Hon Deputy Chairperson, hon Minister, hon members, comrades and distinguished guests, the ANC-led government has demonstrated its commitment to gender equality. The South African Constitution includes a Bill of Rights, which forbids discrimination on the grounds of gender, sex and sexual orientation, among other criteria. Success in achieving gender equality depends not only on the state and structures of government, but also on civil society.
The structures in civil society, women's organisations, women's groups, congressional budget offices, CBOs, religious bodies and professional bodies can all function as a means for citizens to exert an impact on social development, especially for those who are poor and marginalised, most of whom are likely to be women.
South Africa's Constitution is among the most progressive in the world and forbids discrimination on the grounds of gender, sexual orientation, race, class, age and creed.
In the last decade South Africa has undergone a major political transformation. The ending of apartheid and the installation of a democratically elected government has had major implications for gender policy and gender relations in the country.
Naturally, the new policies and laws have not overthrown a patriarchy or removed men from their domination of public life, politics and earnings. The real challenge still lies ahead in turning these steps into real changes in the daily lives of the majority of women. The alleviation of poverty and violence against women remain the two biggest challenges.
Among the yardsticks used to measure a society's respect for human rights and to evaluate the level of its maturity and generosity of the spirit is to look at the status that it accords to those members of society who are the most vulnerable: the disabled, senior citizens and children. People with disabilities, like everyone else, have aspirations to receive quality education and acquire valuable skills that will enable them to earn income and support themselves and their families.
They have the right to participate in sports, become active members of political organisations and generally participate in all activities that mirror the social life of the communities they come from without being discriminated against. Unfortunately, it would appear that people with disabilities are still largely excluded from the mainstream of society and experience difficulty in accessing fundamental rights. It should not be surprising that men in South Africa have responded in varying ways to shifts in gender power. Class and race remain major factors in society, while colonialism and apartheid have had differential impacts on men. The effects of globalisation need to be considered in conjunction with the legacy of colonialism and apartheid. The economy remains racially skewed, with distinctive gender features, as well. Black men are by and large limited to skilled and semi-skilled jobs in the cities.
Most women are underemployed or unemployed and many continue to live in the countryside. The break-up of apartheid through the 1980s gave small numbers of middle-class blacks access to white-collar work in the cities. The ending of apartheid in 1994 visibly changed the demography of the economy. A black middle class emerged, gaining access to state positions and slowly to the boardrooms of the corporate world.
The 15-year review tabled the policy unit in the Presidency in 2009 which looked at the effectiveness and efficiency of disability policy implementation in all spheres of government. It indicated that the advent of democracy in South Africa in 1994 had been instrumental in shaping transformation and social justice for women, children and people with disabilities. Several initiatives that were put in place by the ANC-led government to redress historical inequalities have impacted positively on the lives of women, children and persons with disabilities, and there is evidence of an improvement of their social conditions.
Whilst opportunities have increased, particularly in the provision of social support, there are still insufficient services and opportunities for women, children and people with disabilities to participate equally in society. The ANC's 3rd national general council meeting, held in Durban in September 2010, noted that insufficient attention is being paid to the needs of persons with disabilities and it recommended that: Firstly, all government officials and organs of state should be conscious of disability matters and the needs of persons with disabilities; secondly, that there should be investment in training programmes for persons with disabilities so as to prepare them for better participation in the labour market; and lastly, that an environment must be created that is sensitive to and affirms the needs and rights of people with disabilities.
Research studies revealed that many girls were not attending school on the days they were menstruating due to lack of affordable protection material. This meant that girls feared stigmatisation due to soiling themselves while at school. About 90% of poor women and girls did not use sanitary pads because they are expensive, but improvised with unhealthy materials such as newspapers and pieces of cloth.
Violence against women remains a serious problem. The high incidences of rape cases, as well as other forms of physical and psychological abuse of women and girls, are evidence of this. The criminal justice, safety and security systems are now beginning to deal with this crisis in a gender- sensitive manner. It will continue to be a major challenge, especially as it is compounded by its interrelation with poverty and HIV and Aids. Access to basic resources such as water and fuel has improved since 1994, but women's control over these resources is still not satisfactory. The lack of infrastructure in rural areas still acts as a barrier for women to gain easy access to basic resources.
Over the past 17 years the ANC has done a lot to ensure that services are not only accessible to the people at large, but that through special policies targeted at the advancement of people with disabilities, they are able to benefit fully and enjoy the same rights as the general population. Such targeted policies include the allocation of houses that have special accessibility and safety features to accommodate the particular needs of persons with various forms of disabilities as part of the prioritisation of the most vulnerable in the provision of housing under the national housing scheme.
Chairperson, it is the critical objective of Programme 4 of this Budget Vote to ensure the progressive realisation of the rights of people with disabilities by reviewing and facilitating amendments to policies and legislation by March 2012; developing and maintaining a monitoring and evaluation framework for the rights of people with disabilities over the Medium-Term Expenditure Framework, MTEF, period; adapting continental and international instruments for people with disabilities in local initiatives over the MTEF period; developing and managing projects for the rights and responsibilities of people with disabilities in line with constitutional and international mandates over the MTEF period; facilitating public- private partnerships in the interests of people with disabilities over the MTEF period; and co-ordinating and participating in forums on the rights of people with disabilities regionally and internationally.
Between 2007 and 2008, and between 2010 and 2011, expenditure increased from R3,7 million to R8,6 million for Programme 4. Over the medium-term, expenditure is expected to increase by R5,6 million to R14,2 million.
In conclusion, I would like us all to remember that South Africa is in the process of a transition. Deputy Chairperson, the committee supports the Budget Vote. I thank you. [Applause.]
Deputy Chairperson, it is an honour to participate in this debate today, especially when the focus is on women, children and people with disabilities.
When President Zuma announced the formation of the Ministry of Women, Children and People with Disabilities, it was welcomed by the DA, with the hope that this new Ministry was going to put the rights of women and children at the centre of government policy.
With the appointment of the new Minister to the Ministry of Women, Children and People with Disability, the DA welcomes the capacity-building changes that the Minister has made and hopes that these changes transform the conditions that women, children and people with disabilities ...
Chairperson, I am listening to the speaker, but I do not understand. Is she speaking on behalf of her province or is she speaking on behalf of the DA? Which one is it?
I am speaking on behalf of the province, but the DA is the government there.
South Africa has a Constitution that relates really well to women's rights and gender equality. This Ministry has a mandate to address issues such as the empowerment of women, the challenges and the needs of people with disabilities and the continuing scourge of violence against women and children.
The responsibility of ensuring that South Africa complies with the protocols on gender, child rights and disability is also situated within this Ministry. Under the leadership of Premier Helen Zille, the Western Cape government has taken real action to address the problem of maintenance defaulters.
During the campaign in 2010, notable successes were achieved in the Western Cape in the child maintenance campaign during the 16 Days of Activism for No Violence Against Women and Children period. During that period 71 defaulters were found and 59 arrests were made.
About 210 women were traced who did not collect money that was owed to them. In addition to these successes, the campaign also generated awareness and became an incentive for men to pay maintenance.
In terms of the campaign, our plan is to roll this out on a long-term basis so that it continues to benefit women and children in the province. Premier Helen Zille wrote to the national Minister of Justice and Constitutional Development at the beginning of this year regarding this matter, but she has not yet received any feedback. We will appreciate it if the Minister attends to that.
The premier stated in her 2011-12 Budget Vote speech that her office had received many reports from women who stated that their children's fathers had started paying maintenance again for fear of being tracked down and named in the campaign.
The purpose of the 16 Days of Activism for No Violence Against Women and Children campaign is to communicate the message that parents have a responsibility to their children. In order for children to have all the opportunities in life, and for them to succeed, there must be adequate financial support.
Women face many obstacles and challenges in South African society, and issues such as poverty, unemployment, reducing HIV infection rates and the transmission of HIV from mother to child, are some of the ills that render women vulnerable and marginalised.
Teenage pregnancy is one of the huge problems that impacts on the advancement of women in society today. The effect of teenage pregnancy is even harsher when the young female is living in poverty, and when the child is conceived outside a loving and stable relationship with the father.
It is for this reason that a more inclusive approach to addressing this problem is needed. Teenage pregnancy is not just a female issue or problem. Men must be part of the discussion to find ways to address these problems and come up with solutions to alleviate the circumstances under which the mother and father might be living, and in which the child is to be raised.
It is with this problem in mind that the Department of the Premier in the Western Cape has started with the Teenage Pregnancy Prevention project, as part of the human rights support. This project focuses on young people and their parents to empower them in preventing teenage pregnancies in our communities. This project also involves dialogue with young women and boys in order to create awareness. Sorry for that, Chairperson.
THE DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Ms T C Memela): Hon member, it is a restricted area. Please, if someone else has forgotten to switch off their phones, please do so now.
I apologise for that, Chairperson.
This project focuses on young people and their parents to empower them in preventing teenage pregnancies in our communities. This project also involves dialogue with young men and boys in order to create awareness that they have a contribution to make in the prevention of teenage pregnancy. There is a growing awareness that early childbearing has multiple consequences with regard to maternal health, child health and the overall wellbeing of society. Thus, the prevention of unwanted teenage pregnancy is one of the key goals of the Western Cape government.
Another focus of the Western Cape government is the programme that aims at combating alcohol and drug abuse. It becomes an even bigger burden when the young female, who is already living in poverty, might be unemployed and pregnant and then starts abusing alcohol or drugs.
The Western Cape government takes a transversal approach to addressing the problem of substance abuse. In the past year, two new drug treatment centres have been opened and a new school-based outpatient treatment programme has been started. The prevention of the abuse of substances is part of addressing the challenges facing children in society today.
Apart from addressing challenges such as poverty and nutrition, the awareness of substance abuse is very important. With this in mind, programmes such as the Chrysalis Academy model are important. It identifies youth at risk of abusive or violent behaviour and allows them to undergo a residential programme for three months before they re-enter their communities to make a positive impact on them.
One of the most affected groups serviced by this Ministry is children. Too often it is said that children are the future of the country. Yet, these vulnerable and innocent young people are in danger, get hurt and are robbed of their rights.
Children have the right to develop to their full potential, as well as the right to survival and protection. Thus, a protective environment must be created in which children are safe from abuse and exploitation and able to develop. Nelson Mandela once said, "There can be no keener revelation of a society's soul than the way in which it treats its children."
Society has the responsibility to ensure that children are not becoming and remaining the vulnerable group that the research is already calling them. For children to prosper, opportunities for them to develop in a safe and stable environment must be created. Addressing the challenges that children face must often also be addressed at other levels, and other problem areas must be approached more inclusively.
For example, to offer a child a more secure and stable environment in which to develop, substance abuse, teenage pregnancy, violence against women and children, maintenance, education, etc must all be addressed and approached as part of the problem and the solution.
Young women and girl-children are often part of the target group of human trafficking, and everything possible must be done in order to address and curb the problem.
Our Constitution safeguards the rights of all citizens in South Africa, and one may not discriminate, directly or indirectly, against disabled people. However, discrimination still prevents disabled people from becoming full members of society who can enjoy the benefits and the rights that have been bestowed upon them as citizens. Many of the statutes must be reviewed in order to allow disabled people to access and enjoy their constitutional rights.
In conclusion, I like the Minister's idea in the opening of her speech, addressing the rural areas, because I am also from a rural area in the Western Cape. Thank you. [Applause.]
Chairperson, hon Minister, all hon members present, I firstly wish to thank the Minister and her department for the various presentations to our committee.
Chairperson, it would be remiss of me not to acknowledge the major role that the late Mama Albertina Sisulu played in establishing the status of women and children in the government structures. If you strike a woman, you strike a rock. Indeed, women are the mothers of our nation.
Chairperson, the aim of the Department of Women, Children and People with Disabilities is to drive, accelerate and oversee government's equity, equality and empowerment agenda for women, children and persons with disabilities, especially those in the poor and rural communities. The previous national Office on the Status of Women, OSW, the Office on the Status of Disabled Persons, OSDP, and the Office on the Rights of the Child, ORC, were all incorporated into this relatively new department which only started operating as a separate entity from November 2010. The budget of this department has increased from R106 million in the 2010- 11 financial year to R118 million in the 2011-12 financial year at a real rate of 6,02%.
The Women Empowerment and Gender Equality programme consumes 55% of the budget. Since this is a new department, a large proportion of the budget is allocated to current payments, 57,3% of which will be used for the compensation of employees. The budget is hopelessly inadequate for the co- ordination and the work this department must oversee. The strategic plan of this department for 2011 to 2015 acknowledges that the department is not a service delivery department, but works with other government departments to monitor and to evaluate how its policies and priorities are being implemented.
The department will therefore have to exercise sufficient influence over the other government departments in order to achieve its aims and objectives. This is where the major challenge lies. The department aims to improve capacity implementation of policy across all three spheres of government. Many departments will be involved, including local government police, health, justice, welfare and social development, to name just a few.
Who will be held to account for the scarcity and the nonexistence of safe houses or places of safety for abused women particularly in the rural areas; or for the role that alcohol and drug abuse contributes to a violent society or the lack of psychologists and lack of social workers in poorer areas?
Women and children with special needs such as the blind, the mentally challenged and the disabled require much assistance. How many state-owned buildings are still not accessible to disabled persons? Are there 50 or 1 500? The Department of Public Works is utilised by the various state departments for various contracts, but the funding is provided by the department concerned. Funds follow function.
Will the various departments allocate money from their own budgets for the policies of the Department of Women, Children and People with Disabilities? Will other departments and provinces comply with the 2% employment targets for people with disabilities, for example? Only Gauteng - so I hear - is anywhere near to complying.
Chairperson, the department is in the process of developing a Gender Equality Bill, which will enforce the implementation of programmes related to women. The department will have to ensure that any new legislation is effectively implemented. The Domestic Violence Act, Act 116 of 1998, is not enforced and there is very little or no compliance. There is a lack of training around the Act by the police, and women are often ignored or taken back to their husbands, where they are physically or mentally abused once more.
Public-private partnerships and various nongovernmental organisations have throughout the years supported delivery on the rights and socioeconomic development of women, children and persons with disabilities. It is important that these partnerships are encouraged and strengthened.
It has been noted that this department has now moved from the governance cluster to the social cluster in so far as budget is concerned. However, it is unclear at this stage as to what the budget implications will be now or in the future.
South Africa is listed at the international level as one of the most progressive countries with regard to the protection of the rights of women, children and persons with disabilities. The challenge is to translate that into daily reality. Does this department really have the authority to hold all relevant sectors accountable, or is this department only a talk shop? How much longer must women, children and persons with disabilities still wait to get the services delivered to improve their lives? Indeed, the Department of Women, Children and People with Disabilities and relevant stakeholders owe it to the nation to make a difference in the daily lives of these people, especially in the poor and rural communities of South Africa.
Aluta Continua! [The struggle continues!] May the struggle continue for the disabled. I thank you. [Applause.]
Hon Worth, we are pleased that you remembered Aluta Continua. [Laughter.]
Hon Deputy Chairperson, hon Minister, hon members and guests, human rights are for everyone. Women's rights are human rights.
We read almost daily about the young women who are victims of corrective rape. Last week it was reported on national television that a young woman was stabbed in Gugulethu, Cape Town. Two days before that we saw on our television screens a young woman buried in Tembisa, Gauteng.
What do these two incidents have in common? Both women are lesbians. It is estimated that three out of ten corrective rapes a week take place in Cape Town alone.
We do not hear the Department of Women, Children and People with Disabilities condemning these brutal acts. We, as Cope, would like to know whether the Ministry has taken any steps to influence monitoring and evaluation of the Departments of Justice and Constitutional Development and Correctional Services' handling of corrective rape. Has the Minister taken any steps to influence the South African government to prioritise the issue of corrective rape?
I would like to remind this House of the first case of corrective rape to gain national prominence in South Africa. In 2006, Zoliswa Nkonyana, 19 years of age, was clubbed, stoned and beaten to death by a mob of young men. The nine men accused of murder have still not been sentenced. The court keeps adjourning. This trial has been postponed 32 times.
Deputy Chairperson, violence against women is unacceptable and must not be tolerated. It is well-documented that gender inequalities and human rights violations continue to put women and girls at risk of HIV infection. Violence against women and girls robs them of their dignity. Worldwide, HIV is a leading cause of death and disease amongst women of reproductive age, ie between 15 and 49 years of age. Here at home, HIV prevalence in the 30 to 34-year-old age group increased to 41,5% in 2009.
HIV-positive women and girls lack information on sexual and reproductive health. They have restricted options when it comes to their sexuality. They need an adequate and friendly support system. This will enable them to make free decisions about their sexuality without being discriminated against.
What action has the Ministry taken to mainstream HIV-positive women's empowerment? Chairperson, our country is at war with its women and children. I thank you. [Applause.]
Hon Chairperson, hon Minister, hon members of the NCOP, director-general of the department and officials, ladies and gentlemen, before I start with my speech, let me remind the member from the Western Cape that she is not a member of the executive nor Helen Zille's spokesperson. This debate is not about social development or health. [Laughter.] I just wanted to remind her about that. [Interjections.]
This debate takes place in this historic month of June, which is dedicated to remembering the heroic struggles conducted by the youth of our country against apartheid oppression. The struggle of today's youth are about high unemployment, health issues such as HIV and Aids, lack of skills and economic opportunities, and widespread drug and alcohol abuse. All these affect the quality of life of our youth today and have disastrous consequences for the country's development, both economically and socially.
Although at face value this Budget Vote is about women, children and people with disabilities, in essence its outcomes have a direct bearing and impact on the lives of young people as a whole. The youth form the majority of our country's population, and therefore what gets done for children relates to their future as young people. It is for this reason that in this debate we have to concern ourselves equally with the plight of our youth.
Of all the variables that determine the quality of life of young people, education, skills and job opportunities are central and must get preference. In this context, this year's rallying call of "Job Creation" by the President of the Republic rings true for youth development. Our message from this House to the nation should be: "Let us give priority to our youth for skills development and job creation". The future prosperity of our country is dependent on the amount and quality of the development investment we make towards our youth today, for they are the custodians of that future.
As has been indicated in numerous studies, the biggest challenge facing the youth of today is the high rate of unemployment. Estimates from various studies show that about 73% of all the people who are unemployed in the country are young people. This has to be seen within the context of the estimated total rate of unemployment of between 24% and 35% of the economically active population. The magnitude of youth unemployment has, in turn, exacerbated its associated problems, such as high levels of poverty, increasing rates of underage and youth pregnancies, alcohol and drug abuse, crime, and in recent times, increasing numbers of child-headed households. Youth unemployment has also contributed to an increased number of young people of various vulnerable categories who are now catered for by the social security system to pull them out of the poverty trap.
The Department of Women, Children and People with Disabilities must take careful steps towards ensuring that women, children and people with disabilities are catered for. There must be no compromise on that, hon Minister. We must give them priority in an imperative for their development.
Human Sciences Research Council reports, international studies and benchmarks have identified the following reasons why we need to focus on women, children and people with disabilities. Their increasing interconnectedness means that they comprise significant local, regional and national constituencies. Creating livelihood opportunities for women, children and people with disabilities helps break the cycle of intergenerational poverty. With human capital as the trading currency, there are long-term socioeconomic benefits for improving the health, education and social capacities of women and persons with disabilities. Five of the eight Millennium Development Goals, MDGs, speak directly of the need to improve the situation of women and people with disabilities. Failure to do so can be disadvantageous for women and people with disabilities.
As the ANC we have historically recognised the important role of women and people with disabilities in society and development. The ANC has always served as a school and training ground for women to be developed in society.
The adoption of the government policy constituted a big step forward in the development of the youth of our country. The framework recommended a number of policy interventions to promote their participation in the economy, enhancing their employability by familiarising them with the expectations and requirements of the world of work by the time they leave the education system.
As we compared provinces with regard to children who are not attending school, we discovered that many children are not at school in the Western Cape, particularly in coloured areas. We call on the department to intensify its working relationship with the Department of Social Development, and to take care of centres that are not resourced, particularly in the rural areas. We also call on the department to check on security measures at such centres in the rural areas, because one finds that certain social activities are taking place there.
Let me take this opportunity to appreciate the fact that employment within the department is fully gender balanced if one looks at the senior managerial position - as opposed to Helen Zille's cabinet, which is mainly composed of men. We need to create an environment that makes women become productive citizens who participate fully in the development of our society. The ANC supports this Budget Vote. Thank you. [Applause.]
The MINISTER OF WOMEN, CHILDREN AND PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES: Thank you, Chairperson. I would like to thank all the members who have made valuable contributions enriching our debate.
I want to agree with hon Qikane that, indeed, violence against women is a scourge in our country and this is why we have proposed that we set up an advisory council so that we can work together and put together all our resources as NGOs, the relevant government departments, women's organisations and provinces so that each one does not work in their corner in their silo alone. We should all pull together and ensure that we are focused; as in the case of the SA National Aids Council, Sanac, which draws together NGOs and organs of society and government to pull together. And indeed today we are receiving kudos with regard to our response to the HIV/Aids pandemic.
We have seen that the UN reports state that the pandemic is going down worldwide; the pandemic is also going down in South Africa. [Applause.] Very close to us is the transmission from mother to child; we have thousands of babies in South Africa that were born HIV-positive, but because in the past two years we have stepped up the strategy, implementation, prevention and treatment we have seen that transmission come down to 3%. We are still going to continue to work hard to ensure that we fight that scourge. We will be working with Sanac, using their implemented strategies against HIV, and we will use similar strategies to fight the scourge of violence and abuse.
I also want to say that we are promoting inclusive education to ensure that children with disabilities are not marginalised and isolated in our communities, but become part of the mainstream. However, we accept that there are children who are severely disabled; who need special schools. Therefore, we shall also promote those schools in order for those children to gain access to education, medical treatment and be able to grow and realise their full potential as human beings.
On the point of violence, hon members, we are working very closely with the Department of Justice and Constitutional Development, the Department of Police and the National Prosecuting Authority, NPA. We support the Thuthuzela Care Centres. To date we have 28 Thuthuzela Care Centres which have put together a doctor, a counsellor, a social worker, a lawyer, a prosecutor, and a nurse to make sure that this is a one-stop centre where victims come to get counselled, treated for HIV/Aids, unwanted pregnancies and to get advice. If they want to lay a charge there is a lawyer and a prosecutor. We want to have more of these Thuthuzela Care Centres, particularly in the hot spots where there is the highest incidence of violence against women and children. We are also working with the SAPS; they are training police and raising awareness about how they should treat victims of rape and abuse - many of whom are women and children.
We have also seen that they have employed forensic social workers in each of the 176 policing areas. They have also re-established the child protection unit and the family protection unit and they have added these forensic social workers to assist children - because children are not able to give evidence in order to develop a case properly so that there can be a speedy conviction. Through these trained social workers and the Thuthuzela Care Centres, we are able to improve.
They have also been able to deal with those dockets that get lost because they are bought. They make sure that they have copies of these dockets somewhere in a server to ensure that once a docket is lost they develop a new one immediately. As a result, there is no excuse for a case not proceeding.
We are also working on the issue of corrective rape; we believe that this is a crime. These are criminals; nobody has a right to decide anybody's sexual orientation. Women have a right to choose if they want to be lesbian or not. Therefore, the Minister of Justice and Constitutional Development has taken up this matter. He has set up a task team - our department is part of that task team and members of the gay and lesbian rights groups are represented in that task team - to find ways of dealing with these crimes in a speedy manner and to address the concerns of gays and lesbians regarding this crime.
We are very happy that hon Hartnick and hon Worth respect and recognise Nelson Mandela and Mama Sisulu; they are two of our great leaders. I hope they remember that Nelson Mandela was a member of the ANC Youth League, that he joined the ANC at a very young age and has said he will die in the ANC. Recently he said to Mama Sisulu, "Please send my regards to Oliver Tambo, Walter Sisulu and all my friends in heaven and tell them I am also going to join the ANC branch when I come to heaven." So I would like to invite the hon members to join the ANC. [Applause.] [Interjections.]
I also want to say that Nelson Mandela was the Commander in Chief of uMkhonto weSizwe.
Lastly, hon members, I want to say that we are doing very well as far as the MDGs are concerned. We have reached parity, which is one of the demands for MDG 3, and we have even reached parity in our schools. We have more girls than boys at school in South Africa today. We were expected to reach 50% by 2015, but we have already done better than that; even at tertiary level, we have more girls than boys. I am sure some of them are sitting there upstairs.
The concern we have is that most of them focus on humanities and the arts. We do not have many girls who are doing science, technology and engineering. We have started a project called the Technogirls which is supported by government and Unicef - where we take our girls at Grades 11 and 12 and expose them to the mining industry, computer technology and aeroplanes through Airports Company South Africa, Acsa. Through exposure to that kind of technology, they can begin to have an interest in the sciences and the technological spheres. The project is supported by Unicef and the Departments of Basic Education, Higher Education and Training and our department.
We started in Limpopo, North West and Gauteng, and we are now going to roll out that project in all the provinces.
Hon member ...
The MINISTER OF WOMEN, CHILDREN AND PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES: Thank you very much. I just want to say to hon Hartnick that women are in charge in the ANC. They are in charge in all our provinces. It is only in the Western Cape that women are not in charge. I would like the hon member to talk to her premier, as a woman, and ask her to recognise other women and put them in the leadership of this province. I thank you. [Applause.] [Interjections.]
Debate concluded.