You see, what happened is that this man took my seat and therefore disorganised me. [Laughter.]
Is that the correct response, hon Deputy Minister?
What is the number of the question?
It is number 357 and was asked by the hon V B Ndlovu.
That is the right question. Mr Chairperson, you must make rules that hon members should not take other people's seats.
The answer to the first question by Mr Ndlovu is: No. The answer to the second question is also no and the answer to the third question is yes. The SA National Defence Force contingent has been provided with the following weaponry and equipment in addition to their R4 assault rifles and 9mm pistols.
Unfortunately, hon Ndlovu, we will not give details because it is not in the interest of our security to give those details, especially since we are talking about people who are in a war situation.
We have Mamba MK3 mine-resistant armoured personnel carriers, 7,62mm light machine guns, 60mm patrol mortars, 60mm conventional mortars for base protection, 40mm MGL grenade launchers and RPG7 rocket-propelled grenade launchers. Thank you very much, Mr Chairperson.
Thank you, Chairperson. Thank you very much for the answer, Deputy Minister, and for saying that nobody was killed and injured. I just want to carry on and ask my follow-up question. They are really at war and they are trying to keep the peace. Do they have to enforce it? If so, what should they do? That is my first question. The second question concerns their welfare. Is their welfare looked after properly, including that of their families they left behind?
Mr Chairperson, the welfare of soldiers deployed either inside or outside the country is looked after through methods and systems that ensure that they are properly looked after. In fact, when you deploy soldiers, you don't just deploy fighting soldiers but there is also what is called the support staff which includes psychologists, engineers, doctors, etc. So, when you deploy soldiers, you also provide them with support mechanisms. Of course, you cannot visit their families every day but they are kept informed through mechanisms that are put in place to help them communicate with their families. Thank you.
Thank you, Chairperson. Could you, sir, with the information at your disposal, share with this House as to how soon the force of the United Nations is likely to be deployed to reinforce the African mission in Sudan in an attempt to stabilise and normalise the unabated war environment in that country?
We are concerned that further delays will result in further attacks, ambushes and unnecessary suffering which will cost more human life, ... ... ukuba ungandiphendula, Tshangisa. [... could you please answer me, Tshangisa.]
Thank you very much, Mr Chairperson. Thank you very much, Mr Bhengu. Whilst we share your concern, it needs to be pointed out that what is needed in Darfur is a political solution. The problem is that as soon as the fighting stops, a peace agreement has to be put in place for the United Nations force to have any effect.
So, the most important thing in Darfur at the moment is to make sure that there is a peaceful political solution. We can send the military force to Darfur if the need arises but it is important that there is a political solution. For that to happen, all parties involved must talk to each other, because military force does not solve problems, especially political problems. I thank you.
Deputy Minister, I think there is a problem here. If you say, hon Minister, that a political solution has not been reached in Darfur, are you saying that you have sent our people there to enforce peace but there is no political agreement? Are we not putting ourselves in danger by trying to solve the problem with guns instead of negotiations? I think that is the problem now.
Mr Ndlovu, what I'm saying is that there are attempts by the African Union and the United Nations to solve the problem politically. In fact, the forces that are deployed there are deployed for peacekeeping purposes, not for peace enforcement.
What I'm trying to say is that what is more important than military deployments is a political solution which the people of Darfur, unfortunately, must be able to understand.
If the people who are in conflict do not recognise the importance of a political solution, there would still be fighting because the United Nations and the AU can only facilitate a temporary solution, which is what has been happening in Darfur. That is the reason I'm saying we must, as South Africans, Africans and the whole world, impress upon the people of Darfur that the solution to their problems can only be achieved by talking amongst themselves - a political solution.
Vacancy rate in Human Resources Unit of department, and plans to fill vacancies
348. Mr L T Landers (ANC) asked the Minister for Justice and Constitutional Development:
(a) What is the current vacancy rate in the Human Resources Unit of her department and (b) what plans are under way to address vacancies in the various components of her department, including in court services? NO2338E
Chairperson, there are 200 funded posts in the Human Resources Unit of the Department of Justice and Constitutional Development. The vacancy rate is 12%.
In answering the second part of the question, let me make the statement that the existence of vacancies in government departments is a challenge that government is rigorously addressing. In part the problem relates to the very process for filling a vacant post, which takes a long time. The Department of the Public Service and Administration is assisting departments in this regard.
Before I speak about the strategies we are employing to deal with this vacancy challenge, hon members, let me provide you with statistics on the post establishment in my department. There are 16 174 approved posts and of these, 13 654 posts are filled. The vacancy rate in my department is 12%. We have advertised 1 013 posts and we will soon be advertising the remaining 913.
For our part, we have identified particular weaknesses in our system which we are addressing. In our current strategy to deal with the issue of vacant posts, we have done away with the cumbersome structure of business units. Our department was divided into business units. We have reverted to the ordinary form of having subdirectorates.
We have capacitated our HR unit and, as a result, we are seeing improvements in filling posts - whereas in the past we would take six months, we now take three months. We have also decentralised the recruitment process to the regional offices. Initially recruitment was conducted by the HR unit located at the national office and, of course, we have sought specialist advice so as to find an innovative way of dealing with the challenges of filling vacant posts. Thank you.
Chairperson, we welcome the progress announced by the hon Minister. Arising from her response and given the relatively large vacancy rate, particularly in the prosecutorial component, which impacts on the efficiency rates of our courts; given the large increases of R4,7 billion to R8,9 billion announced in the department's budget last year; and finally given that the largest part of this increase goes towards increasing personnel capacity and providing services, will the hon Minister give this House the assurance that the department will provide Parliament with clear progress reports on the objectives and goals attained in increasing personnel capacity within the department?
Chairperson, yes, indeed, I do give that assurance. In fact, plans are under way. The National Prosecuting Authority itself gave a report to the extended executive committee, in which they gave us their initial plans for attending to the problem of filling vacancies. We will do so. We will submit reports as required by the portfolio committee.
Thank you, Chairperson. Minister, you did not specifically refer to the position in the NPA. According to their annual report the vacancy for advocates is 33,2%, for interpreters 75%, and for prosecutors 22,1%. This has an adverse effect on the administration of justice, as can be seen from the lower conviction rates. In special courts, it has decreased from 70% to 65%.
My question is: To solve a problem, one has to know why it exists. What is being done to find out why we have these vacancies? You mentioned in your whole department 12% but in the NPA it is up to 75% in certain cases. Thank you.
Chairperson, there are structural problems in the sense that it took them some time to get a chief financial officer but, as I say, we do have a CFO now and, in fact, there are plans on the table. Unfortunately, hon member, I do not have the plans here as I speak to you but I do promise that I will make them available to the House.
Compensation of Reserve Force members deployed during Operation BATA
366. Mr P J Groenewald (FF Plus) asked the Minister of Defence:
(1) Whether any members of the Reserve Force who were deployed from 1 June 2007 to 5 July 2007 during Operation BATA have received compensation; if not, (a) why not and (b) when does he envisage their receiving compensation; if so, (i) how many members were compensated and (ii) when;
(2) whether he will make a statement on the matter? NO2363E
Chairperson, the reply is: No. Four reserve force members will be compensated as soon as the payment schedule order has been corrected. This process is currently under way. This problem arose because the respective units providing the forces did not process the payment schedule in time. Thank you.
Voorsitter, ek wil vir die agb Adjunkminister vra wat gaan dan aan in die weermag? Daar word van mense verwag om diens te doen tydens 'n noodsituasie. Daar is bevelvoerders wat agtuur die aand mense opgeroep het om sesuur die oggend noodsaaklike dienste te gaan verrig, veral in hospitale.
Natuurlik is die probleem dat die agb Minister-hulle die kommando's afgestel het, want dan sou hy meer mense gehad het, maar die feit van die saak is di mense het alles opgeoffer. Hulle lewer 'n diens en nou wil u vir my kom s u vat vier maande om die dokumentasie reg te kry sodat die mense hulle salarisse kan ontvang.
Ek wil 'n voorstel maak dat die agb Adjunkminister en die Minister nie hulle salarisse kry voordat hierdie lede nie hulle salarisse gekry het nie, want baie van daardie lede ... (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)
[Mr P J GROENEWALD: Chairperson, I want to ask the hon Deputy Minister what is happening in the army. It is expected of people to perform services during an emergency. There are commanding officers who have called people up at eight o'clock in the evening to instruct them to perform essential services at six o'clock the next morning, especially at hospitals.
Of course, the problem is that the hon Minister and his colleagues did away with the commando system, otherwise he would have had more people, but the fact of the matter is that these people have sacrificed everything. They have rendered a service and now you are telling me that you need four months in order to prepare the documentation so that these people can receive their salaries.
I want to suggest that the hon Deputy Minister and the Minister not receive their salaries until these members have received theirs because many of these members ...]
Hon member, what is your question?
Die opvolg is: Wat gaan die agb Adjunkminister doen om hierdie proses baie vinnig te bespoedig en te verseker dat die mense hulle geld kry? Hulle het waardevolle diens vir Suid-Afrika gelewer. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)
[Mr P J GROENEWALD: The follow-up question is: What is the hon Deputy Minister going to do to greatly expedite this process and ensure that these people get their salaries? They have rendered a valuable service for South Africa.]
Chairperson, as I've said, the process is under way. We are doing everything to ensure that those people are paid. Unfortunately, we are running a government and departments that have processes to be followed. I cannot wake up one morning because some people must be paid and say, ``okay take money from the petty cash and pay them''. We don't operate like that. There must be documents. We are going to pay them and we are following the necessary procedures. But seeing that Mr Groenewald is so concerned, can we ask him if we can take his salary this month and then we will refund him? Thank you.
Chairperson, we in the ANC welcome the department's initiatives, particularly that of recognising the role played by the reserve force within the SANDF. We also wish to recommend that the Ministry should actually continue with this kind of initiative, because it not only promotes the event but also promotes the role that the reserve force is playing within the SANDF.
Would the Ministery consider continuing with activities of this nature to ensure that it also educates the public on the role that the reserves are playing in this country and actually invites the public - those with military skills - to enlist with the reserve force? Thank you.
Chairperson, the Defence Force is structured in such a way that we have the regular force, which must be a certain number. We also have the reserve force as part of the whole Defence Force. I agree with the last speaker that it is important that we must ensure that the reserve force is not only kept in place but is maintained.
The reserve force is playing a very important role. Just to educate Mr Groenewald, some of them were even deployed outside the country. That is the role played by the reserve force and we paid them. It is unfortunate that you just make a big issue about one small administrative mishap.
The reserve force is a very important component of the Department of Defence Force and we may want to ensure that the reserve force is not only maintained but increases in size. Thank you.
Thank you, Chairperson. Deputy Minister, administrative bungling is not needed in any department. You cannot call people to do a job and not pay them because by doing that, you are saying the department is not run professionally. How are you going to correct that perception?
Well, like I've said, Baba Ndlovu, we are now in the process of rectifying and correcting that mistake. But I can assure you that we have learnt something. In future deployments, we will ensure that such a thing does not happen again.
You must also realise that we are a very big department and that sometimes we act under terrible pressures. But I assure you that we have set up mechanism to ensure that a mistake of this nature is not repeated. Thank you.
Decrease in confiscation of cannabis and increase in that of methaqualome, and the impact of this on the SAPS strategy against drugs
354. Mr S Mahote (ANC) asked the Minister of Safety and Security:
(1) To what can the decrease in the confiscation of cannabis and the increase in the confiscation of methaqualome in the financial year 2006-07 be attributed;
(2) whether this impacts on the SA Police Service's strategy against drugs; if not, why not; if so, how? NO2347E
Chairperson, the reply is as follows: The decrease in the confiscation of cannabis can be attributed to the successes achieved by the cannabis eradication programme of the SA Police Service which is targeting the cannabis crop in South Africa. For the 2006- 07 financial year, an estimated 2 991 hectares of illicit cannabis plantations were destroyed, thus preventing an estimated 2 094 tons of cannabis from reaching the local and foreign drug markets.
The increase in the quantity of Methaqualome confiscated can be attributed to successful police work including the confiscation, during May 2006, of over 2,5 tons of Mandrax tablets smuggled into South Africa. This consignment was found hidden inside wooden doors in a container that was imported from China.
With regard to the second part of the question, the strategy followed by the SAPS is mainly directed towards reducing the supply of illicit drugs to the drug market and it can therefore be expected that the volume of cannabis found and destroyed will increase and large quantities of other drugs will be intercepted at ports of entry. Thank you.
Thank you, Chairperson. Hon Minister, the SA Police Service must be congratulated on the success it has had in reducing the supply of drugs on our streets. Does it involve other departments in the social aspect of drug abusers so as to reduce the demand for illicit drugs? And what does this involvement entail?
Thank you very much for your comment, hon member. On the matter of drugs and the distribution of illicit drugs in our country, there is what is defined as the Drugs Master Plan. That master plan is the product of collaboration between a number of departments but the lead department is the Department of Social Development.
The Drugs Master Plan therefore looks at various aspects which relate to drugs including a project to win, particularly young people, away from the abuse of drugs. In consequence of the collaboration, therefore, we have been able to do a very good work with respect to issues that relate to the abuse of drugs. Thank you.
Thank you, Chairperson. Minister, drugs, such as Tik and Sugars, are part of a plague destroying families. Parents are prostituting their 10-year old daughters to feed their habit. These drugs are killing addicts across the length and breadth of this country. And there is a move towards more sophisticated drugs such as Mandrax, to which you have referred earlier on - smuggled from China - which means there is a need for more and more sophisticated techniques on the part of our SAPS.
However, it is incredibly difficult for the police to raid a known illegal drug manufacturer's property as they must be in possession of a sworn affidavit before such a raid is permitted, and the person who swears such an affidavit that drugs are held or manufactured in a certain house is then in fear of his or her life.
Minister, what steps are you taking to ease this situation in dealing with the Department of Justice, to make it easier for our police in their strategic moves in this regard rather than wasting their time and ours on such frivolous moves as arresting the Mayor of Cape Town during a legal march against drugs?
The matter of preventing the abuse of drugs as well as alcohol is a matter that all of us ought to be involved in, including the Mayor of Cape Town. That issue has to do with the fact that the police, most of the time, will be reactive in terms of those issues. But when we work together, it is possible for us to deal with that matter. It is at home where we live, where some of our children are using these drugs, that we must start.
The issue of collaboration between the various departments is one that we always discuss and there is a good relationship between Cabinet and the departments, including a relationship between the Ministry for Safety and Security and the Ministry of Justice precisely to deal with those matters.
Where there are specific issues, as the hon member has mentioned, of particular areas where there are people who have information about drug smuggling and the sale of drugs, particularly to our young people, we would appreciate it if such information was placed in the hands of the law- enforcement agencies of the country because this is a matter that we must deal with and deal with effectively so that we save our people from drug abuse. Thank you.
Thank you, Chairperson. I would like to thank the hon Minister for the answer. I would like to raise a supplementary question which will link up with the Department of Justice. Let me say, for example, there is a house where drugs are produced but the owner of the house does not live in the house, he lives somewhere else or even in Australia for that matter. What would you do in a case like this?
Secondly, let's say that one of the investigators or one of the people who are leading the investigation of the case goes back to the drug lord and divulges to him the name of the person who reported the case. What do you do in such a case because that is how we are going to fight this thing if we want to close the loopholes?
Hon Ndlovu, we must be told and be given information about members of the SA Police Service or any other law enforcement agencies in the country who will act in the way that you are describing because what that means is that a police officer who is investigating or has been given information about wrongdoing and then goes and divulges that information to the very people they need to investigate is committing an offence. We need to get that information so that we can deal with people of that nature because they are acting in a criminal way and therefore can be legitimately defined as criminals. We want to deal with those people but let us get the information first so that we can deal with them.
In the past there was a law which said that if you where driving a vehicle in which, for instance, the police found any type of contraband material, including drugs, that vehicle would be confiscated by the state and therefore forfeited to the state because it was a vehicle which was used in the commission of a crime. I am under the impression that there is still something like that on our Statute Book. Of course, at the appropriate time the Minister for Justice will respond to this.
It was on that understanding that I argued publicly, for instance, that the house in Jeppestown, Johannesburg, where the police were in a shooting confrontation with criminals, should be forfeited to the state, but I was advised that it was not as straightforward a matter as that. In other words, to my mind it was straight forward, there was criminal activity there and therefore the property should be confiscated. I was advised that it was not as simple as that. Thank you.
Voorsitter, ek wil vir die agb Minister vra ... ek sien die Minister wil net sy gehoorstukkie regkry. Kan die agb Minister my hoor? Tolk hulle darem? Ek wil vir die agb Minister vra of hy dink dit is goed as sy Nasionale Kommissaris, mnr Jackie Selebi, se beste vriend, "finish en klaar" [kant en klaar], 'n sogenaamde "drug lord" [dwelmbaas] is? (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)
[Mr P J GROENEWALD: Chairperson, I want to ask the Minister ... I see that the Minister is fixing his headpiece. Can you hear me, Minister? Are they interpreting? I want to ask the hon Minister whether he thinks it is appropriate that his National Commissioner, Mr Jackie Selebi's best friend, "a finish and klaar", is a so-called drug lord?]
Well, I don't know where that question fits in in terms of what we are dealing with. I am not prepared to answer it.
Establishment of dedicated remand detention branch
349. Bishop L J Tolo (ANC) asked the Minister of Correctional Services:
Whether, with reference to his department's strategic plan for 2007-08 to 2011-12, his department will establish a dedicated remand detention branch with a dedicated budget programme, a regional head and appropriate remand detainee facilities with dedicated personnel in each region in the 2007-08 financial year; if not, why not; if so, what progress is being made in this regard?