be made more efficient and easier through such collaboration.

Through integration, committees in the National Council of Provinces and the National Assembly could coordinate their work thus ensuring that the same task was not done twice by different committees. Collaboration ensured that less time was used on bureaucratic haggling and more time on the work of delivering effective governance. Collaboration ensured that the job of oversight was done thoroughly and effectively. It also ensured that government policies were implemented effectively and that intergovernmental relations stayed congenial.  

Collaborative work also ensured effective use of resources and a cut down on excessive expenditure as projects for oversight could be better coordinated and managed. Fostering collaborative relationships within the spheres of government which were congenial would be beneficial to the citizenry and therefore deserved more attention. 

Discussion
Ms A Dreyer (DA) welcomed the input of both presenters. She said that it was disconcerting that reports intended for committees were sometimes hijacked by the media and committees found out about them through the media. She commented that in future, oversight visits should be arranged well in advance to give members an opportunity to prepare themselves for such visits. 

Ms J Maluleke (ANC) said that it was important that the work done by committees be properly publicised to make the public aware of the work being done by Parliament.

Mr T Mofokeng (ANC; Free State) said that it was important that the Public Services Commission be involved in the implementation of policies affecting public administration and that the Minister of Public Services and Administration should look into this.    

Mr A Matila (ANC; Gauteng) welcomed both presentations. He said that Parliament should look into recruiting more researchers for the various committees to assist them with their oversight work. He felt that the committees were understaffed compared to their corresponding government departments.  

Mr D Bloem (COPE; Free State) commented that not enough was being done by Select Committees to address problems raised in reports presented to them. He said that Local Government was where delivery was needed therefore the role of the Select Committees was important and should be carried out more proficiently in future.

Ms F Bikane (ANC) lambasted the fact that some reports meant for Parliament were leaked to the media and commented that confidential reports tackling sensitive issues should first be made available to Parliament before being publicised. Oversight visits should be assessed for relevance prior to the visits taking place due to the need to use time efficiently and not waste it on needless trips. She commented that collaboration between the spheres of government had grey areas and needed to be implemented better in future.   

Mr L Suka (ANC) said that Parliament needed to provide adequate resources for committees to carry out their oversight role. More needed to be done to command the Executive to provide the information it required to assess its annual performance. He commented that synergy across government spheres was welcome but such synergy should not lead to one government sphere dictating to the other and intervening for another.

Ms Thandi Memela agreed with Mr Suka and said that no sphere should impose its will on another.

Public Service Commission (PSC) role and contribution to parliamentary oversight
Dr Ralph Mgijima, PSC Chairperson, explained that the Commission sought to promote a professional and ethical public administration that was accountable, equitable, efficient, effective, corrupt-free and responsive to the needs of the people of South Africa.  

The PSC performed its function of providing oversight by providing Parliament and the legislatures with reports containing evidence on the monitoring, evaluation and investigation of public administration practices. The information in these reports could be used by Parliament and the legislatures to call executive authorities and heads of departments to account. The standing Committee on Public Accounts had on several occasions, made use of the PSC’s reports to call on departments to account. Other committees were increasingly becoming aware of the PSC’s role in promoting accountability. The practice of referring PSC reports to more than one Portfolio Committee at national level was a useful practice that had ensured that more Committees become aware of the work of the PSC. At provincial level, engagement on the PSC’s reports had been largely unsatisfactory in the past, but there was also increasingly more interest in the PSC’s reports.

Mr Mgijima pointed out that the PSC’s recommendations in these reports could not be enforced by the PSC as it did not have the legislative mandate to do so. The role of Parliament and the legislatures was therefore of paramount importance in ensuring that the Executive and departments were held accountable and that the PSC’s recommendations were followed through. Parliamentary committees could identify priority areas which the PSC should investigate, monitor or evaluate to strengthen their oversight role. Of course, this depended on the availability of resources within the PSC. Engagement with the PSC’s reports in order to hold the Executive and HoDs accountable should be prioritised by the committees.

Discussion
Mr H Groenewald (DA; North West) commented that he found the Public Service Commission’s reports useful in assisting with oversight work. He asked which committee should specifically work with the PSC and how often that committee should meet.

Dr Mgijima responded that the PSC submitted reports to committees on oversight in provincial legislatures as well as the national legislature without being beholden to any specific committee. The Commission encouraged interaction with any and all committees interested in its work and that meetings with the relevant committees happen as often as was necessary to properly assess achievements made in certain areas. He added that the Commission did have resource constraints but that it would operate in the best manner it could despite those constraints. 

Ms B Ncube (ANC; Gauteng) asked how the Commission assessed the implementation of the recommendations it made to certain spheres of government. She asked how the Commission funded projects.

Dr Mgijima responded that the Commission carried out oversight visits of its own volition to assess implementation and that the Commission was included in provincial budgets and thus received its funding from there to fund projects.

Mr M Mokgobi (ANC; Limpopo) asked how the Commission investigated claims of bad governance.
Dr Mgijima said that the Commission carried out its own oversight visits to assess progress.

Ms J Moloi-Moropa (ANC) commented that collaboration between committees and the Commission were vital to ensure that work was effectively carried out.

A representative from the Eastern Cape Legislature said that provincial service delivery needed to be better monitored along with municipalities.

Mr S Montsitsi (ANC; Gauteng) asked how the Commission dealt with service delivery and compliance. He said that oversight visits needed to go to more places to assess the quality of delivery.   

Dr Mgijima referred to his earlier answer to Mr Mokgobi’s similar question.

Tightening and Capacitating the Legislatures Research Units
Ms Carmine Rustin, Head Researcher: Parliamentary Research Unit, said that the Research Unit’s mandate included the provision of research support to Members of Parliament, committees and senior management in a professional and objective manner. It included provision of support to Presiding Officers, Ad Hoc Committees, Task Teams, delegations to multilateral bodies (Pan African Parliament, SADC Parliamentary Forum, Commonwealth Parliament Association) as well as seminars and conferences. She highlighted the importance of researchers in assisting Parliament in carrying out oversight.

The Research Unit was headed by a Chief Researcher and composed of sixty researchers, eight senior researchers, and ten administrative assistants. However, more researchers were needed and to staff properly the unit more needed to be done to recruit able researchers. The Research Unit was divided into eight clusters, each headed by a Senior Researcher, with between four to eight researchers and supported by an administrative assistant. The main problems faced by the Unit were low staff numbers and time constraints on the delivery of work requested by committees.

Discussion
A Free State Legislature representative said that in his opinion the national legislature seemed to have as many problems as the provincial legislature in filling research positions. He asked how often researchers looked at sharpening their skills.

Ms Rustin replied that the Research Unit offered annual bursaries for researchers to further their skills and knowledge.

Mr L Suka (ANC) said that Members should look to assist researchers where they could to make up for the deficiency in staff levels in the Research Unit. He said that researchers were an important component of the work the committees did and without them the oversight work would not advance. 

The Free State Legislature representative said that parliamentary research documents should in future be made available to provincial legislatures.

The meeting was adjourned.