Chairperson of the NCOP, Deputy Minister, distinguished members of the House, ladies and gentlemen, and officials of the department, I appreciate and feel privileged to be speaking in this House, presenting a budget for a brand-new Department of Co-operative Governance and Traditional Affairs. It is important to me, because this is the first time I stand in front of you to speak and engage with you, in this new administration, after the provincial and national elections.
Colleagues will recall that I am very passionate about the NCOP as a structure, because I am a former chairperson of the Select Committee on Local Government and Administration.
Today I want to reflect on the expanded mandate of the department, which is moving from being a Department of Provincial and Local Government to a Department of Co-operative Governance and Traditional Affairs. This mandate was outlined in the state of the nation address, where we said that as a department we are the choir conductor of our system of co-operative governance in South Africa. The role of choir conductor is a new and expanded one, shifting the focus from co-operative government to co- operative governance.
At the same time we are able to give support to provinces, something we didn't do in the past. We should sharpen our legal instruments so that we are able to give support to municipalities. We must ensure that these instruments are strategic in nature, because municipalities are required to report on so many things. They spend most of their time writing reports, receiving guests from national government, from Parliament, from the provinces, and so on. They have meeting after meeting, and a meeting to prepare for another meeting. We believe that those days are gone. Local government officials must spend their time doing their work, rather than spending most of their time in meetings. Meetings are not going to help us go forward.
The other shift is that we believe we must move away from traditional leadership to traditional affairs. It means we look at all the affairs of traditional communities. Included among those affairs are indigenous knowledge systems. It includes throwing of the bones, which I call a "floor X-ray". When you go to hospital, they do an X-ray of your chest to check your health status. In our traditional communities they throw the floor X- ray to determine your health. We want to market this, because we believe that this is what our people are doing in terms of survival. Of course, we must deal with the charlatans, those who are abusing the systems and our people. We believe that 85% of South Africans are using this practice or system. South Africa is a democratic country - those who believe in using this system should be allowed to do so without fear, because according to our Constitution choices can be made.
In terms of our mandate we will come with innovative ways of strengthening social cohesion and deepening participatory governance in this country. In doing so, we believe that over the next five years we should be able to protect, guide and direct the roles and responsibilities so as to ensure that we produce a single, harmonious melody in this country. We must ensure that the rhythm, the vibrancy and the meaning of this melody are in consonance with what we want to put across.
As choir conductors we therefore want to say that, in conducting our responsibilities, our strategic partner is the NCOP. We believe that we have a unique role to play and a responsibility to live up to. However, some quotations have been presented in relation to the role of the NCOP. Allow me to be as direct as to quote you, hon Chairperson, from your documents:
The NCOP not only provides provinces with a forum in which to engage with the national government on matters concerning areas of shared national and provincial legislative powers, but also oversees the programmes and activities of national government relating to provincial and local government matters. You further state, and I quote:
The 1996 Constitution introduced a new concept called "co-operative government". That places a high priority on consultation, co-ordination and communication between the different levels of government and all organs of state. The NCOP can be regarded as a concrete expression of "co- operative government", whereby governance in South Africa is seen as a partnership among the national, provincial and local spheres of government. It further means that national legislation must be sensitive to provincial interests and concerns. In addition, provinces must not act alone or in isolation, but must be integrated into the national legislative or law-making process.
In our view the conceptualisation in these quotations is a bit flawed in some respects. Firstly, the focus is on "co-operative government", and not on "co-operative governance", where the governed and the governor are working together. That is the first thing.
In the second place, we are saying that the way in which it is conceptualised doesn't look at the issue of local government. Local government is ghettoised, not only in terms of the name of the National Council of Provinces, where local government is not mentioned, but also in respect of the fact that the 10 representatives who are supposed to be here are observers. It means they are not allowed to vote. That is why you find that local government as a sphere feels a bit alienated from participating in the NCOP. They don't feel that they are an integral part of the system.
The third area we believe is quite important relates to the capability of this institution in terms of its numbers and strength. We believe that this has shortcomings, and must be bolstered and strengthened.
Lastly, we believe that the issue of facilitating international relations to promote a good and just world order is something that has to be looked at and strengthened. We therefore believe that, having expressed these views, you remain a premier strategic partner of this department going forward. We believe that we must work together, because we are an expression of co-operative governance in the legislature. We ourselves deal with co-operative governance at an executive level, so therefore we must be able to ensure that we collaborate and work together going forward.
One of the most important things, as we see it, is that we are involved in a process of reviewing the future of provinces. We have finalised the policy and it is a question of taking it to Cabinet to engage with it. At the same time we are looking at the issue of municipalities and what has happened to them. In doing so, we must be able to work together. Having taken the policy to Cabinet, we believe that once Cabinet pronounces on it, it must ensure that the process is taken to the legislatures and to the people of this country, so that they can express whether they believe that we should continue with the current conjuncture of the system of government as is. We believe that these matters must be engaged upon. If there is agreement that provinces should remain, we believe we will need a fundamental review of the structure of the NCOP, as I have said, with regard to its name, its structure, and its capability. But not only that. We also have to look at the priorities and the positioning of the NCOP in a way that reflects the interests of provinces and municipalities going forward.
From our side, as the department, we think there are about five priorities that we must take forward. Firstly, we must ensure that, in our developmental state, we build provinces and strengthen them - so that they are responsive, efficient and effective - and the same goes for municipalities.
We must ensure that the system of governance focuses on vulnerable groups. According to the ANC's strategy and tactics, we are the disciplined force of the left. This means that in our action we support the weak and the vulnerable. In respect of our definition, we believe the weak should include military veterans and farmworkers. Those groups were not included in the past.
We also believe that we must support the institution of governance, in particular in respect of traditional leadership and traditional communities. We must use processes to build social cohesion going forward.
We have agreed that we must have a turnaround strategy for local government. It is called the Local Government Turnaround Strategy 2009-11. This turnaround strategy will cover the following issues: reducing the number of complaints regarding issues of local government by 2011; reducing municipal debt, which is more than R41 billion, by half by 2014; building a debt-free society and promoting a culture of saving and payment for services; ensuring that municipalities have clean audits by 2014; reducing corruption and fraud to the minimum by 2011; and promoting clean cities by transforming waste into work by 2014 and at the same time establishing people's parks for love.
We also believe that ward committees should be empowered to become centres of co-operative governance, where we can ensure that our people interact at local level and co-ordinate all activities. Today the police have its own structures, health services have its own structures, and education has its own structures. We believe that this represents a silo mentality. Ward committees must be centres of co-ordination. One could have specific areas of responsibility, but the ward level is where things should be happening.
We also believe these ward committees must focus on establishing co- operatives, so that economic wealth is generated and they stop spending their time complaining, finding fault and not doing anything. In every village there must be economic activity taking place. It means that going forward people have to look at how they can generate wealth in their own areas of jurisdiction.
We believe that by doing these things we will actually be able to go forward. When I make my closing remarks, I will outline the tasks that should be undertaken by the ward committees. That will be when I come back for the second round.
We believe that one would be able to hold the department accountable for ensuring that these things are done. These are measurable objectives. We are saying, if you can't measure it, you can't monitor it. Therefore we are presenting things that can be monitored, because you can measure them. That is what we are outlining here. It is not a general statement that we are presenting in going forward. Thank you very much, Chairperson.
Hon Chairperson, hon Minister, hon Deputy Minister, hon special delegates and delegates, let me congratulate the Minister at the outset on his reappointment to the newly named Department of Co-operative Governance and Traditional Affairs, and also the Deputy Minister on a well- deserved appointment. I can assure both of you that from a financial support perspective, we cannot fault this department. No less than 98,7% of the department's annual budget is allocated to local government, of which the encouraging amount of R11 billion is dedicated to municipal infrastructure grants.
It has also become abundantly clear in recent times that Minister Shiceka openly admits to problems facing his department and displays a willingness to tackle challenges head-on. Both this attitude and the department's liberal funding programme bode well for local government, because this is where the fundamental malfunctioning of ANC governance has been paramount, and it has been showing tendencies of rapid growth since 1994 and particularly in these past five years.
Let's be honest, Minister, there is very little wrong with the structure and systems of local government. After all, these emanate from the most lauded Constitution in the world. But any system could stand or fall because of the way it is implemented, monitored and maintained, and that is just where the real problem lies. Your government was in such a rush to implement affirmative action that you hurriedly and systematically evicted all those officials with expertise and experience from municipalities and replaced them with crony deployment in a closed patronage system - truly a recipe for disaster.
What we need now is for an early warning system to be implemented by all provinces, so that the problems that are developing in municipalities can be identified and addressed before it is too late. Just last week, Chairperson, we learnt of 13 pending interventions in no fewer than 13 municipalities in one province alone, and we in the DA know of at least one more to be added to that list in that province. This sad situation is no different in other provinces, and I can quote many examples of where my colleagues and I called for early interventions.
But, you see, hon Chairperson, the problem also lies with the ANC's system of cadre deployment. Very often the MEC in question is lower in rank within the ANC or SACP than the municipal manager or the mayor, and therefore fearful and apprehensive of acting against such a party's superior. [Interjections.] That is the truth. You can't argue with that. I have seen it.
Die toestand, Voorsitter, van die onderpresterende munisipaliteite is derhalwe die gevolg van hierdie wydverspreide ontplooiing van onbekwame kaders en die oorkoepelende hirargie van die ANC. Dt, Voorsitter, is hoekom wydverspreide boikotte en weerhouding van belastingbetaling in bykans alle provinsies aan die orde van die dag is. Die DA steun glad nie di boikotte of enige vorm van weerhouding van belasting nie, maar 'n mens kan jou nie blindstaar teen die frustrasies van die belastingbetalers nie. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)
[Chairperson, the situation of the underperforming municipalities can therefore be ascribed to this widespread deployment of incompetent cadres and the overarching hierarchy of the ANC. Chairperson, this is why widespread boycotts and withholding rates seem to be the order of the day in all the provinces these days. The DA does not support these boycotts or any form of withholding, but one cannot ignore the frustration of the ratepayers.]
The bottom line is that service delivery is nonexistent in many municipalities because of incompetence and corruption. In Thaba Chweu Local Municipality in Mpumalanga, Eskom reportedly suspended the supply of electricity last week because of nonpayment, while the theft of R3,2 million of taxpayers' money in April, allegedly by computer hackers, remains unsolved.
Decisive action must now be taken, hon Minister, to reverse this situation, because if we don't take such action, we will be faced with the total collapse of services in most of our towns and cities, and the health of all our citizens will be at risk, not to speak of that of the thousands of Fifa soccer fans expected to visit us next year.
So, hon Minister, please convince your colleagues in Cabinet that you do not have to rush to Parliament for the adoption of the Constitution Seventeenth Amendment Bill to give central government more power over local government. [Laughter.] Just make it work by applying the principles of best-person government in an open opportunity society, where there is a progressive transfer of knowledge and expertise and an uppermost desire to deliver quality services at affordable rates.
And for goodness sake, Minister, don't tamper with the provinces and their areas of competence. Just because the ANC provincial governments are all dysfunctional, and the one DA provincial government is already excelling ... [Interjections.] ... there is no reason to do away with provinces.
The ball is firmly in your court, hon Minister. You are a seasoned politician and a local government petitioner, and you have a very experienced Deputy Minister, so please go for it and let us get municipalities back to basics and working again, but don't try to fix what ain't broken. I thank you. [Applause.]
Chairperson, Minister, comrades and friends, allow me, in the first instance, to congratulate you, Chairperson, on your reappointment as Chairperson of this august House. I am particularly struck by the fact that you served from 1994 onwards in the very committee of the same portfolio in which the Minister and I served. While he was MEC for Local Government in Gauteng, you were in the committee. So I would ask Mr Watson to bear in mind that, when he is very critical, he is critical, no less, of his very Chairperson who had a big hand in shaping the co-operative governance system through the Constitutional Assembly process, and in fact should have taken account, let me add, Mr Watson, of the practical issues that might arise.
But having said that, it is a pleasure to be here, and to say that we live, of course, as many if not all of us know, in an ever-changing, dynamic, globalised world, whose key characteristic is the speed and sweep of events. We have to be constantly on guard, always prepared to change, not just reactively, but, very importantly, proactively. Our principles, values and goals need not change, but our means of fulfilling them may have to change.
As for our basic goals, we are very clear: It is to deepen democracy, advance nation-building, and ensure the development of our people, particularly the poor and the disadvantaged. And if these three major tasks cannot be separated, it is also clear that there cannot be any significant advances in entrenching democracy or nation-building without substantial development of the people and a significant reduction in social and material inequalities.
So the development of our people is fundamental, and though we have made major strides since 1994 in advancing development, we still have a very long way to go, and far too limited a time to get there. We need to accelerate service delivery and development. The next five years are crucial to ensuring this. They are, as many of us say, our do-or-die years, not just for the government, but for Parliament too, not least this House, as you directly represent the people, and have to hold us as the executive to account.
So any failures on our part are failures of yours as well, which is why we stress - the Minister and I, and indeed the department - the importance of Parliament and this House exercising vigorous oversight over us. A strong, effective Parliament is in the interests of the executive too. You will serve to ensure that we deliver on our mandate. Indeed, the President too has made this clear: He has repeatedly stressed the need for an activist Parliament. Our department fully endorses that. Indeed, we too define ourselves as an activist department, and the Minister and myself as an activist Ministry.
Just how activist we will be depends in part on how activist you are, and as the Minister said earlier in this debate, the NCOP has a vital role to play, particularly in respect of the responsibilities of our portfolio. It is interesting, too, that members such as Mr Watson are raising issues here about local government, but here again, we think the NCOP has a major oversight responsibility as well, within the constitutional constraints, in ensuring that municipalities work. It is not just the responsibility, may I add, of the executive. Accelerating service delivery and development will be particularly challenging, as we all know, over the next five years, given the impact of the global economic crisis on our shores. Yes, we are not as hard hit as other countries, but hit we are, and we have to confront this hard reality.
So it is against at least three backgrounds that we have begun, and are taking further, a review of the form of the state that we arrived at. As many of us know, including Mr Watson who was here in 1994, Mr Mahlangu, the Chairperson of the House, and others of you, we shaped this Constitution and the form of the state we derived from that Constitution in the negotiating process, on the basis of give and take, and on the basis of our political negotiations. So what is there in the Constitution is not necessarily objectively in the best interests of a developmental state. What we have there was for that particular context, of early 1994 to 1996, when we were trying to consolidate a consensus around our democracy, and we wanted to ensure that the needs of nation-building were met. So that is the first background.
What we now need to look at, with regard to the state and what the powers and functions of the spheres should be, is what is necessary to accelerate service delivery and development. Therefore the second background against which we are reviewing the powers and functions of the tiers is the recognition that we need to accelerate service delivery and development.
A third issue is the recognition, particularly over the past nine months and more, of the need for us to have a strong developmental state to withstand the economic crisis that we are experiencing all over the world. Only strong developmental states will actually survive, and when we talk of a developmental state, it is not your East Asian tigers, although there are many lessons there; it is our own African and South African form of it, which derives from the active participation of people, as the Minister has said.
We are a department of co-operative governance, not "co-operative government", so we are saying we want a democratic developmental state. We are clear that a system of co-operative governance is enshrined in the Constitution - that system is not going to change. What is going to happen is that we are going to strengthen that system to ensure that it works better.
The imperatives that are underpinning our review are not ideological; they are actually very practical. They are about ensuring that we are able to accelerate service delivery and development. They are to take account of the lessons that we spoke about when we appeared before the relevant committee, about the failures of the past 15 years.
Co-operative governance has not been working the way we wanted it to work. That is what it is about. It is about throwing open a discussion. It is about recognising that one needs to change and adapt as conditions require. But it is very clear that the hoo-ha in the press and the media is rather misplaced. The Minister does not have the power to say "Let's abolish the provinces". Indeed, the President doesn't. And if either of them or both of them did have that power, I doubt very much whether they'd ever do it, because they both recognise the need to consult with the people out there.
This Constitution was shaped through the active participation of our population. Some two million and more people, as we all know, contributed to shaping that final Constitution. It cannot be changed willy-nilly. There will be a discussion, and we are not going to be stuck in the past, we are not going to be fossils; we are going to be creative, imaginative thinkers. All the Minister and the department have done, is throw open a series of questions that all of us, whichever party we come from, need to discuss.
The questions that arise are: Is it best to have two or three spheres to advance our democracy, to build a nation, to accelerate service delivery and development? If so, whether it is two, three, or however many spheres, what should be the relevant powers and functions for the period that we are entering into, in the context of the three or four points that I have set the background against?
What I am saying, in short, and what the Minister is saying, is that there are various considerations here about service delivery and development, whichever party we come from.
It is very instructive that when we appeared before the committee this morning, across political parties, people were asking: Why is this department not intervening in all these difficult challenges that municipalities are having? On the one hand, people are saying this department, this Minister, must intervene. On the other hand, they are saying, don't change the Constitution. How can you have both? In fact, the Minister is limited in what he and the Ministry can do, because of what is there in the Constitution.
I think we can certainly do more than we are currently doing, even within the constraints of the Constitution, but we cannot intervene in the interventionist sense that was presented to us, not least by the DA representatives, when we appeared before the committee. In short, we need to look at this Constitution in the context of the needs of the time. We are saying to our friends that we need a discussion.
There are various options that are possible. One is that we retain all nine provinces, with basically the same powers and functions, but clarify them and fine-tune them. The second option is that we keep the nine provinces, but with a review of the powers and functions that would make them more developmental. A third option could be that we reduce the number of provinces and that can be done in various forms. Either you merge provinces, or you redraw certain boundaries, if it's necessary. Or fourthly - I am just thinking of four options now, there could be many more, but we need a discussion - we could dissolve the provinces, but strengthen local government. Those are all the options. There is going to be a discussion, and this House will play, as the Minister has said, an especially leading role.
We should not say, on the one hand, that the governing party closes the discussion, and, on the other hand, when we open a discussion, say "No, no, you can't have that discussion".
So, friends, I want to echo what the Minister has said: You as the National Council of Provinces will play, as indeed Parliament as a whole will play, a fundamentally important role. And if you look at the developmental state, elements of it are there in our Constitution, in Chapter 7 in particular. They are there in the Local Government: Municipal Systems Act. They are there in the recognition that the private sector alone cannot deliver. For market failure reasons the state needs to intervene. But as much as for market failure reasons, the state needs to intervene to ensure partnerships, to ensure that the private sector is directed in a particular way, and many states do.
I need to wrap up. I thank you very much indeed, and we look forward to the fullest co-operation of the NCOP and wish you well. I thank you. [Applause.]
Hon Chair of the NCOP, our Ministers here present, we thank you for your presence. Hon members, let me join our Minister, and also tell our Minister to say: "Vorentoe, nie agtertoe nie"!
The Minister has outlined the mandate of the new department. All that is still required is that the Minister must put in place the budget to realise those objectives as outlined. We have about five priorities that are required to realise the objectives of our manifesto, and without putting the proper budget in place, our Minister will hear what we hear from some of the parties that are like tortoises that do not want to relinquish their shells. All we need to do is to create decent jobs, fight crime, and promote rural development, health and education.
If you are from the past, especially if you tasted apartheid, it might not be easy to transform to what the current government wants the people of South Africa to taste. And if that is the case, we call on people to support the type of Minister we have, a Minister who is a choirmaster, ready to remove any person, from whatever political party, who does not want the song to be melodious to the audience. If you sing with people who are not able to sing, as we say in Sotho, your song will indeed not be melodious to the people.
Minister, we welcome your speech. We as the select committee are saying that we support every element of your speech. Over the past 15 years, we have seen that the mandate of the department is forcing us to say that, in order to move forward, we need to review certain legislative and policy aspects, precisely because without doing that the broad mandate of provincial and local government might not be realised. At stake here, hon House, is the fact that the Department of Provincial and Local Government Affairs ignored one sphere of our three spheres of government, the provincial government. While there was a lot of noise about municipalities, the provincial government did not have enough legislative capacity to ensure that it intervened.
We are facing a lot of section 139 interventions, which are not a result of wrong or weak policies; our policies are strong, and our policies are correct. All that is needed is to close the gap, and the gap is at provincial level. Therefore we must indeed speed up the White Paper, so that as NCOP committees we are able to make an input into what type of provinces we want.
No one is saying that we are going to remove the provinces as yet, but if perhaps South Africa wants them to be dissolved, fine, because there are nine provinces, not eight provinces plus one. There are nine provinces in a unitary state and that is why other people are worried. There are nine provinces - there is no single province that belongs in a separate pocket. That is not true. Therefore we need to move forward with that legislation. We want to see the strengthening of co-operative governance in a developmental state. Once we do that, we will deliver service freely, without tension, without section 139 interventions, without section 100 interventions, without any other noise from anywhere, because we would then have created a correct political environment for governance to take place. We need to go back and to strengthen that accountability. The process of accountability in government will have to be addressed so that the policies and the legislation are strengthened, because there are weaknesses, and we do not want that type of thing. We need to correct that type of thing.
We can only accelerate service delivery, Minister, if, indeed, we review that particular procedural relationship, particularly at local level where farmworkers and MK veterans are to be found. If we don't do that, how can we assist them? They are vulnerable, not because of their character, but because of the history of apartheid. Therefore we are still correcting that. We are still fighting something that is a legacy, even after 15 years in power. There are still many remnants of the legacy and the history of apartheid. Therefore no one must say we are in power and doing nothing, when these people were in power for over 300 years after Jan van Riebeeck occupied our land, right here in Cape Town. No one should tell us that.
We have a duty to perform and our duty, as we celebrate our centenary in 2012, is to tell our people that indeed this was a struggle worth fighting for. They shall have access to water and electricity, better roads, better jobs, and decent jobs for that matter. And, indeed, that is what we need to strive for.
Minister, your song, your melody, says we must also strive to achieve the Millennium Development Goals. Indeed, we must commit ourselves to that. I think because the mandate is broad, the department can no longer say we want to halve poverty by 2014. We should fight poverty as long as we are alive. We have to fight it.
There are developments, there are extensions, and there is expansion, but as long as this government exists, we will have to fight poverty, until it is totally eradicated.
At municipal level, Minister, we have seen the budget. Earlier on we met with the Deputy Minister and had a briefing; we have seen the budget and we are happy with it. We only want to say that here and there we need to tighten certain screws. For example, we would want the department to study, debate and review the formula that determines the grant allocation. While it increases every year, I think the formula needs to be reviewed, because when you increase the grant next year, you will find that the prices have also gone up, so the increase might not be visible. Once we review that formula, we will be in a position to address not only the backlog but to plan forward for whatever we need to see happening in our community.
The other aspect that we need to tighten is the very same idea of intergovernmental relations. Previously it was a voluntary forum. We need that forum to no longer be voluntary, but to be obligatory. It must respond to a particular instruction or role, so that anyone who does not want to sing in the Rural Development Initiative, RDI, must know that there are consequences for not doing that. If that is not happening, the Minister must be able to drive the forum of the Rural Development Initiative correctly, and the provinces are at the head of the RDI. Who is at the centre? At the centre are the provinces ... [Time expired.] [Applause.]
Chairperson of the NCOP, hon members, Ministers present here, first of all I would like to thank the 1,3 million people of South Africa who voted for Cope to come and represent them in this august House.
Chairperson, allow me to congratulate the Minister. He says it is a new department. A new department means a new broom which must sweep clean. I'm going to raise three issues that the Minister is supposed to go and implement. Firstly, what is the criterion for establishing municipal areas? For example, in the Musina Local Municipality there are 57 196 people and in Mutale Municipality there are 108 215 people; in Malamulele there are 307 897 people but it is not a municipality. What has been done now is that they have taken Malamulele and included it in Mutale. What is the rationale behind that? I was with Kgosi XiKundu who was crying, because if his people are included in Mutale, they will have to travel 200 km from where they are in order to receive services.
In Giyani location - but I call it "town" myself, because I have a problem with the issue of "location" - there is special treatment for the mayor. There is a section, Section E in Giyani, that has no tarmac roads or streets. Since the appointment of the mayor, as I'm standing here, they are busy working on those streets to tar them. Why is that?
Let us consider the anticorruption strategy, as was mentioned at the first briefing in the morning and now. Is it merely a rosy document to be put on the shelves? Will those strategies be properly implemented? I was happy to hear the Minister say that he was going to come up with a turnaround strategy which will deal with the complaints and debts. I want to see a clean audit by 2014. Are we going to be relieved to see that? [Time expired.]
Hon Chairman Mr Mahlangu, hon Ministers present here, hon members, ladies and gentlemen, the past few days were very hectic as committees of Parliament engaged in the most important work of budgeting. Today is no different to those processes, but marks the final stages of the release of the required resources to implement a national plan, as directed by the President of the Republic during his state of the nation address on 6 June.
Budgets by nature are about planning for the collection of revenue and its allocation or equitable and fair division across all spheres of government, so as to deliver quality services to our people. This is in many instances restricted by domestic and global market conditions such as the current economic downturn, whose effects we are beginning to feel. These conditions should not in any way distract us from achieving our goals, but should rather, as the President said so well, merely delay us for a while. It is indeed true that where there is a will, there is a way. This will cannot be expressed any better than in the policies of our movement, the ANC, and in its election manifesto, as the quest to build a better life for all. It is our shared view that the fact that we are in a global financial downturn does not mean that priorities should be abandoned, but rather that the country may need to strategically phase in the implementation as conditions become better.
The fulfilment of our priorities, outlined in the ANC manifesto and elaborated upon by the President during his state of nation address, is intended to consolidate the building of a developmental state. We need to build more capacity at all levels of our government, especially at the level of our municipalities.
Minister, it is indeed true and correct that the birth of the Department of Co-operative Governance and Traditional Affairs on 10 May 2009 is representing an irreversible shift to an expanded and more deliberate mandate on matters of co-operative governance. It is indeed correct that this new name of the department gives effect to the provisions of Chapters 3, 6, 7 and 12 of the Constitution, with Chapters 3 and 12 as fundamental priorities for execution. As we execute this mammoth task, we should be cautious never to overlook the harsh realities relating to the obstacles that are there. The biggest challenge in addressing the plight of our municipalities is first to deal with glaring legislative barriers that make it difficult to make meaningful, effective, efficient and responsive interventions as and when it becomes necessary to do so. The manner in which support and assistance is required should be provided by both national and provincial spheres of government to local government needs to be clarified; otherwise we will never win the battle.
Hon Minister, we are fully behind your call to strengthen systems of accountability and build clean government as one of the most important pillars of co-operative governance. However, I must caution that in so doing, as the choir conductor, great care and support should be given to our local councillors who, despite all their weaknesses, are faced with serious challenges. Their lives are more threatened and vulnerable than any of the public office bearers, for they are our striking forces to achieve service delivery goals. Being too harsh on them without addressing their plight or giving them the required support will only allow the enemy to creep in. Indeed, we should hold them accountable to the communities, but, in so doing, we should not lose sight of the harsh reality of the risks that they face on a daily basis. We need to strengthen their capabilities to provide oversight and to be part of the decision-making processes. Bad elements among them need to be isolated and dealt with harshly. We should avoid generalising when pointing at corrupt officials in municipalities.
The department should move with speed to develop codes of conduct for senior managers. Even so, we should talk more about the frustrations of our people than about the frustrations of those in power. Both must be arrested. It can never be right, Minister, that we talk more about the weaknesses of our municipalities and less about their challenges. It can never be right that 15 years into democracy we still have people staying in mining holes at waste dumping sites such as those in the area of the Matlosana Municipality. It can never be right that our people still live in pigsty-like shacks, like the ones that we see here in the Western Cape, yet the DA has the nerve to tell us that the Western Cape is a little heaven. [Applause.]
Gee kans! [Just wait!]
Minister, we cannot lecture you on those challenges at the municipalities, for you know them better than most of us. But the situation in the North West needs a speedy solution, rather than engagement in the media, as seems to be happening now. It should not be enough for the department to be aware of problems of maladministration, lack of accountability and corruption, as already indicated in many municipalities across the country, with the North West and the Eastern Cape being cases in point. Ways and means should be devised to salvage these municipalities, without this being seen as encroachment or interference.
Like hawks hovering in the sky, monitoring their potential prey, our committee will do the same with all departments in executing its oversight work. We will provide support and make necessary criticisms as and when such are needed. Such criticism should be taken in the same spirit as when we are singing praises for any job well done.
There should be close collaboration, not only with parliamentary committees, but also with key sectors of the department. Together we can make sure that there is no space for laziness, corruption and all these bad things hindering service delivery. A situation such as the one that we experienced this morning, Minister, where instead of being given answers we were told to go and investigate, I should think is not the way to go, Deputy Minister. The directive from the President to do things differently, smarter and better is not only meant for ANC members and their supportive public servants, but it is also directed at all those who, by oath or affirmation, took up positions to serve the people of this country, and that includes the opposition.
Minister, true to your slogan, "many voices, one message", we should create no space for any uncalled-for discord from members of this broad church. As you conduct this choir in a competition for improved service delivery, improvement for a better life and the eradication of poverty, let us be cautious not to pitch our voices too high when singing about challenges and problems that are man-made, for we know amongst us there are those who do nothing but look for such musical discord. Our music should be so harmonious and sweet that our audience, and even our detractors and opposition, can do nothing but sing and dance along with us, for that is the purpose of music: to heal, to soothe, to bless and to uplift the spirit. That should be the kind of service we provide to our communities this time around.
The ANC, as a liberation movement, liberated not only the oppressed but even the oppressor. I was encouraged last week during the youth debate to hear hon Tim Harris from the DA acknowledging the fact that the youth of his generation benefited from the work of the class of 1976. I was actually shocked when he said that. I even said "Wow, he is in the wrong party", but on second thought, I realised that we need to recruit him to the ANC. It is young people like hon Harris who can teach old men like hon Watson how things are done. [Laughter.]
The ANC is elected by the people and its policies are derived from and driven by the people. It is about time that the DA realises that they cannot stop the leaders of the ANC. [Applause.]
As hon Mchunu comes to the podium, I want to congratulate him for being appointed as MEC responsible for local government, from being a Speaker. [Applause.] Congratulations, Mr Mchunu. [Interjections.] We will invite you to visit us.
Mr T W MCHUNU (KwaZulu-Natal): Thank you, Chairperson of the NCOP, for those comments, which are very lovely indeed.
Hon Chairperson, hon Minister, hon Deputy Minister, hon members of the House, colleagues, I want to start by congratulating the Minister on his appointment to this position, and also congratulate him for tabling such comprehensive and what also seem to be very balanced and developmental budget estimates of public expenditure for the Medium-Term Expenditure Framework period starting now.
For us in KwaZulu-Natal, it is indeed appropriate that we share your sentiments in accepting the new name of the department and also the new mandate that goes with it, because we believe this has been fairly scrutinised. It is most appropriate: it is a new year, it is a new mandate, it is a new government, and things must be done from a new perspective.
We have looked at the budget, and we certainly want to raise a few observations. We will raise them not because we are selfish, but from the perspective of our province.
Firstly, I want to refer to infrastructure development. In this province, we are the recipients of a huge part of the municipal infrastructure grant funding, but we are the first ones to cry that it is insufficient. We say it is insufficient because of experiences regarding the spending of this budget line. Our province is slightly different from other provinces. Its topography is one area to go by, which seriously undermines any form of developmental budget that may be put in. This has affected every aspect and type of development and every type of budget that has been applied to the province. It is therefore refreshing for us to notice that the budget has been increasing over the years and that it has increased again now. But we still wonder if it is going to fulfil its task.
We are worried in this area of work, because, importantly, it is in this area where public participation finds expression. For us public participation and empowerment form the basis and the cornerstone of the promotion of people-centred and sustainable local governance, which focuses on service delivery and is responsive to the needs of communities.
In this area, the costs for us in the provinces have been increasing over the years, but the challenges are further compounded by the latest focus on rural development. This focus demands that a lot more of the resources be allocated to development in the rural areas. Our main concern has always been that the more infrastructure we put in, the more resources we need to operate and maintain the infrastructure. We have found that this aspect is not adequately addressed.
We deal with municipalities, as you will know. You have certainly been in that province time and again; you know the area. You know the capacity of our municipalities in the rural areas. In some of these municipalities, the tax base is nonexistent. In others, the tax base is very limited. If you add the operating and maintenance costs of the infrastructure, which we help them put in, we are actually saying to municipalities that we are introducing infrastructure that will degenerate and that they will not be in a position to operate and maintain on their own at any given time without assistance from national and provincial government. We are saying these are areas we must address, both the area of funding and the area of capacitating these municipalities.
It is on this score, Minister, that we support your argument on debating the form our governance structures need to take. Whether you are talking about provinces or municipalities, there must be a debate, because in our view some of the municipalities are just not going to make it unless some reconfiguration is arrived at. We want to make an effective contribution in this regard. We also want to raise an issue that I believe does not affect many provinces the way it affects our own. When you talk to us about traditional leadership, you are not talking to us like you are talking to Gauteng. It is a different matter, with due respect to my colleagues in Gauteng. [Laughter.] It is a fact and a reality that we must accept. Gauteng can never boast the number of traditional leaders that we have. We have 271 traditional councils that have been recognised up to now. This is 271 out of an existing 302 traditional councils. There are still disputes amongst some of the communities, with the result that those traditional councils have not been recognised as yet. We have a debate to enter into there. We need to share your wisdom on how to deal with such matters, when it comes to the costs of running these municipalities.
I want to indicate to you that when we talk about traditional leadership and traditional affairs, we are not just talking about "amakhosi". The 271 out of 302 that I am referring to are just "amakhosi" and traditional councils. I have not spoken about "izinduna". I can certainly tell the Minister and the House that there are 1 200 "izinduna" whose stipends are also paid by the department. The costs of running these institutions are enormous for us. Therefore, based on our experience, and based on your experience, the new mandate and the new approach, it is appropriate that all of us engage in debates of this nature and engage in the realities that face us as a government, as well as the Department of Co-operative Governance and Traditional Affairs - which we fully endorse and support.
But, in respect of all I have said, I want to indicate to you, Mr Minister, that we have absolutely no qualms with your capabilities and that of your department. I want to indicate our province's unreserved support for the budget as it has been tabled. We want to engage further on many of the debates that have been raised in your speech, which we value and which we believe are appropriate. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Thank you, hon Chair. Hon Minister, hon Deputy Minister, hon Deputy Chair and hon Chief Whip, hon members and distinguished guests in the gallery, indeed it is a real privilege to stand here, but listening to and seeing the budget of this department, this new Ministry, I wonder whether we will make it. With the huge challenges that the councils are facing in this country, poverty and service delivery are real issues.
The problem that we are really facing here is that service delivery needs urgent attention and development. However, the very same money is often used to pay mayors and municipal managers that have been found guilty of mismanagement and corruption. We must speak truth to power. For example, the mayor in the municipality of Mier in the Northern Cape was found guilty of corruption and she lost her appeal but continues to serve as mayor. In Siyanda District Municipality, meanwhile, the municipal manager was given a golden handshake of almost R1 million after an investigation report, following an investigation that was conducted by a private firm, said he should be charged for the misuse of public funds and corruption. After he was given a golden handshake, he was appointed temporary municipal manager in Mier Local Municipality.
How seriously do we take our people at grass-roots level? Sol Plaatje Municipality already has seven disclaimers. What kind of message does this send to our people? We should not be surprised when the people barricade the roads and burn down the houses of councillors. Yet councillors are facing these challenges without any real support of any kind.
Hierdie Raad verteenwoordig die mense op voetsoolvlak en dit is hoekom ons moet kyk na hierdie enorme taak. Dienslewering is baie belangrik vir ons mense. Indien 'n mens na private grond kyk, is daar mense in die Noord-Kaap wat nie dienste ontvang nie, omdat hulle op private grond bly. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)
[This Council represents the people at grass-roots level and that is why we have to look at this huge undertaking. Service delivery is very important to our people. If one looks at private land, one will see that there are people in the Northern Cape who are not receiving services, as they are living on private land.] This department and this select committee must make sure that the people on private land who are not receiving water, electricity and houses, need to receive services. This is very important.
Another point of concern for the ID is the fact that an estimated 30% of councillors in South Africa are illiterate concerning finances. We need to train our councillors to understand budgets and to understand how finance systems are working, so that they can indeed serve the people. I thank you. [Applause.]