Mr Theo Willem Coetzee

Yes, it's a fact. [Laughter.] Take Mdluli as an example, man.

We are not doing it, Mr Minister! We are not doing it! Notwithstanding the fact that the Minister announced in October 2009 that the restructuring of the intelligence service would ...

I continue:

Both Mdluli and Lazarus were suspended from crime intelligence in 2011 after allegations of fraud and corruption linked to the secret fund.

[Interjections.] The Minister of State Security ...