Chairperson, hon members, ladies and gentleman, comrades and friends, may I firstly apologise for the Minister not being here. She's busy with a debate in the other House; we thought it would dovetail, but it hasn't.
Hon members, I feel privileged to introduce this debate, particularly at this time of the year when we stand on the eve of the commencement of the annual 16 Days of Activism for No Violence Against Women and Children. This campaign, generating as it does an increased awareness of the negative impact of violence against women and children, can this year be enriched by celebrating this House's willingness and commitment to addressing the plight of women, children and other vulnerable groups who are so often the victims of sexual atrocities when it approves this Criminal Law (Sexual Offences and Related Matters) Amendment Bill.
As indicated in the long title, the preamble and the clause setting out the objects of the proposed legislation, the Bill aims to review and amend the existing body of law relating to sexual offences comprehensively and extensively. The aim is to have a single statute, dealing with all aspects relating to this important and sensitive area of the law and its implementation. Obviously, members realise that having everything in one Bill from now on is going to help the police, the prosecutors, the courts, as well as the victims.
Time simply does not allow me to say all I would like to. I have consequently decided to focus on some aspects which I consider to be ground- breaking, particularly those areas which have been hailed as victories in our commitment to achieving gender equality and to protecting vulnerable groups, most notably women, children and persons who are mentally disabled, from the scourge of sexual violence in its many manifestations.
Before dealing with some of these ground-breaking issues contained in the Bill, I would like to share an observation that has been made, namely that for the first time in South African legal history, we will have codified a substantial portion of our criminal law into a single statute. The approval of this Bill by the National Council of Provinces today will indeed be a historic event. Chapters 2, 3 and 4 of the Bill contain many examples of how the shortcomings in our common law dealing with sexual offences have been addressed in the Bill, with a view to bringing them into line with our constitutional dispensation and ensuring that we have as many quick and successful prosecutions as possible, with the least secondary trauma for the victims concerned. For example, the present common-law offence of rape is gender-specific. Only a male can commit the offence and the victim can only be a female. Clause 3 addresses these shortcomings to the extent that it will now be possible for a man to be raped by another man, for a woman to be raped by another woman and for a man to be raped by a woman. [Interjections.] Please, don't sound so enthusiastic on the last one. [Laughter.]
This major departure from what the law is currently is to be welcomed. Persons who commit horrific acts of sexual penetration, which at the moment do not qualify as rape will, if convicted in terms of the proposed new offence, be justifiably stigmatised as rapists for the rest of their lives. The extension of the common-law definition of rape necessitated revisiting the common-law crime of indecent assault, eventually leading to the creation of a new statutory crime, namely sexual assault, which covers nonpenetrative sexual acts, committed unlawfully and intentionally as contemplated in clause 5 of the Bill.
The destructive nature of crime and especially the barbaric mentality of some criminals can never be underestimated. In many instances it is not enough for criminals to commit rape and, as a result thereof, to devastate the lives of innocent victims. They go further and sometimes force a loved one of the victim to watch the rape taking place. Clause 8 of the Bill, therefore, among other things, prohibits any person from compelling another person to witness a sexual offence being committed in his or her presence.
Two chapters of the Bill have been devoted exclusively to victims of sexual offences who are particularly vulnerable, and those two groups are children and persons with mental disabilities. While the Bill singles out these vulnerable groups, I trust that our courts and the prosecuting authority will leave no stone unturned to ensure that persons who commit sexual offences against other vulnerable victims, such as the elderly and the physically disabled, also get their just deserts.
There are four new crimes in Chapter 3, dealing with child victims, which deserve particular mention. The first of these four is the crime of the sexual exploitation of children. In terms of clause 17, a person who purchases or, on behalf of a child, sells the sexual services of a child, is guilty of the offence of sexual exploitation of a child. This clause aims to criminalise the actions of clients and other players who are involved in the exploitation of children, for instance pimps. A person who engages the sexual services of a child for reward and then goes on to commit a sexual act with that child, can also be charged, prosecuted and convicted of a further offence, for example, rape or statutory rape, in addition to sexual exploitation. I welcome this extra protection afforded to children.
The second crime deals with the sexual grooming of a child. This is something entirely new in our law. It is specifically aimed at providing additional protection to children against an ever-increasing threat. Our children are increasingly becoming exposed to the risk of persons who, through their own devious methods, systematically prepare or soften children in order to eventually satisfy their deviant sexual needs.
With the age of electronic communication in full swing it has become even more important to protect our children from the very real dangers that lurk behind apparently innocent communication tools, such as cellular phones and the Internet. Clause 18, firstly, aims to draw a distinction between persons who promote or facilitate the grooming of a child and those who actively groom children. Here we are talking about people who use pornography, people who use books and comics and who try to entice children to look at these things and, in that way, make them used to sex and so on until the suggestion comes, "Well, why don't you try it yourself?" That is what we are talking about here.
The sexual grooming here is by people that use the Internet, for example the chatrooms, and then talk to the children and organise meetings with them. Do you remember a little while back with the cellphones? There was that special, and they found that a whole lot of paedophiles had been part of that. That is what we are talking about here: using the Internet, cellphones, comic strips and those types of things to try to soften children and make them used to sex, make them used to thinking about it and discussing it and not to make it as if it is something. And when they start getting used to it, then they of course seduce these children and do what they want to them. That is what we are talking about with the grooming of children.
The last two crimes deal with pornography, that is the display or exposure of pornography and more particularly pornography to children and using children in any manner whatsoever for the creation of child pornography. We have criminalised both: if you use children for pornography or you give it to them or distribute it to them. Chapter 4 of the Bill, focusing on victims who are persons with mental disabilities, to a large extent mirrors all the crimes that we have created for children. Obviously, persons with disabilities are a special category of people that are totally and utterly helpless, usually, when it comes to defending themselves and we have created a special chapter on people with disabilities to protect them as well.
In debates of this nature one tends to concentrate on the substantive provisions contained in the Bill. I would, however, like to draw attention to some provisions in the schedule to the Bill. These seemingly less important or incidental provisions should not be overlooked and my view is exactly what the Minister said here earlier, about important and unimportant Bills.
There are three provisions, almost hidden at the back of the Bill, which I support wholeheartedly and which will go a long way in reducing the secondary trauma victims of sexual offences so often have to experience. Firstly, I welcome the overhaul of section 227 of the Criminal Procedure Act of 1977, which is intended to set out the circumstances when evidence relating to the previous sexual history of a complainant is deemed to be relevant. I welcome the criteria which a court must take into account before it can admit such evidence, for instance, whether such evidence is in the interests of justice, with due regard to the accused person's right to a fair trial and whether the evidence is in the interests of society in encouraging the reporting of sexual offences.
The amendments proposed in sections 158 and 170A of the same Act will also assist complainants, the former dealing with the giving of evidence by means of closed-circuit television - and we want most children to be able to give evidence with a closed-circuit television - and the latter dealing with the appointment of intermediaries through which complainants can testify. These amendments require a court to provide reasons for refusing an application to invoke the protection envisaged by the two mechanisms in question in cases in which the complainant is particularly young and vulnerable, namely under 14 years.
I am also heartened by the provisions of clause 60 that, once and for all, abolish the cautionary rule in sexual offences, which is another victory for gender equality. You may not know this, but judges, when listening to the evidence of a complainant in a case of sexual offence, say: "I take particular caution in looking at the evidence of this witness as she is a woman and there is the possibility that she may have fabricated it." That is a horrible legacy that we have retained in our law. No other witness has to deal with that. When you as a man give evidence against someone, they don't say, "You are a man and you are involved in this sexual offence and you may just be lying" and so on.
That cautionary rule is being completely abolished in our law with this legislation. This clause confirms the decision of the Supreme Court of Appeal in S v Jackson 1998. The evidence of complainants in sexual offences cases was, prior to the Jackson case, treated with caution merely because of the nature of the offence. The Supreme Court of Appeal, in the Jackson case, abolished the rule and stated that, in sexual assault cases, the rule is based - ``... on an irrational and outdated perception. It unjustly stereotypes complainants in sexual assault cases - overwhelmingly women - as particularly unreliable."
The repeal of the common-law rule was confirmed in the cases of S v M 1999 and S v M 2000. However, this approach was not followed in S v Van der Ross. Therefore we have now introduced into law clause 60, which eliminates any doubt as to what the law should apply in this regard.
I mentioned earlier that the time available to us simply does not allow me to speak on all the contents of this Bill. I would also like to briefly highlight the importance of Chapters 5 and 6 of the Bill. Chapter 5 of the Bill, among other things, provides that victims of sexual offences are entitled to be provided with post-exposure prophylactics at state expense at public health establishments designated by the Minister of Health on condition that they report the offence within 72 hours of its commission and obviously receive the treatment within the 72 hours. Secondly, we are also allowing that someone can apply to a court for an order directing that an alleged offender be tested for HIV, with the view to having the test results made available to the victim so that the victim can make personal lifestyle decisions.
It needs to be stressed that the provisions contained in Chapter 5, dealing with the compulsory HIV testing of alleged sex offenders, should not be interpreted as detracting from the importance of a victim determining his or her own HIV status, notwithstanding the outcome of the HIV testing, and receiving the necessary medical advice and treatment after the commission of a sexual offence against him or her. It is just a further mechanism we are creating to try to create peace of mind for a person, whether the person needs to take special precautions because the person who raped her was HIV-positive or not.
Chapter 6 of the Bill, dealing with the creation of a national register of sex offenders, reflects the government's resolve to promote the safety and security of certain vulnerable groups by prohibiting certain sex offenders from being placed in positions of employment, authority, supervision or care of children or persons with mental disabilities. That is what this does. It allows you to check on someone you are employing or who is supervising your children. You can get hold of this office and find out whether this person has previous convictions of sexual offences, so it's that kind of protection. I commenced my speech by referring to the 16 Days of Activism Campaign. I would like to conclude on the same topic, again with reference to the Bill. One of the key messages of this year's campaign is that government, in creating an extensive policy and legislative framework that deals with crime, sends a strong message to offenders that violent abuse will not be tolerated. The enactment of this Bill will, among other things, enhance government's resolve to address the abuse of women and children by criminalising the various manifestations of sexual violence and abuse. I hope that this Bill, when it becomes law soon, will be applied with vigour by all role-players.
The portion of the Bill to which this is particularly relevant is Part 3 of Chapter 7, dealing with the adoption of a national policy framework. The Minister for Justice and Constitutional Development must, in terms of the said Part 3, liaise with her colleagues the Minister of Safety and Security, the Minister of Correctional Services, the Minister of Social Development and the Minister of Health, as well as the National Director of Public Prosecutions with the view to adopting a national policy framework relating to all matters dealing with the Act in order to try to create uniformity, consistency and enhanced delivery.
An intersectoral committee, consisting of the directors-general of all the departments and the NDPP is envisaged, which will play a major role in this regard. I see this committee and the national policy framework contributing towards making a success of translating the envisaged line function responsibilities of all role-players into reality. The development of this Bill has spanned the administration of three Ministries.
Hon members are aware that this Bill started with the SA Law Commission and has been here for a long time, and we have to thank the many individuals who have worked tirelessly to get this very important matter to the stage where we are now at. Their efforts are appreciated.
I would also like to take a moment to thank members of the select committee who have shown their commitment to ensuring that the end product comprehensively and extensively reviews and amends all aspects of laws relating to sexual offences. I commend the committee for doing just that, under the able leadership of its chairperson, the hon Kgoshi Mokoena. Your efforts and hard work have not gone unnoticed.
I also wish to express my appreciation to the many interested parties who unselfishly shared their knowledge, expertise and experiences by submitting their comments during the investigative stage and the parliamentary process. I venture to say that this Bill has been the subject of what one could almost regard as unprecedented consultation. I thank everyone so much; please support the Bill. Thank you. [Applause.]
Chairperson and colleagues, Deputy Minister, as the hon Tau said, my life has been made easy by the Deputy Minister, because he outlined the purpose of the Bill, its objectives, all its clauses and what it aims to achieve. When one thinks that our children, sisters, mothers and even men are being sexually molested by the heartless, unsympathetic criminals that rapists are, then this Bill is like sweet music to our ears. I want to touch on a few issues, with your permission, Chairperson.
It might sound very strange, colleagues, but it is true that there are people who are forced to rape other people. The question is: Who must be held responsible for that action? This Bill provides for a person who is compelled to rape someone to be turned into a state witness. However, there must be proof that one had been compelled to do so.
One other scenario is that there are people who are compelled to masturbate. From now onwards, if someone forces you or compels you to masturbate, it is an offence and this person will be sentenced and dealt with severely.
One clause that had caused some discomfort for the committee is the clause that deals with flashing. Because of some religious or cultural practices, the committee effected some changes to accommodate this. As a committee at this Parliament, we thought that we should avoid passing legislation that would easily be defied by our own people, hence those amendments.
Child pornography and those things were touched on and well-explained by the Deputy Minister - I'm not going to touch on them again. One other clause that was amended relates to bestiality. We fully agree with the contents in this clause, except where it outlaws masturbating an animal. That's where the committee made some changes, because of the submissions that were made by some farmers, especially those who are involved with animal breeding. We made some changes there to accommodate them because they said one masturbates an animal to check if it can deliver. I trust you understand what I mean when I say "it can deliver", because I don't want to be explicit.
The sexual grooming aspect was well-explained by the Deputy Minister. The committee had some concerns around what people might term "interfering with some practices". We even gave the examples of some senior people in the country, but I'm not going into those details now. The committee effected some changes to accommodate those concerns, but those were not major changes. They were just made to make it clear to people who might not understand the exact message the committee wanted to convey to the public. I'm glad to say that the committee went further - went the extra mile - by consulting even our political heads in this regard, and we seem to be speaking the same language. This Bill provides that all rapists will be compelled to undergo HIV tests, as the Deputy Minister put it, "bethanda bengathandi" [whether they like it or not]. We want to make sure that should our daughters, our sisters and our mothers be subjected to this unsympathetic and satanic act, they are able to get treatment as quickly as they can.
To all of you rapists, please note that from now onwards, your names will be registered, and we are going to publish you. Shame on you!
We want to appeal to all our judicial officers to show no mercy when dealing with these kinds of offences. Let me leave those issues to my colleagues on the committee.
Before my time is up, I want to thank the officials in these departments. With your permission, Chairperson, I want to name them: Mr Du Preez, who I call Hank, Ms Clark and Dr Louw. These are the officials who were patient and prepared to take the committee through all the clauses. At times they had to revisit the same clauses over and over again, but they were willing and dedicated in their dealings with us. These are the people you can call true South Africans - people who are ready to serve this country with passion. Deputy Minister, if I had my way, I would promote those three, because they deserve it.
Colleagues, hon members, I thank you because of what you have done for this committee, particularly during the past three months of this session. I'll express my gratitude fully on Thursday. Because of time constraints today, I won't be able to do it, but you deserve to be thanked. I appeal to this House to vote for this Bill, with those minor amendments. Thank you.
Chairperson, hon members, the law is not there to oppress the people, but to protect them and ensure their survival in conditions that humanity deserves. This is precisely why extensive consultations with stakeholders have to take place - to ensure that our people's views, aspirations, interests and concerns are taken into account, hence the far- reaching consultations that were conducted before the presentation of this Bill to the committee.
The extent of the severity of the punitive measures with which the offences are visited must, though humane, always reflect and mirror and be commensurate with the graveness and callousness of the violation and how society frowns upon it.
The Criminal Law (Sexual Offences and Related Matters) Amendment Bill comes in response to the escalation of brutal sexual offences committed mainly, but not exclusively, against vulnerable and often defenceless women and children in circumstances associated with barbaric societies.
There is a history to this Bill. The ANC has long noted the increasing incidents of sexual abuse and violence in our society and the negative impact of such abuse and violence on the vulnerable groups - women and children. Having noted this, our democratic movement resolved to ensure that South Africa moves towards classifying violence against women and children, first and foremost, as a social problem and not as a legal problem, and to implement and concretise international and national instruments that deal with violence against women and children.
Moreover, our movement also resolved to ensure that our democratic government shifts emphasis in the criminal justice system to a more victim- oriented approach. It also resolved to ensure that it improves co-operation in respect of matters relating to violence against women and children in our society.
In giving effect to the above resolution of the ANC in 1996, our democratic government mandated the SA Law Reform Commission to investigate sexual offences by and against children. However, it was thereafter realised that both our common and statutory laws do not deal adequately and effectively with sexual offences.
As a result, the initial mandate of the SA Law Commission was extended to include sexual offences against adults and the formulation of nonlegislative recommendations with regard to the reform of the criminal justice system. This meant legislative reform that would fundamentally change the processes currently employed by the criminal justice system to deal with the crimes relating to sexual abuse and violence.
In view of the fact that sexual violence against women and girls is a problem of extraordinary proportions in South Africa, including virtually unprecedented incidents of child rape, the Bill essentially introduces mechanisms and measures that seek to enable our criminal justice system to give full effect to the protection of the women and children who are vulnerable to the escalating incidence of sexual violence.
In particular, this Bill seeks to provide for medical treatment of certain victims of sexual abuse and violence, as well as for related medical or health services. More importantly, this Bill also creates specific mechanisms and procedures for compulsory HIV testing of the alleged sexual offenders.
Furthermore, the Criminal Law (Sexual Offences and Related Matters) Amendment Bill seeks to eliminate discriminatory differentiation that is drawn between the age of consent for boys and girls in respect of consensual sexual acts with children. In essence, the Criminal Law (Sexual Offences and Related Matters) Amendment Bill reviews and amends comprehensively and extensively the laws relating to sexual offences in South Africa.
One provision of this Bill is for the repeal of certain common-law sexual offences. The Bill also enacts comprehensive provisions that deal with the creation of new categories of sexual offences that are aimed at addressing the vulnerability of women, children and mentally disabled persons in respect of sexual abuse and exploitation.
More importantly, the Bill entitles a victim who has been exposed to the risk of HIV infection as a result of a sexual offence against him or her, to receive, at state expense, post-exposure prophylactic treatment at a public health institution designated by the Minister of Health.
In terms of this Bill, such victim is entitled to free medical advice on the administering of such treatment and to be supplied with a list of public health institutions that provide these services.
The ANC deems it desirable that this honourable House pass this Bill for the protection of the weak and the infirm, that is the vulnerable groups - women and children. Thank you. [Applause.]
Chairperson, hon Deputy Minister and hon members, the Criminal Law (Sexual Offences and Related Matters) Amendment Bill was first introduced in Parliament in August 2003. Its adoption today, therefore, comes more than four years later. This is an inordinate amount of time to guide a Bill through Parliament, but when one considers the fundamental changes the Bill makes to our body of law and the extensive and multiple phases of public consultation it went through, it is perhaps understandable in this particular case that less haste is less waste.
For decades a very large gap existed in our law dealing with offences of a sexual nature. This lacuna meant that the criminal offence of rape applied only to the rape of a woman by a man, as our hon Deputy Minister stated earlier. This Bill finally closes the gap by expanding the definition of rape to include all forms of sexual penetration without consent, irrespective of gender. The IFP welcomes this fundamental change to our statutory law.
The IFP also welcomes the repeal of the common-law offence of indecent assault and its replacement with the statutory offence of sexual assault, and the fact that new statutory offences are created for certain compelled sexual acts.
We are especially grateful for the creation of the national register for sex offenders in terms of the Bill. This register will contain the particulars of persons who have been convicted of sexual offences against children, and this is very good. The register will fill another gap in our law, namely the listing of sex offenders, thereby prohibiting them from committing a range of offences against children. Hopefully this will result, in practice, in more protection against the abuse of children.
In conclusion, I want to highlight the need for the Department of Justice and Constitutional Development to launch a project that is aimed at the promotion and facilitation of training on the legislation and its implications. This is a vital issue. All too often Parliament passes legislation that looks good on paper. However, these laws are sometimes either almost unimplementable or are so difficult to implement and understand that their objectives are never realised or are only partially realised.
This Bill provides South Africa, for the first time, with a single, comprehensive piece of legislation dealing with sexual offences. The IFP will support the Bill. I thank you. [Applause.]
Voorsitter, agb Adjunkminister en kollegas, vir die afgelope vier jaar word daar al hard gewerk aan hierdie wetgewing en as ons kyk na die seksuele geweld teen vroue en veral teen kinders is dit hoog tyd dat ons baie streng wetgewing kry en die DA ondersteun met graagte hierdie wetgewing. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)
[Mr J W LE ROUX: Chairperson, hon Deputy Minister and colleagues, for the past four years there has been a lot of hard work on this legislation, and if we look at sexual violence against women and particularly against children, it is high time that we have stringent legislation and the DA gladly supports this legislation.]
I do not want to repeat what our Deputy Minister said, but I think that I would just like to say that the object of the Bill is to introduce measures which seek to enable the relevant organs of state to combat and eradicate the high levels of sexual offences committed in South Africa. The Bill aims to review and amend all aspects of the law relating to sexual offences in a single statute.
Voorsitter, wat egter baie onrusbarend was, is dat sommige ANC-lede van die komitee, klousule 28, wat handel oor verpligte HIV-toetsing na verkragting, wou verander. [Chairperson, what is, however, extremely worrying, is that there are some ANC members of the committee who wanted to change clause 28, which deals with compulsory HIV testing after rape.]
The argument was that we will infringe on the rights of the alleged perpetrators if the court forces immediate HIV testing. A legal adviser for the chairperson even suggested that it would be unconstitutional to enforce immediate testing. These members of the committee disregarded the rights of the rape victims to timeously know the HIV status of the alleged perpetrators.
The rights of a victim in a case of rape are fundamental and must be protected. How else can a victim make informed choices as far as medication is concerned? Fortunately, after intensive debate, this clause was not amended. There was also major debate on sexual grooming of children, clauses 18 and 22, and on flashing. The drafters were forced to amend clause 56 in order to satisfy members that cultural rights would be protected. Only future interpretations by judges will test these clauses which relate to cultural practices. I would like to quote the clause and I would be very interested to know what our Deputy Minister thinks of this:
A person may not be convicted of an offence in terms of section 9 clause 22 ...
... or 18(1)(c) ...
... if that person commits such an act in compliance with, and in the interest of, a legitimate cultural practice.
I think only time will tell whether these clauses will really stand the test of time.
It is fair to say that after many years of debating and drafting we will have an Act that can and will protect the victims of sexual abuse. What we need now is to vigorously enforce this Act. I thank you.
Chairperson, hon Deputy Minister, and hon members, the lack of a constant and co-ordinated approach in the implementation of service delivery to victims of sexual offences is a concern as there is failure in instances to provide effective protection to the survivors of sexual offences.
Criminal justice agencies tend to be ineffective and insensitive in the handling of cases. The Commission on Gender Equality for 2006 reported the delays in court processes to finalise cases. Also, it pointed out the lack of state support for survivors dealing with trauma.
The lack of an effective legislative framework to deal with sexual offences came to the fore. Taking cognisance of these findings, reports and observations enable one to understand the dissatisfactory circumstances South Africans have had to endure in our liberated country.
Are these victims of such circumstances liberated? They are definitely not. When rape victims of the age of 14 are called aside by state prosecutors to determine their own fate in their cases, do we really protect them? When a woman is so-called mistaken for a man and placed in a cell with men and raped the whole night, is that protection by us? Yet again, the culprit gets away with it.
No, we cannot continue like this in this country. Hence, the ID is looking forward to seeing these circumstances addressed and changed in future by these amendments. The ID supports the Bill. I thank you.
House Chair, hon Deputy Minister, hon members, comrades, friends and guests ...
Agb Le Roux, ek dink nie die ANC-lede is so gekant teen wat u genoem het nie. Ek dink ons moet objektief wees wanneer ons kyk na die woord "vermeende" en wanneer ons 'n beskuldigde het. Ek wil u terugneem na die Rawsonville-geval in die Wes-Kaap waar 'n dame 'n klag teen 'n blanke boer gel het. Die boere was in opstand, want hulle het ges die vrou is omgekoop en sy was onder die invloed. Ek dink dis met dit in ons agterkoppe dat ons ANC-lede ges het ons moet versigtig wees.
Geen mens is skuldig voor hy nie skuldig bevind is nie en as ons op daardie gebied beweeg, moet ons versigtig wees. Hierdie is 'n baie sensitiewe saak. Iemand kan beskuldig word van verkragting en wat doen jy agterna as die man regtig nie skuldig is nie? So, ons moet objektief kyk. Dit beteken nie dat ons s verkragting is goed nie. Daarom ondersteun die ANC hierdie wetsontwerp en ons wil h dit moet deurgevoer word juis omdat ons bekommerd is en ons jare geneem het om dit daar te bring.
As ek u 'n paar jaar terugvoer na toe ek nog 'n klein klonkie was, was daar baie dinge wat aangegaan het. My ma het my vertel wat gebeur het en nie eens gerapporteer is nie, want ons was nog skrikkerig om na 'n polisiestasie te gaan. Jy het nie die goed gerapporteer nie. Ek wil u verder terugvoer en vir u s my moeder het my vertel van die apartheidsjare toe die verkragting van 'n swart- of 'n kleurlingvrou deur 'n blanke nie so 'n erge sonde was as wanneer 'n kleurling of 'n swarte 'n blanke verkrag het nie. Die stories is daar tussen ons mense en dit het gebeur, so ons moet versigtig wees. Ons moenie hierdie goed vergeet nie. Daarom wil ek 'n stukkie in Engels aanhaal. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)
[Hon Le Roux, I don't think the ANC members are that opposed to what you referred to. I think we need to be objective when we look at the word "alleged" and when we have an accused. I want to take you back to the Rawsonville case in the Western Cape where a lady laid a charge against a white farmer. The farmers were in an uproar because they said that the woman had been bribed and that she had been under the influence. I think it is with that at the back of our minds as ANC members that we said we should be cautious.
No person is guilty until he has been found guilty, and if we move on that terrain, we need to be careful. This is a very sensitive matter. Someone can be accused of rape, but what does one do afterwards if the man really was not guilty? So, we have to look objectively. That does not mean that we say rape is good. Therefore the ANC supports this Bill and we want it to be promulgated precisely because we are worried about it and it has taken us years to get it here.
If I take you back a few years to when I was still a little lad, there were many things happening. My mother told me what happened and what was not even reported, because we were scared to go to the police station. You did not report things. I want to take you back further and tell you what my mother told me about the apartheid years when the rape of a black or coloured woman by a white was not as great a sin as when a coloured or a black raped a white. The stories are there among our people and it happened, so we have to be careful. We should not forget these things. Therefore I want to quote something in English.]
It is horrifying as it is. Sexual violence against children is not a new phenomenon, nor is it peculiar to South Africa. Historical evidence has been found of childhood molestation, including incest, among the ancient Greeks and the Romans in the Renaissance accounts and during the Victorian period. - So, dit vind jy in alle rasse; alle kleure; alle mense; alle nasies. Ons moet dit verhoed as ons die nasie wil bou. Jy vind dit in stede en op plase en die Wes-Kaap het hierdie jaar 'n vreeslike jaar in terme van verkragtings beleef. Ons het Rawsonville gehad. Ons het Oudtshoorn gehad. In my eie kiesafdeling in Leeu-Gamka, die Prins Albert-munisipaliteit, het 'n boer 'n meisie verkrag.
U sien, dit kom weer terug na die vertrouensverhouding en dit is miskien een ding, Adjunkminister, waarna ons moet kyk. Ons gaan die nasionale register van verkragters h, maar onder die hele ding van "grooming" kan dit onderwysers wees - mense wat in 'n vertrouensverhouding tot ons kinders staan. Hulle name gaan nie op daardie register wees nie. Jy hoor van onderwysers. Hierdie was 'n boer. Dit was 'n blanke, maar tot die blankes in die Prins Albert-munisipaliteit het dit verafsku. Ons s vir hulle dankie, so dit is nie 'n ding van ras nie. Dit is mense in vertrouensverhoudings wat ons kinders gewoond maak en dan so "groom". Hoe help ons - hoe voorsien ons dit? Dit is ons almal se plig.
Die ander ding wat ook opvallend is, is die verantwoordelikheid van ons as ouers oor ons eie kinders. In die onderwysstelsel het ons nou 'n wet dat ouers daarvoor moet sorg dat hul kinders in die skool is. Hoe koppel ons dit aan ouers se verantwoordelikheid en toesig oor hulle kinders wanneer dit by seksuele teistering en dies meer kom? Baie dankie. [Tyd verstreke.] (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)
[So, you find that in all races; all people; all nations. We have to prevent it if we want to build this nation. You find it in cities and on farms, and the Western Cape has experienced a terrible year this year in terms of rapes. We had Rawsonville. We had Oudtshoorn. In my own constituency in Leeu-Gamka, the Prince Albert municipality, a farmer raped a girl.
You see, it comes back to the relationship of trust and that is perhaps one thing, Deputy Minister, we should look at. We are going to have a national register of rapists, but under this whole thing of "grooming" it could be teachers - people who have a relationship of trust with our children. Their names are not going to be on the register. You hear about teachers. This was a farmer. It was a white, but the whites in the Prince Albert municipality found it heinous. We say thank you to them, so it is not a case of race. These are people in a relationship of trust who groom our children and make them used to things. How do we help - how do we foresee it? It is a task for all of us.
The other thing which is also noticeable is the responsibility we as parents have for our own children. In the education system we now have an Act that says parents should ensure that their children are at school. How do we link it to the parents' responsibility and care of their children when it comes to sexual harassment and such things? Thank you. [Time expired.]]
Chair, can I just thank everyone for two things: Firstly, for supporting the Bill. I think it is wonderful that we can send out a uniform message from this Parliament that we, all the parties in this Parliament, passed this piece of legislation and that we want people to be as strict as possible in the implementation. So, I think it is wonderful for all the parties that we have done that and I want to thank you very much.
Secondly, I want to thank you for the spirit of the debate. I think it was a very good debate and it was done with the correct seriousness. There is just one thing that hurt me. Kgoshi Mokoena does not hurt me very easily, but he hurt me really badly today. He is happy to support promotions and salary increases for the staff that work under me, but he is not prepared to propose that the Minister and I get a salary increase. [Laughter.] I am devastated that he is not prepared to support something like that.
I think we must start talking openly and strongly about this problem. If you look at statistics in this country, they are terrible; when grown men start molesting children and babies - there are men in this country who have molested babies; when grown men are forcing kids to watch how they rape other people's mothers and sisters; and in Staggie's case which took place a few years ago, when he forced one of his lieutenants to rape someone in his presence.
The National Prosecuting Authority, the NPA, did a whole audit two or three years ago. That audit showed us that more than 50% of rapes in this country are of girls under the age of 16. What are we doing to our children - the generation of girls and boys? You saw the front page of the Sunday Times. There are things about that article that worry me, but I am not going to nit-pick about some of the things in the article. The mere fact that research can be done to indicate that things which are on that front page are happening is a travesty. As a South African and one that represents our people, I am embarrassed by our country when I read these things about it. We have to take this seriously.
We now have this legislation passed at last. This legislation gives Parliament the tools to play a role from now on. This Bill gives you tools when you go to your constituencies or when you do oversight work in Parliament because it says, for the first time, that you must create a national policy - we all want to be part of it and we want to see it - and that there must be committees crosscutting departments that report regularly on what is happening. So, you have a vital role to play to make sure that reports come to you and that you watch what is in this Bill. When you are in your constituencies, check that this Bill is being implemented. We have to do that.
We have given freedom to our country. But it cannot be free when our women and kids, in particular, do not know whether they can go to their own homes and their uncles, brothers or cousins won't rape them. This is a terrible thing. It is our duty to set aside politics on this issue and fight together, because this Parliament now has the tools with this piece of legislation and we have to use them.
On the issue of constitutionality, I have no doubt that everything in this Bill is constitutional. Of course, people are going to express their own opinions on it. If law advisers want to do that, it is fine. We are not going to pass a piece of legislation as important as this one and have it knocked down as being unconstitutional. We are quite sure of that.
Let me just say what my approach is and what the Minister's approach is to a piece of legislation like this. When it comes to protecting the vulnerable, children and women, I will personally argue and push the boundaries of constitutionality as far as I can.
I am prepared to personally give evidence before any court on why we want this law to be part of our existing laws - even if it infringes on some person who has been accused of rape - because it can give someone the peace of mind that the person who is alleged to have committed raped should undertake a test within 90 days, and not two years later. Their rights should be invaded to that extent that a woman can be sure whether that person has HIV/Aids or not - so that she can live. She has to have a sexual life as well. She has a life to live in the meantime as an adult. We must be in a position to push the boundaries of laws as far as we can.
In this case of HIV testing, I do not think we have pushed the boundaries at all. Even if we did, I would strongly protect this matter and am personally prepared to give evidence on this matter.
I think we must understand the register clearly. We are not creating a name- and-shame register. We want to create an effective register that will protect people. All the names of people who have molested children will go into the register, and over time it will become more effective - especially if you want to employ someone. So, it will be applicable to teachers. From now on, if the Department of Education wants to employ a teacher, they will have to consult the register to determine whether this person has ever committed a sexual offence.
So, we have created an obligation in the Bill that all people who work with children in crches and amusement parks - all those people who will be in charge of children - must have licences before they are employed. As an employer, you have a duty in this legislation to check if that person is on the list or not. It is clearly going to help, over time, as the list becomes more effective. This will create space for employers to screen people before they employ someone who is a known paedophile, such as the case we had in Knysna, etc.
Something that has not been mentioned, and I just want to mention it, is that for the first time in the history of this country this Bill creates provision for the crime of trafficking. We have not mentioned that. The Law Commission, at the moment, is looking at trafficking across the board - all kinds of trafficking of children. What we have at least done in this Bill is that if there is any kind of trafficking for sexual purposes, then this Bill deals with it and outlaws it in the meantime while we are waiting for the bigger piece of legislation to come. So, we must be clear that we are also doing that at the moment through this legislation.
Lastly, I want to say again that you have a major role to play. Most of this Bill, as you have passed it now, will come into operation on 16 December of this year - on Reconciliation Day. I think this is a wonderful thing we have done for our people, because on Reconciliation Day most aspects of this Bill dealing with offences will kick in. Chapter 5 will kick in in March and Chapter 6 will kick in in June as we need to draft regulations for those two chapters. For the rest of the Bill, the crimes that we have made provisions for and all the things that we have done in this legislation will be law from 16 December. From that moment on, we all need to play a big role in trying to turn this horrible abuse against women and children in our society around. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Debate concluded.
Can I ask the hon members not to leave because we are supposed to vote on this Bill as it is a section 75 Bill. Hon Le Roux, can I ask you to take your seat. You will leave after we have finalised the vote.
Bill, subject to proposed amendments, agreed to in accordance with section 75 of the Constitution.