Hon Deputy Speaker, the Constitution of our country devotes no less than 26 out of 136 pages to the role of Parliament, which means that the critical role of Parliament takes up more than 20% of our Constitution. The intention of the drafters of the Constitution was clearly to give significant centrality to the role of Parliament in our constitutional democracy.
As Cope, we hold the view that Parliament, especially the National Assembly, has to fulfil the crucial role of exercising oversight responsibility over the executive in accordance with section 55(2) of the Constitution, and I quote:
2. The National Assembly must provide for mechanisms -
a. to ensure that all executive organs of state in the national sphere of government are accountable to it; and
b. to maintain oversight of -
i. the exercise of national executive authority, including the implementation of legislation; and ii. any organ of state.
Therefore, Cope is of the opinion that Parliament, like Chapter 9 institutions, should be adequately resourced to enable it to fulfil this constitutional responsibility with the necessary diligence. [Interjections.]
Constitutionally, the National Assembly should be providing a national forum for public consideration of issues. But more importantly, it should be able to keep Cabinet Ministers, and the departments that report to them, accountable to the nation and the electorate.
Deputy Speaker, the role of portfolio committees in the oversight function of Parliament cannot be overemphasised. Unfortunately, notwithstanding a growing parliamentary bureaucracy, portfolio committees still do not have the necessary support services in respect of sufficient research capacity.
The implication of not having additional research capacity is that portfolio committees cannot, like their counterparts in some of the established democracies of the world, conduct comparative research into and analysis of government reports and annual strategic plans. Thus the quality of debate in committees and in the National Assembly is being weakened, which is not conducive to effective oversight of the executive - our clear constitutional responsibility.
The question is whether portfolio committees have the capacity to conduct follow-up investigations on departmental weaknesses exposed by Scopa in past years. The recently released diagnostic report of the Planning Commission highlighted serious shortcomings in departmental service delivery, which should have been exposed by committees of the National Assembly. To quote but one phrase from the diagnostic report, it stated that:
In some areas, constitutional and legal provisions have not been fully implemented; in others, there has been a lack of sustained and effective focus.
The report also finds that:
South Africa needs to provide opportunities to all, yet historical disadvantages continue to have an adverse effect on tens of millions of citizens. This is particularly true in education and employment, which the commission has identified as the most pressing challenges facing the country.
Deputy Speaker, the time has also come for us to evaluate our procedures and rules of debate. In some respects, we believe that the National Assembly has not created a national forum for debate and public consideration of these and other national issues.
The House operates on the basis of a set agenda which is recycled from year to year to meet ceremonial, procedural and mechanistic requirements rather than the exigencies of the time. Hon Deputy Speaker, the National Assembly needs to reintroduce the annual no confidence debate and the weekly interpellations.
The Speaker has the opportunity and also the responsibility to assist the National Assembly to provide the kind of leadership that will allow the principle of responsible government to prevail in our country. Without strong parliamentary oversight the executive in any democracy can become a law unto itself. It has to be made fully accountable to this House as the Constitution requires.
Cope believes that all political parties should hold hands to ensure that Parliament is enabled to fulfil its constitutional responsibility, in order to ensure that we live up to the expectations of the nation. Cope supports this Budget Vote. Thank you.
Madam Deputy Speaker, the IFP thanks your good office, all parliamentary personnel and all our parliamentary colleagues for the conscientious hard work, efforts and expertise delivered in connection with the diligent management of our Parliament.
The total budget allocation for 2011-12 is R1,674 billion. We ask, firstly, whether we are getting value for money spent commensurate with the money allocated. Secondly, is Parliament utilising this money as effectively as possible in the pursuit of its strategic objectives? I now turn to some other relevant issues, like the parliamentary Budget Office. We ask the Speaker to note that we still do not have a parliamentary Budget Office, which is an essential structure. So, Mr Speaker, we accordingly ask that this be seriously attended to.
Regarding the proposed parliamentary building project, we are just starting to resurface from a major economic downturn. We do not think it the appropriate time to embark on such a massive project. We therefore propose that this project be postponed, and that we rather cope with what we have in the meanwhile.
This Parliament has, amongst others, portfolio committees, ad hoc committees, a Chief Whips' Forum, programming forums, the Qualifications and Credit Framework, QCF, the Ethics Committee, the Rules Committee, the Joint Rules Committee, the Parliamentary Oversight Aurthority, POA, and many others. We in the IFP perceive the need for a greater level of cohesion and co-ordination between these various structures, as idealistically espoused in section 40(1) of the Constitution calling for "distinctive, interdependent and interrelated spheres" of government.
But the good news, apart from the bad news - I can announce that Mr Ellis is going to be appointed as ambassador to Robben Island - is that the Chief Whips' Forum will discuss this and other issues at a special workshop on 2 and 3 August. [Laughter.]
Concerning the Joint Rules Committee and the Rules Committee, I am sure that I will be joined by both you and all other political parties in the House when I say that the Joint Rules and NA Rules Committees are failing our Parliament. In fact, the Rules Committee has met on only two occasions since the start of the Fourth Parliament, for a total period of 1 hour 45 minutes. [Interjections.] In addition, we have some allegedly unconstitutional Rules in the Rules of the National Assembly - Rules that should have been addressed many years ago.
With regard to the fact that it takes up to two years for Hansard's bound compilations to be compiled and for the hard copies to be issued to members of the House, this is unacceptable and must be addressed.
Concerning the composition of delegates in overseas parliamentary delegations, the IFP has been classed together with all the small parties for such delegations, although we hold the equivalent number of votes of all the small parties put together. As a result, we have to compete with eight small parties to have an IFP MP included in delegations. We call upon your kind office to urgently review this matter, and we propose an increase of two delegates per delegation - one for the IFP and one for the small parties. [Laughter.]
Finally, I want to place on record that we do not regard white members in the ANC as thieves and criminals. All of us whites were called criminals and thieves by Mr Malema in the presence of the president of the ANC at Kimberley, and your president has never repudiated Mr Malema. In fact, his silence has ratified this insult as ANC policy. But, rest assured, we don't regard you whites in the ANC as criminals or thieves. [Interjections.]
I hope that applies to me too, Koos! Hon Speaker, Parliament needs to play a leading role in driving progressive change in our society. It needs to do this in a number of ways, including influencing the national political discourse through the debates we have in this House, holding government accountable through proper oversight work, passing progressive legislation and, finally, embodying the change we would like to see in our society at large. Unfortunately, however, I feel that in each of these respects we are falling short of our ideals.
Firstly, the format for debates in this House is not conducive to robust engagement on the most topical issues affecting our nation. The only debates we seem to have are on our national days or Inter-Parliamentary Union, IPU, topics that do not always capture the pulse of the times. This is something that we urgently need to apply our minds to, so that this can be a proper debating forum that remains relevant to the burning issues outside.
In respect of oversight, our parliamentary committees need to play a greater role in holding government departments to account. To do this effectively, however, documents cannot be presented to members on the day, as is happening all too often. With regard to legislation, it is completely ludicrous that all of our parliamentary mechanisms are geared to preventing the legislative proposals Members of Parliament from being tabled in the House. We are legislators, and the system should therefore be encouraging us to push progressive legislative initiatives.
It is, however, on the issue of embodying the change that we would like to see where our Parliament falls short. We should be the most transparent institution in respect of how the people's money is spent, yet we are prevented from seeing documents pertaining to issues like travel claims. There are also too many inefficiencies in our systems, such as waiting till the last minute to approve overseas trips, thereby substantially increasing the cost of airline tickets. It is also absurd that we can put public questions to any Minister, and even the President, but yet there is no mechanism for putting public questions to the Speaker as to how this institution is run. This is a lacuna that we must address.
Finally, Parliament needs to embody the change that we are fighting for at the Congress of the Parties, COP 17, in Durban. I am proud to be a member of the Parliamentary Steering Committee on Climate Change, tasked with greening Parliament, but I am not proud of what I saw on my self-guided tour two weeks ago.
We currently do not have a waste management policy to speak of, and there is energy wastage throughout this precinct. Most shockingly, I discovered that Parliament spends over half a million rand on bottled water a year. Given that it takes eight litres of water to make one litre of bottled water, we should be ashamed to put a parliamentary logo on these bottles.
I am, however, committed to changing all these things before COP 17 and I trust that we can make this a project that we can all get behind as custodians of this institution. Thank you. [Applause.]
Deputy Speaker, hon Speaker, members of the executive, and distinguished members, it is a great pleasure and honour to participate in this debate on Budget Vote No 2 - Parliament, especially during Youth Month.
Having listened to members speaking here, I want to indicate that the ANC noted the need for legislatures to exercise their oversight responsibility more comprehensively, by holding government departments and other organs of state accountable for both financial and nonfinancial performance. It is the ANC that noted that.
It further notes the role of Parliament in ensuring that it passes legislation that furthers the transformation of all state institutions, including Parliament itself.
It is through this that one of our conferences resolved to support the need for all legislatures to improve their capacity to exercise their constitutional oversight role by providing them with adequate resources and building the capacity of all Members of Parliament.
We would like, from the outset, to support the strategic objectives related to strengthening the oversight capacity of the legislature, as pronounced by the Speaker today, including the introduction of the oversight model. We however, would like to warn against protracted implementation that might render the objective a paper intention without actual results.
Management and control systems in place need to be strengthened to allow equity in awarding bursaries and scholarships for members. It should be made mandatory for members to enrol in a course to further their knowledge or improve their capacity in the area of their deployment. If resources are a challenge, we recommend that a proportional allocation should be made.
It should be made mandatory for new members to undergo a thorough induction workshop, presented by qualified practitioners, not as is happening now, where we get a walk-over document that is currently done by staff members. We need to professionalise this institution, so that it is attractive to everybody who wants to participate in nation-building.
We believe that if members' capacity is strengthened, their work of overseeing the departments and other organs will be strengthened and will be productive.
We also believe that orientation and induction of new members of the executive on how Parliament functions would go a long way in minimising the unnecessary tensions that crop up between Ministers and parliamentary committees from time to time. We actually feel that it should be mandatory for them to attend the same briefings as members. This calls for Parliament to budget sufficiently for members' development and training.
The relationship between Parliament and the executive must remain cordial at all times. This will enhance our working relationship, based on mutual understanding and respect of roles and responsibilities.
Portfolio committees remain an extension of Parliament, and therefore remain a conduit between Parliament and its various constituencies. It goes without saying that resourcing them adequately and equitably - financially and human resource-wise - will go a long way in advancing the national democratic revolution.
It is disheartening, though, to see that some portfolio committees are still struggling to get the necessary resource capacity, while others are overresourced. The hon Speaker must attend to this with immediate effect. It cannot be that two and a half years down the line there are still committees that cannot function optimally due to a lack of essential resources.
The management of the committee section and adjacent structures governing the business of committees leaves much to be desired. We need management and control systems that are not only on paper, but are also practical, in such a way that they serve as enablers, and not as disablers of the work of committees.
Editing of minutes and reports still remains a huge challenge in this regard. These documents, we must all know, will remain public documents, and they must be reader-friendly and also aim to inform and educate members of the public on the critical business of the committees of this Parliament. I know that the House Chairperson of Committees has commenced work in this regard, but I still feel quick intervention is needed, lest unnecessary litigation follow.
You will realise that I am focusing mainly on the committee oversight work, as compared to other forms of oversight. This is so because it seems to be one of the most crucial areas, while at the same time being the main voice behind the masses of our people.
I feel that if committees are fully catered for, issues of consultation through public hearings, public dialogue, questions, answering of questions and statements will be enhanced. That will then improve the way members confront issues and will increase the effectiveness of our oversight.
We as the ANC also believe that the above lays the basis for effective and robust oversight work of Parliament. This Parliament embodies the will of the people and must ensure that it is responsive to their needs. It is through making the executive and other government organs accountable that we may say that we are truly representative of our people.
The economic recession taught us how important the work of committees is in scrutinising the country's budget, even before the budgets are presented to the legislatures by the Treasuries. Processes that lead to the tabling of the Budget by the Minister of Finance are so crucial that it may cause Parliament to have a greater influence on the actual allocation.
It is still difficult to implement the Money Bills Amendment Act, but we hope that studies undertaken by the hon Speaker and his team will help in solving the puzzle for us. The same tool can be used to force government departments to meet their MDGs. Parliament needs to intensify its community participation by being resourced adequately.
In conclusion, the essence of what we are both constitutionally and politically charged to do in our deployment to Parliament is to ensure that we as public representatives change the lives of our people for the better. For this to happen requires a philosophical outlook on the functioning of Parliament as a developmental one. The systems, structures, rules and facilities of Parliament must reflect an approach that is developmental for the members during their period of deployment. This developmental approach must allow members to exercise their responsibility to get on with what they have been tasked to do by their parties and the Constitution.
It therefore needs very serious introspection by the Parliamentary Oversight Authority on whether we truly are building a developmental Parliament in terms of its implementing culture and practice, so that we can be seized with the fundamental objective of servicing the needs of our people.
The ANC welcomes measures put in place by the Speaker and the authority in Parliament, and supports this Budget Vote. We believe we are on the right course and with time we will take the leap. By the way, a journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step. Thank you. [Applause.]
Deputy Speaker and hon members, for the past two years this Parliament has done very well in examining and challenging the work of government. It has not only focused on debating and passing important pieces of legislation, but also endeavoured to provide government with constructive feedback when carrying out its oversight role. Deputy Speaker, the work of Parliament is by nature very complex. Therefore, it follows that the complexity of the role of Parliament should be reflected in, firstly, the proportional formula that is applied to speaking times and, secondly, the resources that political parties need to be able to represent the views of their voters.
The current proportional speaking formula does not provide all the participants in our multiparty democracy with enough opportunity to add maximum value and influence discourse on a number of important national issues. There is a need to review the current time allocation which deprives the House of the opportunity to draw from multiple views and proposals in solving the challenges facing South Africa. This should form a critical performance assessment standard for what is the biggest debating House in the country.
Political party resource allocation should also be done in a manner that facilitates the constituency work of political parties represented in Parliament. While it would be dishonest to assert that no marginal gains have been made in these areas in the past, much more must still be done to ensure the effectiveness of this institution in these areas.
The UDM supports the Budget Vote. I thank you. [Applause.]
Hon Chairperson, hon Speaker, colleagues, and ladies and gentlemen, I am not going deal with the broad details of the budget, but I would like to express myself with regard to one or two principles involved.
The first point I would like to make is that the Constitution does not favour any one of the three arms of government. Parliament, as a legislative arm of our state at national level, is constitutionally on exactly the same level as the executive and the judiciary.
But unfortunately we as Parliament, as far as I'm concerned, are our own worst enemy. We as Parliament are supposed to look after the interests of the people and the provinces, and I am sorry to say I think we are failing both. Look at section 56 of the Constitution - that section gives enormous powers to the National Assembly and its committees to subpoena people, to get information, to investigate and to bring out reports in that regard.
I heard what the hon Coleman from the ANC has just said. What is lacking, as far as I'm concerned, is not more or better resources. What is lacking is the political will of the majority party's legislative members to hold the executive accountable. Everything you need is already in the Constitution; that's what you should use, not more money or more specialists.
I'm sorry to say that Parliament has become quite boring. Some of my colleagues have also referred to that. Parliament is not a platform where relevant topics in this country are debated and sorted out on a daily basis. Every day long lists of topics on relevant issues in South Africa are proposed, and none of them are ever debated in this Parliament. We stick to an agreed-upon programme year after year - all international dates, such as Women's Day and Children's Day - and all these are debated. But the truly relevant topics that deal with those issues that are important to South Africans out there on a daily basis are never discussed in this Parliament. We are failing the people and issues involved. [Interjections.]
Furthermore, the fact of the matter, Chairperson, is this. How serious are we when we do oversight of the different portfolios in this country? Only two portfolios were discussed in this Chamber in this fashion: the Budget Vote of the Presidency and the Budget Vote of Parliament. All the others were debated in extended public committees. On some days there were four, and in worse cases even six, on the same day! How serious are we as a legislature in respect of oversight over state departments when we do that? Even when those public committees were in session, we had committee meetings at the same time, from time to time. We are not taking these things seriously. We are failing the people, and we should move on. Thank you.
Chairperson, the ACDP recognises the enormous responsibility Parliament carries and the importance of a budget able to support the work done. We would like to thank officials and staff for their tireless efforts to ensure this institution functions as efficiently and effectively as it does.
Recent headlines like, "It's party time in Parliament" and "MPs milk travel allowances", which do not fairly represent Members of Parliament, tend to be ignored, as a response would give them some credibility. For this reason, I hesitate to comment now. But I will, all the same.
Due to the fact that MPs' travel expenses and phone calls cost taxpayers R223 million, perhaps another perspective will help put things in context. My experience regarding travel and the resulting claims is that in the years that I used my vehicle to get into my constituency, I was able to be far more available to my constituency.
However, I also paid a high price for the privilege. Not only was I physically exhausted, starved of time with my family, and broke because of the cost of vehicle services and replacing tyres, but I had a wreck of a car which I couldn't give away after five years. The travel claims themselves were heavily taxed, to the point that I really could not afford to be that diligent. I was, however, at the time, empowered in my work at Parliament by the experience of really being available in my constituency.
Due to the fact that public perceptions were that MPs travelling by car were milking the system, I found myself less motivated to sacrifice my time, health and money. I gave myself permission to fly to and from the nearest airport, and to travel to a designated office. Seriously, I like this arrangement much better. But if I were my constituency, I would opt for the old me and a travel policy that encourages MPs to go the extra mile.
Now, it is quite difficult for me to imagine that the extended parliamentary committees, EPCs, could possibly inspire the party-time headlines. Not having been to any after debate functions, I can only assume that those who did, managed to actually party. To be on the safe side, perhaps, we should ask Ministers to have mercy on us and not to provide information stands and after debate functions.
The ACDP welcomes the Speaker's decision, on principle, not to allow nongovernmental organisations, NGOs, to use Parliament's facilities to find legitimacy and publicity for their cause. I am referring specifically to the recent application by the Russell Tribunal to use Parliament's facilities for hearings against companies doing business with Israel. If allowed, we believe this would set a very dangerous precedent. We trust that the Justice and Constitutional Development committee will respect this decision.
We are, however, unimpressed that the recommendation from the Chief Whips' Forum, that parliamentary democracy offices, PDOs, be closed down, has not been taken seriously and certainly not been dealt with. Political parties expressed the view that resources that were being used could be better utilised elsewhere, and urgently requested the matter to be evaluated and reported on. This was especially urgent in the light of the imminent adoption of Parliament's budget. But we will be supporting this budget. I thank you. [Time expired.] [Applause.]
Madam Chair, Mr Speaker and hon members, I prefer to say this is a report, and not a speech. But, with my being a politician, you cannot blame me for peppering it with some politics. [Laughter.]
It is of the utmost importance to note that this far in the history of our parliamentary democracy, when hon members of this House speak about the mission and vision of this Parliament, we do not share the same world view regarding the institution. Recently the hon Mufamadi made the cogent observation that we are not working from a common agenda. I must hasten to add that we cannot therefore claim the same purpose, the same ends or even one identity. Deliberations in most of our institutional structures and substructures often exhibit multicivilisational tendencies, nestling in individual interests, race, class, ethnicity, ideology, religion, prejudices and fears. If we fail to harness these for the common good of all, we will collapse under their weight and divisive power.
In The Clash of Civilisations and the Remaking of World Order, Huntington argued that:
The broader levels of civilisational identity mean deeper consciousness of civilisational differences and the need to protect what distinguishes us from them.
However, an organisation with a single civilisational outlook becomes more effective and achieves results more quickly.
The strategic workshop to examine the role of the Quarterly Consultative Forum, QCF, was held on 25 March this year. As a result of the specific resolutions of the workshop, the QCF's co-chairpersons wrote to the presiding officers and the Secretary to Parliament proposing a workshop to address the following: firstly, to ensure the realignment of the functions and responsibilities of the QCF, the Chief Whips' Forum, the Parliamentary Oversight Authority, Exco, and others, to ensure co-ordination and nonduplication of tasks; secondly, to clarify the decision-making powers of each so as to ensure effective implementation of resolutions taken; and lastly, to identify adequate support and resources for each and ensure proper positioning of such support units.
On Parmed, the pension fund of Members of Parliament, the parliamentary Constitutional and Legal Services Office is currently conducting a review, and a parliamentary report was tabled at the last meeting of the QCF on 27 May 2011. The Parmed AGM will be taking place on 22 June - tomorrow. The Deputy Speaker has requested that we urge Members of Parliament to attend. A final report will be tabled at the next QCF meeting on 24 June for consideration. A comparative study of Parmed and other medical aid schemes will also be tabled at the next meeting of the QCF on Friday, 24 June.
The establishment of the Parliamentary Sports and Recreation Council in both Houses is a commendable step in the right direction, in providing for the wellness of members and staff in a united activist Parliament. This augurs well, with the Health Minister's attitude towards the promotion of health among members. Parties are therefore urged to motivate their members to participate in these activities. I must say that some of us are often concerned when members do not make full use of parliamentary structures at their disposal and intended to equip and empower them to excel in the service of the people.
Members of the QCF requested that the feasibility study on alternate accommodation for Members of Parliament should be included in the final phase of the Spatial Utilisation Project. It is hoped that sporting facilities will also be included in the project. However, the project resides with the presiding officers.
On members' training, in the 2010-11 financial year training was facilitated by Parliament and undertaken by Members of Parliament. This includes workshops arranged for all members on the Money Bills Amendment Procedure and Related Matters Act and also workshops on assessing departmental performance using audit reports. A total of 215 and 202 members respectively attended the sessions. A two-day seminar was also arranged for the Portfolio Committee on Energy, to orientate members of the committee and provide them with an overview of the energy sector and key issues thereof.
Formal accredited training programmes customised to the parliamentary environment were also undertaken. These include a programme in Economics and Public Finance offered by Unisa, which was attended by 25 Members of Parliament. Another group of 22 Members of Parliament participated in the Certificate in Governance and Leadership course, also offered by Unisa under the auspices of the Speakers' Forum. There are more programmes planned for implementation in the current financial year. These include workshops, training and seminars on climate change and the Millennium Development Goals, among others. The establishment of a fully fledged members' training office will depend on the recommendations of the Advisory Committee on Training for Members, which is subject to the approval of the deputy presiding officers.
Facilities of members are reviewed on an ongoing basis in response to the changing economic and operational requirements of members. A major review was concluded at the end of the third Parliament. Another comprehensive review is currently taking place to ensure that facilities fully provide for the needs of members in the Fourth Parliament.
In a remuneration review performed by the Independent Commission for the Remuneration of Public Office Bearers in 2007-08, the commission considered inputs on tools of trade and have published a concept document on tools of trade. Parliament made a comprehensive submission to the commission regarding salaries, pensions and tools of trade. Interaction with the Independent Commission is also ongoing.
Facilities are provided to enable members to perform the duties they were elected for as representatives. The facilities include, but are not limited to: air journeys for members, spouses and dependants, subject to specific eligibility criteria; travel to and from airports; travel by car, subject to policy compliance; parking at airports; telephone and related costs; relocation costs; furnished offices; and ICT equipment, including mobile phones.
Members of the QCF made a proposal that blazers should be manufactured for all Members of Parliament. The House Chairpersons have written to parliamentary management to investigate, source service providers and provide information. However, the project will require the approval of the Speaker.
A presentation on options for the upgrading of members' cellphones was presented by the ICT manager on 27 May. He also made a presentation at the Chief Whips' Forum thereafter. According to the latest information from the ICT Focus Group, the general view is that members should be allowed to purchase cellphones from their own service providers with Parliament's guidance to ensure compatibility. Parliament would then reimburse them. The ICT Focus Group is proposing certain recommendations to amend policy provisions for cellphones and other ICT equipment.
On tools of trade for Members of Parliament, the Task Team on Public Office Bearers' Remuneration met with the Seriti Commission on 7 June, and the following was reported. The commission reported that the final draft had been distributed and that the final draft would be ready in approximately six weeks; and with reference to the housing subsidy, it was agreed that three members from the task team would assist the commission to look into the matter. The names submitted to the commission were Mr Magwanishe, the Deputy Chief Whip, the hon Dr Mulder and the hon Mr Peter Smith.
June is designated as Youth Month in South Africa, and it is being commemorated by both Parliament and government. In particular, Parliament marked the commemoration with a debate in the National Assembly on 8 June on the topic, "A caring Parliament that advances youth development to achieve economic freedom". The debate was attended by youth from a number of formations.
The mounting of a youth exhibition to coincide with Youth Month and the debate in the National Assembly on 8 June gave effect to an instruction from Speaker Sisulu that an appropriate exhibition be mounted in public spaces in Parliament. We therefore communicated with the Secretary to Parliament that these and other similar occasions on the social and political calendar also be commemorated by an exhibition along the walls in Parliament.
Let me go to the villages where members reside. Residents committees were established in 2010, and the first board meeting will be held - I think - after recess. A total of 325 Members of Parliament currently occupy residences in the parliamentary villages. A total of 227 sessional officials occupy residences in the parliamentary villages.
Sessional officials' accommodation is currently being upgraded - 47 units are completed and 54 units are currently under construction in a contract of about 18 months. The project for the upgrading of the bulk water supply, repairs to the drainage system, and improvement to surface water damage and the electrical supply network commenced during March 2011 in a contract of 9 months.
The upgrading of the access control at parliamentary villages is in the planning stage. The open areas next to the bridge and Townsend Road have been maintained on a quarterly basis since 2010. The facilities management company, DSVH, is performing ongoing maintenance on the current alarm system in the parliamentary villages in order to avoid incorrect statistics being provided by the SAPS in respect of the activation of alarms. A total of 310 access cards have been issued to dependants, and a total of 147 vehicle access discs have been issued to tenants.
A new contract for members' transport commenced on 3 May this year, and the contract is valid for 24 months. The successful bidder or service provider is Springbok Atlas. The new contract for the transportation of learners also commenced on 3 May, and the contract is also valid for 24 months. The successful bidder or service provider is Ruskam-Atlantic Joint Venture.
On the security of parliamentary villages, a number of security incidents reported to the SA Police Service during 2010 ... [Interjections.]
Hon Chairperson, your time has expired.
(Mr M B Skosana): Madam Chairperson, this is a report. [Interjections.] [Laughter.]
Mr Speaker, I understand there are a few of your minutes left. [Laughter.] [Time expired.] [Applause.]
Hon Chairperson, allow me to start this speech by thanking the hon Speaker and Parliament for obtaining an unqualified audit opinion for the previous financial year. Nevertheless, it is my intention to pay attention to and emphasise some financial matters that still need to be paid attention to by Parliament.
It is unacceptable and disappointing to find that the designs and controls of Parliament are inadequate and ineffective, and that standard procedures, such as the reconciliations, were not performed satisfactorily.
Among other roles that Parliament plays is an oversight role over government, and I believe that we as Parliament must lead by example in all instances. We cannot call people to account if we ourselves continue to fail to adhere to basic accounting principles.
Furthermore, the financial management office is not adequately staffed. I wonder why it is that whenever entities, departments, and institutions have failed to adhere to principles, the staff component always comes into question. It makes one wonder if there are deliberately created circumstances that can be conveniently used as an excuse when entities, departments, and institutions are called to account.
The absence of a chief financial officer and a financial accounting manager makes it difficult to allocate blame when things go wrong. I ask the question that I have been asking other departments: Why were these essential positions not filled? Does the country not possess people with the skills and qualifications required? I must also emphasise that I find it absolutely vital that management resources the in-house internal audit as recommended because, unless it is properly resourced, then it cannot function adequately and effectively.
I am deeply concerned that, as I went though the report, I found that there were possible areas of wasteful expenditure under investigation. If such investigations have been completed, I am interested in the verdict. Of particular concern are the amounts of R186 000 and R6 million, were procurement processes where allegedly not properly followed. In many instances this is the root of corruption in our government and we definitely cannot afford to have a Parliament that has corrupt tendencies, for obvious reasons. [Interjections.]
The UCDP, with this input, supports Vote 2 - Parliament. Thank you. [Applause.]
Madam Chair, may I just say to the Speaker, by way of introduction, that just because Parliament has received a clean bill of health - an unqualified report from the Auditor-General - it does not mean that it is a healthy establishment at the present time. I also want to say to the Chief Whip of the ANC: "Sir, you cannot have oversight of the executive without having oversight of the Presidency as well. The Presidency is part of the executive to all intents and purposes, and you cannot avoid this fact. Oversight of the Presidency, sir, is to us an essential part of the wellbeing of this country".
I have to say at the outset that I fully endorse the approach adopted by the hon Davidson in this debate. [Interjections.] Maybe so, Mr Jeffery, but I promise you that if you listen, you will learn. For years and years the DA caucus has adopted a fairly conciliatory tone with regard to Parliament's Budget Vote, despite many misgivings over the years and a growing concern that we as a Parliament are prepared to accept mediocrity in our performance as guardians of national interests. [Interjections.] May I say that if Mr Jeffery really thinks that he is going to put me off my speech by making a few stupid interjections, he is really wasting his time.
We have expressed our concerns often, Mr Speaker. We have offered solutions and we have offered to participate in whatever structures or committees are set up to oversee the overall running of Parliament, but nothing, quite honestly, sir, has ever come of these proposals. This is because, regrettably, it would seem that mediocrity is an accepted norm in the ANC and that applies to how Parliament is run, as well.
My colleague, the hon Ian Davidson, has indicated very clearly the major concerns we have with regard to the financial control of Parliament and the oversight functioning of this Parliament.
The vague involvement - and I say that very intently - the vague involvement of the Parliamentary Oversight Authority in the running of Parliament, the fact that the Joint Rules Committee takes so long to achieve anything, and the fact that the National Assembly Rules Committee never meets, despite so many pressing issues, are all matters of extreme concern to us, and should be to Parliament as a whole.
There is also a lack of significance in the role played by the Chief Whips' Forum in Parliament these days. The Chief Whip of the ANC spoke about this body and its importance, but the Chief Whips' Forum has a crucial dual role to play: firstly, in respect of the running of the programmes of Parliament and, secondly, in ensuring the wellbeing of its members.
I have served on this body for 16 years and I well recall the days when we as Whips felt that we had a real and definite role to play - not long enough. That role under successive Speakers and Chief Whips has, I believe, been steadily eroded, and this body today has the potential to become little more than a talk shop within these hallowed halls of Parliament. Its levels of achievement have, quite frankly, dropped considerably.
I also say without a shadow of doubt that one of the reasons for this is the fact that the ANC itself places little emphasis on the role of the Whippery and, therefore, on the Chief Whips' Forum. This body, as I say, should play a crucial role in the general performance of our Parliament.
However, the problem starts with the Chief Whip of the Majority Party. We all know that the Chief Whip of the ANC is appointed by Luthuli House and is therefore responsible, first and foremost, to the ANC executive and only secondly to Parliament. We also know that the ANC changes its Chief Whips frequently, never allowing any one of them to make a real impact on this establishment. Both of these facts create a weakness in the Chief Whips' Forum because it is the ANC Chief Whip who chairs the meetings of this forum and is therefore, I suppose, its leader.
There is no stability and, as a result, often no follow-through on decisions taken and this is a major, major problem. We need stability in the forum and this can only be achieved by, firstly, appointing a Chief Whip who is dedicated to improving the overall running of the Parliament, and who is prepared, at all times, to work with the opposition in order to achieve this.
Secondly, there should be recognition by the presiding officers of the importance of the Whippery, both in respect of the proper running of Parliament, including the Parliamentary Programme, and its role with regard to members' interests, etc.
Thirdly - and the Chief Whip of the ANC made a note of this as well - dedicated resources should be allocated to the forum to enable it to do its job properly.
Unless these things happen, we will continue to see a steady decline in the standards of the running of this institution.
More specifically, through you, Madam Chairperson, to the Speaker, let me speak briefly about the Parliamentary Programme, which desperately requires overhauling. I have said to you before that you have it within your power to establish a legacy before, sir, you step down as Speaker or, alternatively, before Luthuli House makes you step down. That legacy could be a vibrant and stimulating Parliament in which the oversight function of members is played out to the full through meaningful debates, through a question time that is emphatic in what it is supposed to achieve, and with the introduction of new ideas into the programme, such as interpellations and opposition parliamentary days when opposition parties are given the opportunity to draw up the Order Paper for a particular day. This happens in the House of Commons. There is no reason whatsoever why it shouldn't happen in this House as well.
The hon Chief Whip of the ANC had some interesting things to say about this, as did the hon member from Cope. Some of these things too are being spoken about in the Chief Whips' Forum at present, but quite frankly there is a long, long way to go. You need to encourage this, Mr Speaker. You need to encourage, if not insist upon it.
Question time, which used to be the most exciting and regular part of our programme, now occurs very seldom and is the most boring part of our Parliamentary Programme. In addition to this, some members of the executive don't even bother to answer questions put to them, while others, if they do answer, do so in a manner that their answers undermine the entire principle of the executive being held accountable and downplay the importance of Parliamentary questions in holding the executive accountable.
In addition, the only debates we have in Parliament these days, as hon Corne Mulder has already said, are those related to national days and celebrations or Budgets Votes, and Budget Votes themselves are dreadfully underplayed, as hon Mulder has said. Motion after motion is proposed in this House, but never more than two or three a year are ever debated. Let's bring back party motions and members, motions and let's introduce a variety of other debates into this House that make this place a stimulating one. We need to reassess our entire Parliamentary Programme.
It is a challenge, Mr Speaker, and your office needs to work closely with the Whippery in order to achieve this. At the moment there is a huge chasm, I believe, between your office and the forum, and this does Parliament no good.
So I want to say, Mr Speaker, that for once in your time and my life, I would agree with you and say, "Working together we can do more." Thank you. [Time expired.] [Applause.]
Hon Chairperson, hon Ministers and Deputy Ministers, hon members, comrades, and guests in the gallery, it is fitting to begin this debate, which addresses issues of our democracy and our march towards building a national democratic society, with an acknowledgement of the life of one of our greatest leaders, Mama Albertina Sisulu.
Such an unconquered character of selflessness brings to life the values of the Freedom Charter values that propose that the greater value of life cannot be self-interest and exploitation, but rather to be part of an inclusive and prosperous society. It is my understanding that, as representatives of our people, we seek to serve with the intention of bettering ourselves as individuals, as households, as communities and as a nation, just as Mama Sisulu did. Today, as we interact as a nation, we proudly acknowledge that we cannot be separated from the life of Mama Nontsikelelo Albertina Sisulu, as we cannot from an essential document such as the Freedom Charter. We cannot be detached from Mama Sisulu due to the selflessness that she exhibited, as we cannot be detached from the Freedom Charter because it prophesised this very day when it said, "The people shall govern!"
The people who govern today are primarily represented by Parliament. As we move towards the national democratic society, we, as representatives of the people, have committed our efforts to advancing the accessibility of government to ordinary South Africans.
As we strive towards an equal and fully developed state, we, as the Parliament that speaks for the masses, must commit ourselves to transparency and accountability. The policies that we pass and the oversight we have over government are in fact the means by which we would realise the dream of Mama Sisulu and the forecast of the Freedom Charter.
Since its inception, the ANC has valued the power of inclusiveness; hence policies passed by the ANC have, since 1994, not been the decisions of a few, but rather the will of the people who entrusted us with empowering all institutions with the means to bring about meaningful change. Xa ndiza kuthetha ngomsebenzi wePalamente, ndicela uxolo kumsebenzi ococayo. Ndizive sendifuna ukuzenza umsebenzi ococayo ngenxa yezinto ezithethwa ngabantu basekhohlo. Ohloniphekileyo u-Mulder, xa esithi ayikho into elungileyo eqhubekayo apha ePalamente, ndifuna ukumxelela ukuba kusenokuba ayisoze ibekho, ingakumbi kukho aba bantu angabafuniyo apha ePalamente. Kodwa mhla kwabakho abantu abafunayo apha ePalamente, kumhla aza kuqala ukubona ukuba iPalamente iyasebenza. Ngelishwa Bawo u-Mulder, siza kuhlala sikhona sisisininzi se-ANC apha ePalamente, kuba sithi abantu abayilwelayo inkululeko eMzantsi Afrika. [Kwaqhwatywa.]
Okokuqala nokwesibini, ndicela ukubulela iPalamente ngeenkqubo ezenzileyo, ebezikade zingekho ngaphambili.
Eyokuqala, yintsebenziswano yabantu ePalamente kunye nabantu ekuhlaleni. Kaloku mhlalingaphambili, ndikhumbula ndisengumntwana wesikolo, asizange simbone thina uMongameli oza ebantwini, besiqala ukumbona ngalo we-ANC ohamba phakathi kwabantu.
Yenye yeenkqubo zokuqala ethe iPalamente xa yayifika ngonyaka ka-1999, yabona ukuba imithetho emayenziwe mayibe yimithetho evunywe ngabantu, kuba kaloku ngaphambili umthetho wawukade uqulunqwa ngaphandle kwesininzi; wakube ugqityiwe kukakazwe abantu kuthiwe baza kuwulandela bethanda bengathandi.
Ngelishwa iDA nayo ithe ngexesha besixakekile sisebenzisana nabantu ekuhlaleni, yabona ukuba mayisuse iintliziyo zabantu ezaphukileyo ezenziwa zimbono nemisebenzi eyenzakayo kubo ngaphambili, bengabantu boMzantsi Afrika.
Umsebenzi wokuqala endizakuthetha ngawo ngowokuba iPalamente ikwazile ukuzisa izinto eziza kuthi zibe luncedo kuluntu lwethu.
Okokuqala, iPalamente ibonile ukuba imfundo kunye nezempilo zezona zinto zibalulekileyo, ekufuneka kuboniswane ngazo ngabantu ekuhlaleni. Ndithetha nje, abantu ekuhlaleni bayakwazi nabo ukuba kuthiwe bahleli kwizitulo zasePalamente, nto leyo abangazange bayifumane. [Kwaqhwatywa.]
Kukho iinkqubo ezenziwa yiPalamente ezingqamene namakhosikazi nabantwana. Umzekelo ngumhla we-9 kwinyanga ka-Agasti apho amakhosikazi athi akwazi ukuba yinxalenye yePalamente ukuze axhamle nawo kuba kaloku akazange axhamla ngaphambili, abonisane nangemithetho eyenziwayo ePalamente. (Translation of isiXhosa paragraphs follows.)
[When I start talking about Parliament's work, I want to apologise to the cleaners. I feel like being one of them just because of the things that were said by that opposition party. When hon Mulder says there is nothing good happening in this Parliament, I want to tell him that perhaps nothing good will happen while there are the people he does not want here in Parliament. However, if one day the people he prefers are here, that will be the day he notices that Parliament is working. Unfortunately, hon Mulder, we are here to stay and we are an ANC majority in Parliament, because we are the ones who fought for freedom in South Africa. [Applause.]
Firstly, I want to thank Parliament for the new programmes which it introduced, as these were not available before.
The first one is the good working relationship between the people who are here in Parliament and the community. Chairperson, I remember the days when I was still a learner; we had never seen a President who visited people. The first time we saw a President taking time to interact with the people was when the ANC President did so.
It is one of the first programmes that Parliament introduced in 1999. It recognised that the laws it passed had to be agreed to by the people, because in the past the laws had been passed without the will of the majority of the people, and thereafter they enforced them, expecting people to abide by them, whether they liked it or not.
Unfortunately, the DA also took advantage of the people. While we were working hand in hand with the communities, they misled the people of South Africa, whose hearts had been broken as a result of being ill-treated by the previous regime.
The first function I want to speak about is that Parliament succeeded in making resources available so that our people could benefit from them.
Firstly, Parliament realised that education and health are the most important issues which the communities need to be involved in. As I speak, communities out there have experienced sitting on the seats of Parliament and participating - something which has never happened before. [Applause.]
There are programmes launched by Parliament which deal with women and children. For example, on 9 August women are able to take part in the proceedings of Parliament so that they can also enjoy the benefits, because they have not benefited in the past, and they can also discuss the passing of Bills in Parliament.]
The expression that "South Africa belongs to all who live in it, black and white," embodies the historical principle which has characterised the policy of the ANC towards the people who have settled in the country in past centuries.
Xa ndithetha ngalo mba ke ndithetha ngomba ohlaba entliziyweni kuba sibonile ngexesha besisiya kunyulo. Siyayibulela iPalamente thina singabantu balapha ePalamente, ngomsebenzi ewenzileyo wokuya ebantwini. Ukanti nabo ekuhlaleni, ndiqinisekile ukuba bathetha le nto ndiyithethayo.
Umsebenzi wesibini owenziwe yiPalamente, ongabonwayo namhlanje ngulowo wokulandela uMqulu wamaLungelo oLuntu owaqulunqwa ngootata uSisulu, ootata uMandela, kodwa isahleli kwaye isasebenzisa imiqondiso yoMqulu wamaLungelo oLuntu. Ukuba uqabane u-Mulder- kodwa akanakuba lilo iqabane tu - akayiboni loo nto thina bantu baseMzantsi Afrika siyayibona. [Kwaqhwatywa.]
Ndinento ebuhlungu ebendithembise ukuba andisayi kuyithetha, kodwa ke, ndicela ukuba khe ndithi gqaba gqaba kuyo. Akhonto indikhathaze ngexesha bekusenziwa intengiso, apho bekusetyenziswa abantu bethu ukuba bathethe izinto ezingekhoyo. Bona bebecinga ukuba benza into elungileyo kuba bebethenjisiwe ngabo bebebasebenzisa ukuba baza kulithatha ilizwe babakhele izindlu. Asoze nilithathe ilizwe. YiPalamente le ebiphethe ilizwe eza kwakhela abantu izindlu.
Kukho intengiso yomama onokuba ngumama wam ngomso oqhathiweyo. Ibuhlungu into yokuba kudlalwe ngabantu. Umama athi, "Thina sonke apha sithe nco entliziyweni". Elam lithi le ntliziyo iqala ukuthi nco ityaliwe yeyango- 1994 kuba intliziyo eyaqala ukubetha ngo-1932, eyintanga yekamama wam, inamanxeba. Ngoko ke le ka-1994 ixelelwe ukuba mayithini. Siyacela ukuba ningadlali ngabantu bethu. Bayekeni ukuba bavotele umbutho abafuna ukuwuvotela. Bayabazi abantu ababakhululayo.
Thina asiyazi kwaye asiyifundiswanga into ebithethwa apha namhlanje ethi abamhlophe ngamasela. Asiyifundiswanga loo nto kulo rhulumente kuba sinabantu abalwileyo, abamhlophe nabamnyama, besilwa bengabahlali baseMzantsi Afrika. Ngoko ke, asazi, mhlawumbi kufuneka bafune abaphandi ukuze babacacisele ukuba le nto ithini.
Ndinento endithi xa ndigqibela ngayo, ndibongoze abaPhathiswa bethu nooSekela baPhathiswa noSomlomo, Somlomo ndikuvile imisebenzi oza kuyenza, kodwa akhonto endihlupha nje ngokuba sithi singala makhosikazi kanti kwii- ofisi zethu asinazo nezipili zokuba sizilungise. Siyacela ke Somlomo ukuba usincede ngezipili kuba sifuna ukuzibuka. Sinyulwe ngabantu ngoko akufuneki ukuba sibamele sibabi. Siyacela ukuba usifakele izipili ezi-ofisini zethu. Enkosi. [Kwaqhwatywa.] (Translation of isiXhosa paragraphs follows.)
[When I talk about this issue, I am talking about a very painful issue, because we saw what happened while we were preparing for the elections. We, the people of Parliament, thank Parliament for the work it has done - reaching out to the people. Even the communities, I am sure, agree with me.
The second function which has been handled by Parliament and which is not noticeable today, is the one of adhering to the Bill of Rights, which was compiled by Mr Walter Sisulu and Mr Nelson Mandela. Even today, we still refer to the Bill of Rights. If Comrade Mulder - but he can never be a comrade - does not see that, we, the people of South Africa, see it. [Applause.]
I have a heartbreaking issue which I promised I would never talk about. However, I want to talk about it briefly. There is nothing that breaks my heart as much as the advertisement in which our people were used to advertise lies. They thought they were doing the right thing because they were promised by those who used them that they would win the elections and thereafter rule the country, and they would build houses for them. They will never rule this country. It is Parliament that has the power to rule the country and which, in turn, will build houses for the people.
There is an advertisement in which a woman who could be my mother was misled. It is painful when people are made fools of. The woman says, "All of us here are happy. Our hearts are content." Mine is - this happy heart was transplanted after the 1994 elections. A heart which started beating in 1932, which is the same age as my mother, is wounded. Therefore, the one transplanted after 1994 has been told how to feel. We appeal to you not to fool our people. Leave them alone so that they are free to vote for the parties of their choice. They know the people who liberated them.
We don't know about and we have not been taught what has been said here today, that white people are thieves. We have not been taught that in this government, because we have people who have struggled with us, white and black, fighting as the citizens of South Africa. Perhaps they must get researchers to investigate so as to get the full explanation of this issue.
In conclusion, I appeal to our hon Ministers, Deputy Ministers and the Speaker. Speaker, I have heard what you plan to do, but there is one thing that makes me unhappy as a woman. We do not have mirrors in our offices to look at ourselves and, being the women that we are, we request you, Speaker, to supply us with mirrors, because we want to look at ourselves. People have elected us, so we must not represent them looking unpresentable. We request mirrors in our offices. Thank you. [Applause.]]
Madam Chairperson, firstly, on behalf of the MF, I applaud the hon Speaker and the hon Deputy Speaker for the professional manner in which they play their leadership role, adding true value to the working environment in Parliament. In addition, the MF would like to express its sincere appreciation to all parliamentary office bearers and the entire support staff for their unselfish commitment and dedication.
The MF is indeed proud of the standing and portfolio committees. They perform their work without fear or favour. However, there are exceptions.
The oversight functions are quite good. We draw attention, however, to the fact that performance indicators must be measurable and that the high vacancy rate in Programme 2 is of great concern in the strengthening Parliament's oversight role.
I take note of what the hon President mentioned in his Presidency speech, that the media must report in a fair and equitable manner what Parliament does, and not give slanted news. So, it is very important that Parliament also has a committee that has oversight over the media. Certain countries do have that.
We strongly believe that somebody from Parliament should visit the constituency offices of the various political parties just on a sample basis to see how things are, how parties are performing on the ground between parliamentarians, and how parliamentarians are performing with their various communities.
As legislators, it is also incumbent upon us to deal with legislation objectively and independently, to raise the level of expectation of this House, and to deliver to the broad suffering masses as we continue to protect their interests by ensuring that independence and the separation of powers are not compromised. There has never been such great hype among citizens about how Parliament functions. The MF calls for more outreach programmes in all provinces.
As public representatives, let us be reminded that we have been elevated by our constituencies and that we must not be visible only during elections, but serve all, all the time and all the way.
I cherish the hope that all hon members of this House can one day look back and say that together we all built a great Parliament.
The MF undoubtedly supports the Budget Vote. Thank you.
Chairperson, Speaker, and hon members, my input in this debate will focus on the responsibilities of Parliament, which include oversight and accountability, parliamentary committees, and ICT development.
The primary function of Parliament is indeed to make laws and also to see how effective these laws are in improving the lives of our people, whilst also exercising effective oversight over the executive and maintaining the link with citizens in our work.
The Oversight and Accountability Model that the hon Davidson referred to was adopted by the National Assembly in February 2009 and by the National Council of Provinces in March 2009. This marked a key milestone in moving towards a coherent and strategic approach for members to do their work with.
We are pleased to announce that immediately after the sitting of the House we will see the official launch of the Oversight and Accountability Model. I need to acknowledge the valuable contributions made by my predecessors, the hon Nathi Nhleko, the hon Setona from the NCOP, the hon Geoff Doidge, the hon Deputy Minister Andries Nel and the hon Deputy Minister Obed Bapela. There should be special mention and acknowledgement given to the Deputy Secretary to Parliament, Mr Michael Coetzee, who guided the process.
The model seeks to improve existing tools of parliamentary oversight and to enhance the capacity of Parliament to discharge its oversight and accountability functions effectively. It consists of values and principles by which Parliament conducts oversight and the resources required for the task. It is our collective responsibility, as all Members of Parliament, to make the document a living instrument to sharpen oversight so as to give expression to the vision of an activist Parliament.
This will inevitably require an evaluation of existing structures in the administration and a realignment of key functions. Key to this initiative will be the establishment of an oversight and accountability section and the building of capacity to achieve the efficient tracking and monitoring of resolutions of the House. The work on the Oversight and Accountability Model has produced critical work that is already contributing to the enhancement of the functioning of Parliament. The implementation has taken place through a number of different streams within the institution. However, further co-ordination and synergy is necessary to achieve its optimal output.
The following has already been achieved. Today will see the launch of the manual for parliamentary committees, which should be a useful tool for both chairpersons of committees and members, and which seeks to guide members in carrying out activities in committees.
We have also seen the implementation of the Financial Management of Parliament Act, which was signed into law in 2009. It is critical for all chairpersons of committees, as well as Members of Parliament, to be knowledgeable about this Act, as it impacts on how different budgets in Parliament and committee budgets are being managed.
We are also moving towards the Money Bills Amendment Procedure and Related Matters Act and the implementation of the budget office, which has been referred to. As the Speaker indicated earlier, we are now at the point where a technical team has delivered the report, and we are busy processing the report to see what type of budget office is required for our purpose here in Parliament. The different experiences we have had on the oversight visits to countries abroad indicate that there is no "one size fits all" situation, and we need to apply our minds to it to see that we achieve the objective that has been set for the establishment of a budget office.
Key to the implementation of the Money Bills Amendment Procedure and Related Matters Act is the fact that all committees, and not only the Standing Committees on Appropriations and on Finance and the Standing Committee on Public Accounts, Scopa, are tasked with overseeing the financial matters of the different departments. It is the responsibility of all of us. [Applause.]
Today we will also see the audit of statutes, work that has been done over a number of years, so that we can have a consolidated set of statutes that is there for members to reflect on. The report on the legislative process has also been delivered to Parliament, and further training for Members of Parliament will take place.
The legislation-making process is closely linked to the development of the public participation model. Very often during the public participation process we can see that it is those in society that have the financial means to travel to Cape Town, or are located in the vicinity of Parliament, who readily get access to the different committees where laws are being made. This issue needs to be addressed, and we call on the political steering committee, comprised of members from different political parties, which has been tasked with this issue, to take it into cognisance when the final model is being developed.
We are also seeing the establishment of the Office on Institutions Supporting Democracy, which will play a vital role in enhancing the relationship between Chapter 9 and 10 institutions and the portfolio committees of Parliament.
The implementation plan for the outstanding elements of the Oversight and Accountability Model has been developed and will be signed off soon.
In respect of the national projects that have been identified, we have identified the need for Parliament to develop its own approach to overseeing the Millennium Development Goal, MDG, processes and also related processes around climate change. It is important for Parliament not be reliant on the executive to come up with a model first and then respond thereto. Parliament has the responsibility to take the lead to see that these important programmes are implemented, so that we can improve the lives of our people.
Climate change is not only an environmental problem, but also a challenge with clear economic and social consequences, which hinders the path to sustainable human development, justice, equality and combating poverty. Parliament plays a critical role in any national effort to tackle climate change. In this respect, the concept paper for a parliamentary approach to climate change focuses on advocacy and awareness programmes in Parliament, parliamentary villages and also the parliamentary constituency offices of Members of Parliament.
The activities associated with the Climate Change Conference, which will take place in Durban later this year, have been articulated by the Speaker. The political steering committee, of which the hon Greyling is part, has been established to drive the Conference of the Parties, COP 17, processes, and it has the responsibility to report back to that forum first. By no means is it a project that will be successful if we leave it to be claimed by one Member of Parliament only. It is the responsibility of all Members of Parliament to realise the objectives of these programmes. Technical teams from the Parliamentary Services have been tasked with the responsibility of providing logistical and administrative support to ensure the success of the programmes, whilst it is led by the politicians.
In respect of the MGDs, all committees related to MDGs have been requested to develop programmes towards assessing the work done by departments and to report to Parliament by the end of this month. A parallel process will be taking place in all the provinces. This process is being managed by my colleague in the NCOP, the hon Tau.
In addition, we have made the activities of the Multiparty Women's Caucus operational and will work closely with them to assist them to execute their mandate. They will do important work to assess, from a gender perspective, what progress has been made on the MGDs. In conjunction with the United Nations Development Programme, they will have a workshop next week to refine the approach that they intend following. An interlegislature workshop is planned for mid-August to consider the outcomes of this project.
This will be in preparation for a consultative seminar on MDGs, involving all stakeholders, which will take place here in Parliament during September. The objective is to oversee the attainment of these goals set for the country, but more importantly, and critically, to ensure that the quality of life of our people is improved across the country. This objective is further to create more awareness and to enhance co-operative governance and accountability across the legislative sphere, so as to ensure that Members of Parliament are adequately equipped to deal with MDGs at international forums.
I want to turn my attention now to the functionality of the portfolio committees. The budget for portfolio committees has seen a 12% increase, from R44 million to R51 million, for this financial year. The budget allocation takes into consideration priority committees, or apex committees, as well as the Portfolio Committee on Water and Environmental Affairs, which is busy processing the Green Paper on Climate Change.
Currently we have 51 parliamentary committees. This includes 30 portfolio committees, two standing committees and two ad hoc committees in the National Assembly, as well as four joint committees between the NA and NCOP and 13 select committees in the NCOP. Furthermore, we also see the possible establishment of another committee on the Minister in the Presidency, the hon Chabane, who deals with performance monitoring and evaluation, as well as a joint committee on HIV/Aids that will be considered soon.
In total, there are only 39 venues in which committees can meet in Parliament. A total of 33 of them are committee rooms, whilst 6 are ordinary boardrooms. The size differs from committee room to committee room, and there is no set standard in respect of the numbers that can be accommodated. Of these, three venues are fully equipped for video conferencing. It is thus possible for committees to interact with any stakeholder, including members of the executive, anywhere in the country or the world. This facility potentially has massive cost-saving benefits for Parliament, and persons, or entities, and officials who must attend committee meetings in Cape Town can be interacted with through this medium.
Committees face a number of challenges. Apart from the very limited time set aside for committees to meet, we have seen an increase in the number of portfolio committees that meet on Fridays. However, we encourage more portfolio committees to do so. Also, resources are made available for the different portfolio committees, if they wish to meet after plenary sittings.
In discussion with the Programming Whips, an expanded parliamentary programme framework up to the end of March 2012 has been developed. This will be submitted to the Joint Programming Committee later this week. Once adopted, a full calendar will be available, giving Members of Parliament, committees and the executive the ability to plan ahead. We will then start the process of developing a full parliamentary programme for the 2012-13 financial year.
The limited number of venues within Parliament poses a big challenge. As indicated, there are not enough venues to accommodate all the committees. Often committees seek permission to meet in venues outside Parliament. Such meetings can cost up to R50 000 per day, using resources that could have been put to better use. Meetings in venues outside have also had a negative impact on the operations of committees, as these venues tend not to be equipped adequately to meet the needs of committees.
With regard to the size of portfolio and standing committees, we are aware that a proposal has been placed before the NA Rules Committee to reduce the size of committees from 14 to 12 members. This will ensure that we have a greater number of Members of Parliament who are able to dedicate their time to specific focus areas.
While some committees are doing a sterling job in regard to record-keeping and the adoption of minutes and reports, others still take too long to adopt such reports. This practice can expose Parliament, in that credible information will not be available when challenges arise. We are developing an approach with ICT to put mechanisms in place to address this matter.
The restructuring of the committee section is essential to ensure that quality support and output is provided to committees. The role of the administration of Parliament is to support Members of Parliament in the carrying out of their mandates and political responsibilities. It is anticipated that the appointment of researchers and content advisers will be finalised by the end of this financial year. The legal support capacity in Parliament is also inadequate, and we need to expand this capability if we want to provide quality support to the different committees. [Applause.]
Parliament has developed very good relations with the Office of the Auditor- General, and our continued interaction with his office contributes to enhancing oversight functions. A general report on the implementation of the Local Government Municipal Finance Management Act and service delivery audits by the Auditor-General is due to be released at the end of this month. We will work together on the outcomes of the report of the Ad Hoc Committee on Co-ordinated Oversight of Service Delivery, based on its oversight work which was done during 2009 and 2010. In collaboration with the Office of the Auditor-General and the Development Bank of Southern Africa, Parliament will hold a workshop for chairpersons of committees and members of the committees on local government, co-operative governance and traditional affairs, both in the NA and NCOP, as well as in the provinces, with the aim of further developing a co-ordinated approach towards improving service delivery in local government.
Recently, and over the past few years, Parliament has faced a number of challenges - both in court and in the media - when parliamentary portfolio committees are closed to the public. In order to ensure transparency and accountability in committee meetings, the current rules on the closure of meetings need to be reviewed. In the interim, the practice has been developed that committees seek permission from the Office of the Speaker in advance before they have closed meetings, explaining specific reasons why these meetings must be closed.
In respect of the approval of study tours, which that was also mentioned by the hon Greyling, I can confidently say that the turnaround time for assessing applications from portfolio committees to conduct local and international study tours takes approximately 48 hours. In instances where information is lacking, it is returned to the relevant chairpersons and the committee section to provide the necessary information.
In regard to ICT, Parliament is a key role-player in collaborative ICT- related and knowledge-management initiatives such as the Africa Parliamentary Knowledge Network and the Global Centre for ICT in Parliaments. The Global Centre for ICT in Parliaments is an initiative of the United Nations Department of Economic and Social Affairs, with the Inter-Parliamentary Union, IPU. The Parliamentary ICT Strategy for 2009 to 2014 identifies a transition from e-Parliament to e-democracy. It advocates the increased use of the broadcast media and Internet services to extend the reach of Parliament to its citizens. It also emphasises Bill-tracking mechanisms, monitoring and tracking of House resolutions, improvement of budget performance and improvement of document management systems.
The strategic objective of the ICT strategy is aligned with that of Parliament, and will focus on strengthening oversight, increasing public participation, improving and widening international co-operation and participation, strengthening co-operative government, and continuing to build an effective and efficient institution.
The ICT focus group politically oversees the implementation of the ICT strategy. Earlier this year, the membership of the focus group was reviewed to give more members an opportunity to understand and be involved in the benefits of ICT development in Parliament.
A workshop of the focus group was held on 6 June 2011 and highlighted the following. The focus group indicated the need for a critical role to be played by Members of Parliament in driving the ICT strategy and seeing to it that it is integrated into the strategic business of Parliament. Members of Parliament also need to be more receptive to the innovations that are brought about by the strategy. It is important for contributions that are made to the reviewing of the strategy to see to it that it speaks to the needs of the Members of Parliament. The current ICT policy must be aligned to the need of the members to carry out their constitutional obligations and oversight responsibilities.
Another welcome development is that an increasing number of Members of Parliament - in fact, the majority of Members of Parliament - can be followed on social networking sites such as Facebook and Twitter. However, members themselves are responsible to see to it that they handle this media in a very professional way, because unintended consequences are possible, if you don't deal with it correctly in this electronic age! [Laughter.] With the click of a button, all information is spread throughout the world!
Key developments in the implementation of this strategy include the following: As part of the ICT strategy, an upgrade was undertaken and Parliament now boasts a secure high availability and high performance network; the infrastructure backbone has been completed for an ICT multicentre which will host a media asset management system to support a dedicated 24-hour parliamentary channel; and the implementation of the enhanced video-broadcast infrastructure will ensure that democratic processes are accessible, well known and reach all citizens of the country.
In conclusion, Members of Parliament occupy a pivotal position in ensuring that the laws and budgets that we pass in this House impact positively on the lives of all our people. Working together with our people, we can do more to ensure that the fruit of our democracy and liberation is enjoyed by all our people. I thank you. [Applause.]
Deputy Speaker, having listened to the hon Skosana, the House Chairperson for Internal Arrangements, one would be forgiven for thinking that all is well in the forum which caters for members' facilities. Nothing could be further from the truth.
The Quarterly Consultative Forum, QCF, was set up to co-ordinate this function. But since its formation in 2004, the exact powers and authority of the QCF have yet to be defined. The truth is that it has no powers. It is purely consultative and therefore it is of little surprise that it is limping along, achieving very little and frustrating members.
The progress is so slow that some seven years later a task team was set up - two months ago - to define the powers and authority of the QCF to make decisions, and to examine the structural relations between itself and the Chief Whips' Forum, Parliamentary Oversight Authority, information and communication technology, focus groups and other related stakeholders. This task team has yet to meet, and in the meantime we wait.
One of the consequences of the lack of decision-making powers in the QCF is that members' interests are being met on a piecemeal and crisis management basis. The hon Frolick was quite upbeat and optimistic about our moving to an e-Parliament and an e-economy. Speaker, the IT equipment classified as essential tools of trade has become obsolete since its issue in April 2009. Members are expected to use this equipment for the full five-year term. The QCF has received presentations and we have made recommendations, to no avail. Speaker and hon Frolick, how do you expect members to keep abreast of the global village without up-to-date technology?
The Speakers' Forum sponsors the Public Administration Leadership and Management Academy. The aim is to equip MPs with leadership and management skills. Regrettably, poor leadership of this committee has resulted in opportunities not being taken up by many MPs.
A meeting of this committee was called and scheduled to start at 12h00 on Tuesday, 14 June. The chair arrived at 13h00 with an apology that he was in another meeting. We rushed through the agenda in half an hour and achieved nothing. It is my considered opinion that if leadership is not serious about its commitments, then projects will not succeed.
Deputy Speaker, a pilot project to set up parliamentary democracy offices was initiated in three provinces in 2007. The aim was to expand access and opportunity between rural communities and Parliament. To date, despite repeated requests by the Chief Whips' Forum, an assessment report in respect of the efficacy of these parliamentary democracy offices, PDOs, is yet to be completed. Speaker, surely four years is too long for a pilot project. We have the right to know who is using the PDOs and how the budget is being utilised.
The Parliament of South Africa is the host country of the Pan- African Parliament and has yet to fulfil its agreement to build a new parliament. The building of this new parliament did commence, but was halted because of an environmental impact study which said that the building was in danger of sinking. Besides the wasteful expenditure, we have reneged on our agreement and, Speaker, it clearly our responsibility as the host country to sort out the legal issues before we end up being embarrassed. Thank you. [Applause.]
Madam Deputy Speaker, hon Speaker and hon members, I'd like really to go back to basics and look at the Constitution and what it says about what Parliament should be doing. The most important section is section 42(3) which reads:
The National Assembly is elected to represent the people and to ensure government by the people under the Constitution. It does this by choosing the President, by providing a national forum for public consideration of issues, by passing legislation and by scrutinising and overseeing executive action.
There are two other sections, the first being section 57 (1)(b) which reads:
The National Assembly may -
(b) make rules and orders concerning its business, with due regard to representative and participatory democracy, accountability, transparency and public involvement.
The third section I'd like to read is section 57(2)(b) which provides that:
The rules and orders of the National Assembly must provide for -
b) the participation in the proceedings of the Assembly and its committees of minority parties represented in the Assembly, in a manner consistent with democracy; These are the three fundamental sections of the Constitution which define what we do here. In terms of these sections we have a proportional representation electoral system. This means effectively that the amount of support the party receives from the electorate is directly translated into seats in the National Assembly.
This contrasts with a first-past-the-post constituency system, as in Britain, where the support in the House does not reflect the overall electoral support. So in Britain, in the last election last year, the Conservative Party got 36,1% of the vote but 47,1% of the seats in the House. The Labour Party got 29% of the vote but 39,7% of the seats and the Liberal Democrats got 23% of the vote but only 8,8% of the seats.
In South Africa, as I said earlier, it is different. The votes you get from the electorate translate directly into seats in the House. The ANC received 65,9% of the votes in the 2009 election and thus has 66% of the seats in the House. Similarly, the DA received 16,6% of the votes and have 16,75% of the seats. We must note that this is less than a quarter of the seats in the house.
Unfortunately this fact often tends to get missed by some commentators and sections of the media. It's unfortunate, when one reads media reports on the activities of Parliament, for example the budget debates or debates on a Bill, that the media focus on what the Minister said, and then on the opposition. The ANC speakers who spend time on preparing speeches generally get ignored, yet these people represent 66% of the electorate. As the President remarked during the reply to the Presidency Budget Vote debate last week, the Cape Times headline reporting on the debate reads, "MPs launch attack on Zuma". However, it was only some of the opposition MPs, and the combined opposition is only 36% of this House.
Similarly, when one says, as the hon Mulder does, that we are failing the people, which people is the hon Mulder talking about? The Freedom Front Plus got 0,83% of the votes in the 2009 election. [Applause.] Are those the people that you are referring to?
Similarly, when one listens to Mr Ellis and his desire for opposition days - that is 36% of the House if you take the whole opposition - it is quite clear the opposition is not united because it's only the DA that is opposing the parliamentary Budget Vote. Most of the other parties have indicated they support the vote. So we must we have an opposition day for 16% of the members? [Interjections.]
There is a constitutional requirement for public consultation that I read earlier from the Constitution. All Bills have to be tabled to be advertised for public comment and, if there is public interest in the Bill, public hearings must be held. Laws are struck down if this is not done. This is a requirement, that Members of Parliament must consult the public. We must listen and consider the inputs. However, we cannot lose sight of the fact that we have an electoral mandate to pass legislation. We have been given that power by the electorate and every five years we have to go back to them, and we must exercise that power.
We have to listen, but we don't necessarily have to agree with the representations and implement them. This is the fact that often gets forgotten by people who have resources, who feel that they are right and the electorate is wrong and they are able to lobby effectively. They then want Parliament to follow the interests of a few, rather than the electorate and the mandate that put us here. [Applause.]
With regard to the participation of minority parties, these are well represented, in spite of the litany of lamentations that come here. They are well represented in the running of the affairs of Parliament.
There is the Chief Whips' Forum and the Programming Committee, which Mr Davidson hardly ever, if it all, attends. The Rules provide for the Chief Whip of the Opposition to be a member of that forum. This is an opportunity, Mr Davidson, to make the programme more exciting, but you are not making use of it. Look at the Rules, Mr Davidson. The Chief Whip of the largest opposition party is a member of the Programming Committee. You may have interpreted the Rules your own way to suit yourself. If you participated then maybe you could give us this better programme that you are talking about. [Applause.] The point I'm really making is that the structures are there, but unfortunately the opportunity is not taken, but that is their right.
I'd like to read a quotation that I was given. Can you listen to this quotation? I have edited it slightly. It reads:
The government in many instances neither replies to questions nor gives direct answers. Sometimes the opposition has trouble getting straight answers. It further puts pressure on democratic mechanisms in the legislature by unilaterally removing interpellations from the agenda without giving any reasons.
That's the quotation. You may agree with it. As I said, I've edited it slightly. It's a quotation from Mr Pierre Uys, the Chief Whip of the Opposition, the ANC opposition, in the Western Cape legislature. The quotation actually reads:
The DA-led government in many instances neither replies to questions nor gives direct answers. Sometimes the opposition has trouble getting straight answers. It further puts pressure on democratic mechanisms in the provincial legislature by unilaterally removing interpellations from the agenda without giving any reasons.
What I'm saying is that it's quite ironic, because the issues you are complaining about here with the ANC-led national government, the ANC is complaining about in the provincial legislature.
In the local government elections we heard you trying to tell us how good the DA were at governance, but look at the way you are running your Western Cape legislature. Here is another quote from the ANC in the provincial legislature:
The DA is continuing on its hellbent way to close down the democratic space for debate and oversight in this parliament.
This was a response to a ruling by the provincial Speaker, when an ANC member was absent, for his or her question not to stand over. Sittings of the House also had to be cancelled because of a dispute that the legislature had with Hansard. It works both ways.
An issue that I also want to respond to is the complaint from some of the speakers about the debates on national days. They said they didn't like debates on national days. Again, which people put us here? The people of this country have national days and they want us to debate them. In the minority parties you might have an interest in other issues, being debated, but I think you also have to accept that there is majority and there is a mandate.
Basically, what I'm saying, and the main point I want to make, is that we should respect the electorate, the mandate of whom we have. We may feel that we know more than the electorate do, we may feel that they should have voted differently, and we may wish, in fact, that they had voted differently and given a different mandate, but that is the mandate they gave us and that is the reality of democracy, and we have to respect it. I thank you. [Applause.]
Deputy Speaker and hon members, at the outset I wish to thank you all for your inputs, and also for the spirit in which the debate was conducted.
I have taken careful note of the concerns raised and wish to assure you that consideration will be given to the challenges which you have raised, as well as the solutions you have proposed. There are, of course, a few matters to which I would like to respond.
Firstly, I am in agreement with the Chief Whip of the Majority Party when he calls for adequate resources, as well as dedicated support, for the Chief Whips' Forum. I have already indicated that to him in our conversations - it was some time ago - but I reiterate it here, now. I believe that the role of the forum, as a multiparty body responsible for the co-ordination of matters for which the Chief Whips are responsible, should be supported. I would, however, like to call for closer working relationships between the Whips of the NA and those of the NCOP, in line with the multiparty Joint Whips' Forum envisaged in the governance of Parliament.
The Chief Whip of the Majority Party also touched on the issue of an oversight committee over the Presidency. I am aware that the matter of the establishment of a parliamentary oversight committee over the Presidency has been and remains on the agenda of the Chief Whips' Forum. I know that the parties submitted their proposals and it is for the Chief Whips' Forum to debate the matter. If parties reach consensus on the establishment of such a committee, the matter can be brought to the Rules Committee for decision. As the Speaker, I cannot be called upon to decide on matters that are before the Chief Whips' Forum, or the multiparty forum, or to consider a matter if I am told it is under discussion.
It is correct that the Joint Rules Committee made the decision in 2009 to defer the matter until there was an understanding of the mandate and functioning of the two Ministries in the Presidency. The intention was to consider whether there was a need for an oversight structure to be established to oversee the new Ministries because of their roles in the implementation of policy and government administration. After the deliberations on the Green Paper on the two Ministries, Parliament obtained understanding on their mandates, functions and expected outputs.
It therefore follows that a process had to be started to determine the oversight structure needed for the two Ministries and to prepare recommendations for the Joint Rules Committee. The placing of the matter before the Chief Whips' Forum for the establishment of a multiparty task team to consider the establishment of an oversight structure was a correct parliamentary process and needs to be followed through.
Mr Davidson raised concerns around the space utilisation project and the appointment of certain service providers. I would like to note that the appointment of MMA Architects was done by the Department of Public Works and not by Parliament. The Department of Public Works paid for their services to design a concept for this project. This firm was appointed in line with due processes within the Department of Public Works.
Parliament conducted a feasibility study which included analysis, option analysis and readiness analysis, in line with the requirements for a megaproject of this nature. This was presented to the Department of Public Works and to the Parliamentary Oversight Authority, POA, in October 2007. This is the same meeting where Mr Davidson was present and the above documents were discussed - so I am told; I was not there at the time.
It is for the Department of Public Works in conjunction with National Treasury to now convert this concept into technical drawings to obtain the necessary approval and funding for this project, as well as to implement it. Discussions at the level of the executive authority with the relevant Ministers are ongoing.
I would like to assure both Mr Davidson and Mr Ellis that the Parliamentary Oversight Authority has met a minimum of four times a year, but more often when pressing matters arose. This is in line with the mandate of the POA to meet at least once a quarter. This has been the case since the inception of the Parliamentary Oversight Authority.
I also take note of the concerns expressed by hon Van der Merwe and hon Ellis that the Joint and National Assembly Rules Committees meet infrequently. This, of course, is a matter of concern to me as well, and I undertake to address this matter urgently.
The Financial Management Act of Parliament requires the establishment of an oversight mechanism that must maintain oversight over the financial management of Parliament. Representation on the oversight mechanism excludes the Speaker and the Chairperson as the executive authority, and also the Deputy Speaker and Deputy Chairperson. The oversight mechanism established by the parliamentary governance model in 2006 is the Parliamentary Oversight Authority, which is chaired by the Speaker of the NA and Chairperson of the NCOP. The question is whether the POA, as it currently operates, needs to be amended. I am sure we can continue that discussion - not right now, as I'm just raising the issues for further discussion.
Furthermore, in accordance with the FMPA, the executive authority, which consists of the Speaker and the Chairperson, are appointed by their respective Houses, and remain accountable to them for the sound financial management of the institution.
In respect of the matters raised by the hon Greyling ...
Madam Deputy Speaker, I rise on a point of order: The hon Speaker's time has expired. [Laughter.]
No, it hasn't.
Well, I thoroughly enjoyed saying that, anyway. [Laughter.]
Could we have order, please? Please continue, hon Speaker.
Hon Deputy Speaker, I would urge you to ignore frivolous comments and remarks. [Laughter.]
Let me repeat what I said before I was rudely interrupted.
In respect of the matter raised by hon Greyling, it should be noted that members can ask questions regarding Parliament through the relevant structures that you as members have created. I would encourage hon Greyling to familiarise himself with the Parliamentary Oversight Authority, the Quarterly Consultative Forum, the Chief Whips' Forum and various other Rules committees.
As I indicated in my opening statement, Parliament continues to address the capacity of support services to committees. As and when funds become available, committees will be provided with more research and content capacity. However, we have experienced difficulty in attracting the necessary skills in order to fully capacitate all the committees. This is a work in progress, and we have said before that we want to make sure that the committees are fully capacitated and that they function optimally. We are also working to ensure that there is clearly defined and focused support to committees to enable members to improve on the work of Parliament.
With regard to research capacity, currently one researcher is allocated to each committee except where vacancies exist, and in some instances where there are two researchers supporting a committee. As reported earlier, in Japan each committee is supported by at least 14 officials. This impresses us a lot, and we hope to emulate this. We may not be able to achieve this right away, but we will continue to work to ensure that committees and members have the required adequate support. [Applause.]
The library, which is part of the knowledge management support environment, has been given permission to embark on a project to upgrade the systems in the library to full digitisation. Our library must also move towards ensuring that we can access their services and materials from computers away from Parliament and outside working hours. [Applause.]
In last year's Budget Vote debate I indicated that the process of establishing a budget office might seem to be slower than necessary. However, it is important to remind hon members that the presiding officers decided that it would be advisable to consult with other parliaments that have established budget offices, to ensure that we benchmark it with the best model out there.
As reported earlier, two study tours took place last year, and our findings were shared with members in two workshops. The task team is in the process of finalising a model best suited to our circumstances and this model will soon be presented for adoption by Parliament. Once we adopt a model, we can then appoint a director for the budget office.
The establishment of the budget office is a priority for Parliament. Members must, however, be mindful of the fact that this remains a relatively complex undertaking that we must get right from the outset.
With regard to the implementation of the Money Bills Amendment Procedure and Related Matters Act, various provisions of the Act have been implemented since promulgation, including the establishment of Standing Committees on Finance and on Appropriations in both the NA and the NCOP. Parliamentary rules and procedures have been reviewed and developed, and the parliamentary programme has been adjusted to accommodate changes brought about by the legislation. Training has been provided to members and it is ongoing to ensure that all of us have a common understanding of this important piece of legislation.
In regard to debates, I know that a number of speakers have highlighted the need for a more vibrant, responsive and proactive Parliament. A number of suggestions were also made on how to bring this about, including the reintroduction of interpellations and party motions. I also believe that we should create more flexibility in the parliamentary programme to allow us to debate and respond to issues of national interest and concerns as they occur. In so doing, we will ensure that the voice of all our people is heard when it matters most.
I would also like to concur with Dr Mulder that Parliament, as a separate arm of state, must take its rightful place at the forefront of ensuring oversight accountability. We are, of course, in support of constitutional parity between the executive, the legislature and the judiciary. Oversight, however, is an ever-evolving process and we must constantly be looking at new tools and mechanisms to improve our oversight role.
I sympathise with the point made by Dr Mulder, that sometimes these speeches and debates are very boring. You can imagine, Dr Mulder, when somebody participating in a debate feels it is boring, how we must feel when we sit and preside, and have to listen to it for hours on end, but that is another debate! [Laughter.]
I would also like to agree with hon Kganyago about the allocation of speaking times to smaller parties. I have said before that it is clearly impossible to say what you want to say in one or two minutes. That clearly needs to be reviewed. I have said this before, and again, it's on the table of the Chief Whips. They are the ones who determine the speaking time; it is not the Speaker who determines speaking time. Of course, we then need to encourage the Chief Whips to look at it, and look at it urgently.
Hon Kalyan mentioned the fact that the equipment is outdated. Certainly, if it is, then something has to be done about it.
Then there is the issue of building a new parliament it is not the task of this Parliament to build a new parliament for the Pan-African Parliament for the Pan-African Parliament. That is really not our responsibility and we will not do it. [Applause.] It is the responsibility of the executive, the government. They are here by invitation of the government and they have signed an agreement with the Department of International Relations and Co- operation, and certainly not with Parliament. We support the parliament, but we ourselves do not supporting the building of parliamentary structures.
Hon Matladi, I think, mentioned a number of very interesting points. One of them is the absence of a CFO. Then there is the lack of capacity in the internal audit unit, and the irregular expenditure of R6 million. I would really urge the hon member, if she has this information, to please come and give it to me in my office immediately after the sitting. I will be more than willing to listen to you and take action. Sadly, I do not have the information that you probably have, so, if you don't mind, please share your information with me, and I will then take it up.
Another issue that has been raised is capacity for committees and MPs. I have touched on this and the hon Chairperson has also touched on the issue of capacitating MPs. Again, I want to state that we are working to ensure that there is clearly defined and focused support for members so that they can improve their work and in turn improve the work of Parliament.
Again, with regard to research capacity, there is currently, as I have said before, only one researcher per committee, but we are working to improve that.
There is another issue that has not been raised in this sitting ...
Please conclude, hon Speaker - your time has been shortened.
Aha!
I didn't hear you, hon Deputy Speaker. [Laughter.] In conclusion ... [Laughter.] Hon Ellis, I am going to remain in Parliament long after you have gone ...
[Inaudible.]
... and I would certainly encourage you to try to talk to your Whip so that he can allow you to remain in Parliament, because, the way he keeps on looking at you, it looks like your days in this Parliament are numbered! I thank you. [Laughter.] [Applause.]
Debate concluded.