Z.

NOES - 78: Adams, L H; Alberts, A D; Berend, S R; Boinamo, G G; Bosman, L L; Coetzee, T W; Davidson, I O; De Freitas, M S F; Diemu, B C; Dreyer, A M; Du Toit, N D; Duncan, P C; Eloff, E H; Esau, S; Ferguson, B D; Gcume, N P; George, M E; Greyling, L W; Groenewald, P J; Harris, T; Hill-Lewis, G G; Hoosen, M H; James, W G; Kalyan, S V; Kganare, D A; Kilian, J D; Kloppers- Lourens, J C; Kohler-Barnard, D; Koornhof, N J J v R; Kopane, S P; Krumbock, G R; Lamoela, H; Lee, T D; Lekota, M G P; Lorimer, J R B; Lovemore, A T; Mackenzie, G P D; Madisha, W M; Marais, S J F; Mazibuko, L D; McGluwa, J J; Michael, N W A; Mileham, K J; Mnqasela, M; More, E; Mosimane, C K K; Motau, S C; Mubu, K S; Mulder, P W A; Mulder, C P; Nhanha, M A; Njobe, M A A; Ollis, I M; Paulse, S; Rabie, P J; Ramatlakane, L; Robinson, D; Rogers, F A; Ross, D C; Schafer, D A; Schmidt, H C; Selfe, J; Shinn, M R; Smiles, D C; Steenhuisen, J H; Steyn, A; Steyn, A C; Stubbe, D J; Swart, S N; Swart, M; Swathe, M M; Van den Berg, N J; Van Der Linde, N J; Van Der Westhuizen, A P; Van Dyk, S M; Van Schalkwyk, H C; Waters, M; Watson, A.

Madam Deputy Speaker, may I address you? I would like to know as to what the delay is. Is there a problem with the voting system? I think it is only fair that the House be informed of the delay.

If I knew what the delay was, I would say. They are still looking at the summary. I will only know when it is given to me.

Hon Deputy Speaker? [Interjections.]

Order, hon members! The delay was caused through reconciling the number of hands to the names on the list. All the names that didn't seem to be here are recorded, so all the names of those members who voted and whose hands were up are on the list.

The results of the division are as follows. [Interjections.] Order, hon members!

There are 224 ``Ayes'', 78 ``Noes'', and there are no abstentions. [Applause.]

Vote accordingly agreed to.

Hon Deputy Speaker?

Yes.

We just wanted to make sure that the hon Chief Whip of the Majority Party's voting system worked this time. [Laughter.]

Can we be serious for once?

Vote No 2 - Parliament - put.

Declarations of vote:

Deputy Speaker, we just want to say that, as Cope, we support this Budget Vote. We believe it is a very important Vote, and we would support all measures that are put in place to ensure that we can conduct our oversight role very effectively. That includes the appointment of more legal advisers to support Parliament, precisely for the reason that the hon Ramatlakane said - that we cannot have a Parliament where we have sweetheart questions to the executive and sweetheart oversight. We would like to have very effective oversight and we would consequently support all such measures that the Presiding Officers are taking to make us a fully fledged constitutional democracy. Thank you.

Deputy Speaker, firstly, let me highlight that, in light of the Budget Vote that is before us, we are hoping that as we move towards the conclusion of this term, political parties will support Parliament's intention to upgrade the system that is in the House. It has been tabled before the Chief Whips' Forum and parties have not agreed to the upgrading of the system, which will use thumbprints, and will improve how we operate and work effectively. The ANC has supported the upgrading of this system and we hope that all parties will come on board so that Parliament can function effectively and avoid the delays that we are experiencing today.

Secondly, I want to talk about the issue of Parliament's work. We are doing our work; there aren't any sweetheart questions or sweetheart oversight. [Interjections.] If we were to say members are asking sweetheart questions and are doing sweetheart oversight then, looking at the work that we have managed to do, that would not have resulted in the work that we've seen in the oversight interventions that have drastically changed the lives of communities.

We do urge that parliamentary law adviser posts be established, as the Speaker has committed to doing, so that the work can enhance what we are doing. Thank you.

Vote agreed to (Democratic Alliance, Independent Democrats and Freedom Front Plus dissenting). Vote No 3 - Co-operative Governance and Traditional Affairs - put.

Declarations of vote:

Madam Deputy Speaker, I support the Budget Vote. Firstly, I would like it to be put on record that, on 30 November 2000, a committee was set up, chaired by our present President, His Excellency, Mr Zuma. The committee consisted of Ministers, amakhosi and some of the senior lawyers. An agreement was concluded that, in order to prevent the obliteration of the powers and functions of amakhosi in traditional areas, Chapters 7 and 12 of the Constitution would have to be amended. That solemn agreement has never been implemented.

Secondly, we have had a grievance in the sense that all traditional councils have no budgets.

With that said, I support the Budget Vote. But I want that registered for this Parliament, not for posterity. Thank you.

Madam Deputy Speaker, it was very clear from the Minister's interaction during the extended public committees that the department does not have a clear plan to meet the objectives which it had set out in this budget. Operation Clean Audit is now a distant fantasy, and anybody who thinks that we are going to meet the targets which were set would also probably believe in fairies and unicorns.

What we don't see yet is a plan to radically intervene and ensure that there is a consequence framework for local governments and municipalities that do not achieve the goals of Operation Clean Audit.

The slogan of the department is, "Local government is everybody's business" and that is absolutely correct. The problem, however, is that we have councillors and officials who have taken this literally and used municipal councils as their own personal businesses.

A classic case in point is in eThekwini Municipality where the Chief Whip of the municipality, Councillor Xulu, did R8,5 million worth of business with the council two financial years ago. He got a slap on the wrist of a small fine, with the consequence that he repeat-offended, and has done even more millions of rands worth of business with the council again.

We have a lack of action on corruption. The Anti-corruption Inspectorate, which the Minister announced to some fanfare years ago, has still not had any massive achievements and rampant corruption is still a problem in too many municipalities. The sad thing about this is that this corruption hurts the poorest in our country the most, who have to suffer because of a lack of service delivery.

We have no confidence that the Minister or his department will match up to the expectations which the budget sets out. This, as said again, was very clear during the budget process. We have too many councils in too many provinces which are collapsing and simply unable to deliver services that they need to deliver to the communities on the ground. We do not see the department or the Minister providing a clear plan out of these woods. Thank you. [Applause.]

Chairperson, Co-operative Governance and Traditional Affairs stands central to achieving the National Development Plan 2030 objectives. Notwithstanding the importance these two departments, especially to communities, Cope has to take a position and make a statement in objecting to this Vote.

In his 2009 state of the nation address, President Zuma promised a more interactive government. In October of the same year, violent protests erupted. Municipalities continue to fail communities. The Auditor-General's report testifies to this poor performance. Currently, the unemployment rate is at 26% in the country; 18% of the population live in informal dwellings, 27% do not have piped water in their homes; 12% do not have flush toilets and 9% use pit toilets. This is degrading to people's dignity after 20 years of liberation.

We are concerned about the level of corruption, poor administration and lack of monitoring and evaluation processes. For these reasons, Cope cannot support this Budget Vote. Our communities are being let down. Cope feels so strongly about this betrayal that, as a result, we cannot and will not support Budget Vote No 3.

Adjunkspeaker, die agb Minister het in sy begrotingstoespraak ges dit gaan goed op plaaslike regeringsvlak. Hy het eintlik gespog daarmee. Wat is die werklikheid? Die werklikheid is dat plaaslike regering in 'n krisis is. Hoe kan die Minister s dit gaan goed op plaaslike regeringsvlak as byvoorbeeld al die munisipaliteite in Noord- Wes tans ondersoek word deur die Spesiale Ondersoekeenheid vir bedrog, vir diefstal, vir wanadministrasie? Hoe kan dit dan goed gaan? (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[Mr P J GROENEWALD: Deputy Speaker, in his budget speech the hon Minister said that it is going well at local government level. He actually boasted about it. What is the reality? The reality is that local government is in crisis. How can the Minister say that it is going well at local government level when all the municipalities in North West for example are currently being investigated by the Special Investigating Unit for fraud, for theft, for maladministration? How can it possibly go well?]

I want to say to the hon Minister that the biggest threat to a department and the surest way that that department can collapse is when the Minister is in denial. Hon Minister, you are in denial; local government is in a crisis. Net verlede week moes die Matlosana-munisipaliteit kragtariewe tot 27% verhoog het om te sorg dat die boeke klop. Nie 'n enkele munisipaliteit het 'n skoon oudit gekry nie. Adjunkspeaker, plaaslike regering is in 'n gemors. Dit is in 'n krisis, en die VF Plus sal nie hierdie begrotingspos ondersteun nie. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[Just last week the Matlosana Municipality had to increase electricity tariffs to 27% to ensure that the books balance. Not a single municipality received a clean audit. Deputy Speaker, local government is in a mess. It is in crisis, and the FF Plus will not support this Vote.]

Deputy Speaker, the ANC supports Budget Vote No 3 on Co- operative Governance and Traditional Affairs.

I am so amazed today at the parties that are saying that they are opposed to the Budget Vote, namely Cope, DA and FF Plus, which means that they are coming with two tongues to this House. Inside the House they say that they are opposing the Budget Vote. This means that they are denying access to service delivery to the people out there, but then they will go to the same communities that they are denying access to service delivery by opposing this Budget Vote, and ask for their votes. [Interjections.]

The ANC-led government has made significant progress in wrestling with these deep historic injustices of the past. Local government is at the coalface of service delivery. Yes, we agree. There are challenges but, despite all those challenges, we acknowledge the achievements and interventions that the department has made. For instance, there is a Municipal Infrastructure Support Agency that has been established to assist municipalities in terms of technical support. We support also this financial Budget Vote so that this department can support the 23 district municipalities identified by the department and the 107 municipalities in terms of governance and financial management.

We welcome the turnaround strategy which will come with all the 11 volumes that will speak to each and every province. We also welcome the establishment of municipal public accounts committees, Mpacs, public account committees, and internal audit committees, in order for them to monitor and assist municipalities in terms of the effective use of public funds. The partnership with private institutions ... [Interjections.] Once again, the ANC supports Budget Vote No 3. Thank you. [Time expired.] [Applause.]

Vote agreed to (Democratic Alliance, Congress of the People, Independent Democrats and Freedom Front Plus dissenting).

Vote No 4 - Home Affairs - put and agreed to. Vote No 5 - International Relations and Co-operation - put.

Declaration of vote:

Madam Deputy Speaker, now that the Minister is also here, I simply want to restate what would seem obvious at face value: that the unity government in Zimbabwe should not really exist in perpetuity; there must be elections at some point.

However, if fair and free elections are to take place, and successfully, as the President said, the outstanding arrangements or conditions such as the impartiality of the security forces, freedom of the media and freedom of movement of the voters ought to be assured in the interests of all the parties concerned.

Furthermore, we also commend the Southern African Development Community, SADC's recent position on this issue of Zimbabwe, although there are also some indications that the constitutional court in Zimbabwe may not want to create precedence in reviewing the situation of 31 July. However, we wish President Mugabe a successful intervention with the constitutional court so that other parties can be satisfied. Thank you.

Vote agreed to. (Democratic Alliance and Independent Democrats dissenting). Vote No 6 - Performance Monitoring and Evaluation - put and agreed to.

Vote No 7 - Public Works - put.

Declarations of vote:

Hon Deputy Speaker, when the new Minister was appointed, we thought that that would bring in some fresh air. What we were not aware of was that it was air from the passage. The department is in a shambles, the same way as it was with the previous Ministers.

Almost all the departments complain about the Department of Public Works when we talk about infrastructure and nondelivery. What is very clear is that the department should at least be called the ``Department of Nkandla'' because the only time they rise and do something is when Nkandla is mentioned. [Interjections.]

However, when you go to any government department, you will find that the departments are complaining about the services they are supposed to get from the Department of Public Works, including Parliament. We are the only Parliament in the world where the lifts fall whilst there are people inside and the Department of Public Works says nothing. Therefore, Cope will not support this Budget Vote. Thank you. [Applause.]

Deputy Speaker, first of all, the IFP supports the budget. However, the Department of Public Works, the custodian and the manager of the state's immovable assets, has failed again and again in its mandate. Systematic departmental flaws remain unresolved year after year and the immovable asset register must be brought up to date.

How can the department not know the extent of its assets here and abroad, because that would be one of its basic functions? What is the department doing to collect the money owed to it by the other client departments? What extent of the department's own land is not being used? How many schools have been built since 1994 by the Department of Public Works? What areas of land does the government own that are currently available for human settlement? How many land parcels have been registered? How many land parcels are owned by foreigners? Do we have functioning asset registers in other countries?

These are some of the questions that have to be answered by the department if we want to start implementing the turnaround strategy and be a successful department with a clean audit. I thank you.

Adjunkspeaker, in die begrotingsdebat het ek aan die agb Minister ges dat daar 'n verantwoordelikheid op hom rus om te verseker dat die mense van Suid-Afrika - die belastingbetalers, veral - kan insae verkry in die Nkandla-verslag. Die agb Minister het toe gereageer. Hy s vir my ek is oorhaastig. Hy s vir my ek moet wag. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[Mr P J GROENEWALD: Deputy Speaker, in the budget debate I told the hon Minister that it's his responsibility to ensure that the people of South Africa - especially the taxpayers, get access to the Nkandla report. The hon Minister did respond then. He said to me that I am in too great a hurry. He said to me that I must wait.]

Hon Minister, I had read your mind. I knew you would not make it public ...

... want die verslag word nou verwys na die Gesamentlike Staande Komitee oor Intelligensie wat 'n geslote vergadering is. Die mense en die belastingbetalers van Suid-Afrika weet nog steeds nie wat staan in die Nkandla-verslag nie. Ek wil s die agb Minister mislei homself as hy dink deur die verslag vir die Gesamentlike Staande Komitee oor Intelligensie te gee, is dit geopenbaar, want niemand word daar toegelaat behalwe die lede van die Intelligensie nie. Agb Minister, solank u nie daardie verslag bekendmaak nie, sal die VF Plus nie u begrotingspos ondersteun nie. Ons is daarteen. Dankie. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[... because the report is now referred to the Joint Standing Committee on Intelligence which is a closed meeting. The people and the taxpayers of South Africa still do not know what is in the Nkandla report. I want to say the hon Minister is misleading himself if he thinks by giving the report to the Joint Standing Committee on Intelligence it is made public, because no one is allowed there except the members of Intelligence. Hon Minister, as long as you are not making the report public, the FF Plus will not support your Budget Vote. We are against it. Thank you.]

Madam Deputy Speaker, the Department of Public Works does not have a reliable asset management record. The Department of Public Works cannot collect the money that is owed to it by its client departments. The Department of Public Works cannot manage a proper supply chain.

However, the Department of Public Works can spend more than R200 million on the private home of one person. Therefore, the DA will not support this Budget.

Hon Deputy Speaker, I don't know whether it is unparliamentary to say hon Dreyer regurgitates what she had not eaten because she never attended any of the meetings that we had to deliberate on this budget.

The Portfolio Committee on Public Works believes that the turnaround strategy of the Department of Public Works focuses on ensuring that the department fulfils its mandate. Part of the strategy includes the following: The recalling of retired engineers to provide the required technical skills in the department; the reopening of the workshops to train artisans also forms part of the rebuilding of the internal capacity of the department; addressing weaknesses of the departmental systems and controls by improving procurement and supply chain management processes, which includes proper management of its leasing and invoicing, as well as its immovable asset portfolio; and the planned eradication of the existing backlog in the upgrading and refurbishment of all government buildings is part of the department's responsibility to ensure greater access for people with disabilities.

Finally, the department included the low-capacity municipalities' index for the public works programme by restructuring the incentive grant. This will increase the impact of the Expanded Public Works Programme, EPWP, to alleviate poverty and provide skills to poor and marginalised communities, thereby improving the lives of a larger number of participants.

The Portfolio Committee on Public Works, especially those members who attend the portfolio committee meetings, therefore, requests that Parliament approves the adoption of the Budget Vote of the Department of Public Works. I thank you. [Applause.]

Madam Deputy Speaker, the DA calls for a division.

Division demanded. The House divided.

AYES - 221: Abram, S; Adams, P E; Bam-Mugwanya, V; Bhengu, F; Bhengu, N R; Bikani, F C; Bonhomme, T; Booi, M S; Borman, G M; Boshigo, D F; Botha, Y R; Bothman, S G; Burgess, C V; Buthelezi, M G; Cele, M A; Chiloane, T D; Chohan, F I; Coleman, E M; Cwele, S C; Dambuza, B N; Daniels, P N; Davies, R H; De Lange, J H; Diale, L N; Dikgacwi, M M; Ditshetelo, I C; Dlakude, D E; Dlamini, B O; Dlodlo, A; Dlomo, B J; Dubazana, Z S; Dube, M C; Duma, N M; Ebrahim, E I; Fransman, M L; Frolick, C T; Fubbs, J L; Gasebonwe, T M A; Gaum, A H; Gcwabaza, N E; Gelderblom, J P; Gigaba, K M N; Gina, N; Gololo, C L; Goqwana, M B; Gumede, D M; Hlengwa, M; Huang, S - B; Jacobus, L; Jeffery, J H; Kekana, C D; Kenye, T E; Khoarai, L P; Kholwane, S E; Khumalo, F E; Khunou, N P; Koornhof, G W; Kubayi, M T; Landers, L T; Lekgetho, G; Line-Hendriks, H; Lishivha, T E; Luyenge, Z; Mabasa, X; Mabedla, N R; Mabuza, M C; Madlala, N M; Madlopha, C Q; Mafolo, M V; Magagula, V V; Magama, H T; Magubane, E; Magwanishe, G; Makasi, X C; Makhuba, H N; Makhubela-Mashele, L S; Makhubele, Z S; Makwetla, S P; Malale, M l; Malgas, H H; Maluleka, H P; Maluleke, J M; Manamela, K B; Manganye, J; Mangena, M S; Manuel, T A; Mapisa-Nqakula, N N; Mashatile, S P; Mashigo, R M; Mashishi, A C; Masilo, J M; Masutha, T M; Mathebe, D H; Mathibela, N F; Matlanyane, H F; Matshoba, J M; Mavunda, D W; Mayatula, S M; Maziya, A M; Mdakane, M R; Mfulo, A; Mgabadeli, H C; Mjobo, L N; Mkhize, H B; Mkhulusi, N N P; Mlambo, E M; Mmusi, S G; Mnisi, N A; Mocumi, P A; Mohai, S J; Mohale, M C; Mohorosi, M; Mokoena, A D; Molebatsi, M A; Molewa, B E E; Moloi-Moropa, J C; Moloto, K A; Moni, C M; Moss, L N; Motlanthe, K P; Motsepe, R M; Motshekga, M A; Motshekga, M S; Mpontshane, A M; Msweli, H S; Mthethwa, E N; Mthethwa, E M; Mufamadi, T A; Mushwana, F F; N'wamitwa- Shilubana, T L P; Nchabeleng, M E; Ndabandaba, L B G; Ndabeni, S T; Ndebele, J S; Ndlazi, A Z; Ndlovu, V B; Nel, A C; Nelson, W J; Nene, N M; Newhoudt-Druchen, W S; Ngcengwane, N D; Ngcobo, B T; Ngcobo, E N N; Ngele, N J; Ngwenya, W; Ngwenya-Mabila, P C; Nhlengethwa, D G; Njikelana, S J; Nkoana-Mashabane, M E; Nkomo, S J; Nkwinti, G E; Nonkonyana, M; November, N T; Ntuli, Z C; Ntuli, B M; Nxesi, T W; Nxumalo, M D; Nyalungu, R E; Nyanda, S; Nyekemba, E; Oliphant, M N; Oosthuizen, G C; Pandor, G N M; Peters, E D; Petersen-Maduna, P; Phaahla, M J; Phaliso, M N; Pilane-Majake, M C C; Pilusa-Mosoane, M E; Pule, D D; Radebe, G S; Radebe, B A; Radebe, J T; Ramatlhodi, N A; Ramodibe, D M; Ramokgopa, G; Schneemann, G D; Segale- Diswai, M J; Selau, G J; September, C C; Sibanyoni, J B; Sibiya, D; Sindane, G S; Singh, N; Sisulu, L N; Sithole, K P; Sithole, S C N; Sizani, P S; Skosana, M B; Smith, V G; Snell, G T; Sogoni, E M; Sonto, M R; Sosibo, J E; Suka, L; Sulliman, E M; Sunduza, T B; Surty, M E; Thabethe, E; Thibedi, J D; Thobejane, S G; Tobias, T V; Tsebe, S R; Tseke, G K; Tsenoli, S L; Tshabalala, J; Tsotetsi, D R; Turok, B; Twala, N M; Van der Merwe, S C; Van Der Merwe, L L; van Rooyen, D D; Van Schalkwyk, M C J; van Wyk, A; Wayile, Z G; Williams, A J; Williams-De Bruyn, S T; Xaba, P P; Ximbi, D L; Xingwana, L M; Yengeni, L E.

NOES - 80: Adams, L H; Alberts, A D; Berend, S R; Bhanga, B M; Boinamo, G G; Bosman, L L; Botha, T; Coetzee, T W; Davidson, I O; Diemu, B C; Dreyer, A M; Du Toit, N D; Duncan, P C; Eloff, E H; Ferguson, B D; Gaehler, L B; Gcume, N P; George, M E; Groenewald, P J; Harris, T; Hill-Lewis, G G; Hoosen, M H; James, W G; Kalyan, S V; Kganare, D A; Kilian, J D; Kloppers- Lourens, J C; Kohler-Barnard, D; Koornhof, N J J v R; Kopane, S P; Krumbock, G R; Lamoela, H; Lee, T D; Lekota, M G P; Lorimer, J R B; Lotriet, A; Lovemore, A T; Mackenzie, G P D; Madisha, W M; Marais, S J F; Max, L H; Maynier, D J; Mazibuko, L D; McGluwa, J J; Michael, N W A; Mileham, K J; Mnqasela, M; More, E; Mosimane, C K K; Motau, S C; Mulder, P W A; Mulder, C P; Ndude, H N; Nhanha, M A; Njobe, M A A; Ollis, I M; Paulse, S; Rabie, P J; Ramatlakane, L; Robinson, D; Rogers, F A; Ross, D C; Schmidt, H C; Selfe, J; Shinn, M R; Steenhuisen, J H; Steyn, A; Steyn, A C; Stubbe, D J; Swart, S N; Swart, M; Swathe, M M; Van den Berg, N J; Van Der Linde, N J; Van Der Westhuizen, A P; Van Dyk, S M; Van Schalkwyk, H C; Waters, M; Watson, A; Zikalala, C N Z.

Vote accordingly agreed to.

Vote No 8 - Women, Children and People with Disabilities - put.

Declarations of vote:

Deputy Speaker, the National Development Plan clearly stipulates that the developmental state builds the capacity of people to improve their own lives whilst intervening to protect the rights of the most vulnerable citizens. This is a core role and responsibility of this department. Unfortunately, the department has failed in developing smart objectives linked to detailed targets and indicators. The department lacks the highest calibre of leadership, vision and commitment and therefore is underperforming. Salaries exceed prescribed notches, and high performance bonuses are awarded, resulting in financial implications.

A chunk of 61% of the 2012-13 budget is again awarded to Programme 1, which is administration, while Programmes 2, 3 and 4, which drive the core function of the department, are significantly understaffed to effectively undertake advocacy initiatives, institutional support, capacity-building, and monitoring and evaluation on a national scale. Skewed spending priorities are still the order of the day. Line departments, which are needed to enhance strategic planning functions of the department, are not kept accountable on implementation, as very little monitoring and evaluation occurs. The Minister has failed to provide any credible reason for why her department should not be scrapped.

The DA cannot support the Budget Vote and calls for the scrapping of this department which has, after all, become a job-creation institution with very little support to vulnerable groups. I thank you.

Cope?

Deputy Speaker, we will not make a declaration but we also object. Thank you.

Deputy Speaker, since last year's Budget Vote, this department has been under scrutiny. It has been plagued in the past by serious challenges which beg the question whether this department can still play its envisaged role.

The IFP believes that our women, our children and our people with disabilities deserve better. In the hope for something better, we will support Budget Vote No 8: Women, Children and People with Disabilities, but we emphasise the following critical areas of concern. With regard to Programme 1, and specifically with regard to the spend on travel and subsistence, we can and must send smaller delegations to the United Nations. If other countries can do it, why can't we?

While participation in international platforms is essential, the department's limited resources demand that funding be channelled to critically underfunded core programmes. Administration continues to consume the lion's share of this budget, leaving core programmes with only R106 million. That is pocket change compared to what other departments have at their disposal. In fact, the Department of Communications spent that amount on just one event - the ICT Indaba. Inflation has outstripped the nominal budget increase, leaving this department with less money to spend than it had before. All of these seriously call into question government's commitment to improve the lives of the most vulnerable.

The IFP will support this department's turnaround strategy and the Budget Vote that is before us, but it must deliver a leaner, meaner, more effective department that actually delivers on its core mandate. I thank you.

Deputy Speaker, the ANC supports the Vote on Women, Children and People with Disabilities. It is quite surprising that some of the issues that were resolved, discussed and responded to by the Minister are now being raised here in the House.

In terms of the administration, I think the Minister did respond to that, by saying that she was able to raise funds. In terms of staff and salaries that were paid outside the Public Service administration, the department did institute a commission of inquiry into allegations of governance irregularities within the department. Whilst the report was still being processed, the department had already begun to act on its recommendations whereby affected staff members were dismissed and disciplinary proceedings instituted.

However, it is surprising, because when there is corruption, the DA makes a lot of noise, and when the systems are put in place to institute an investigation, they come up again and say it is an unfair dismissal. Ke kgomo ya mo?ate, wa e gapa o molato, wa e lesa o molato. [They are never satisfied.]

Under the ANC government, people with disabilities and children have seen the passing of critical legislation which will change their paths for the better. The path is long, and the apartheid damage runs very deep, but the ANC government will continue to make the lives of the vulnerable groups in society better under its regime.

Division demanded.

The House divided:

AYES - 223: Abram, S; Adams, P E; Bam-Mugwanya, V; Bhengu, F; Bhengu, N R; Bhengu, P; Bikani, F C; Bonhomme, T; Booi, M S; Borman, G M; Boshigo, D F; Botha, Y R; Bothman, S G; Burgess, C V; Buthelezi, M G; Cebekhulu, R S; Cele, M A; Chiloane, T D; Chohan, F I; Coleman, E M; Cwele, S C; Dambuza, B N; Daniels, P N; Davies, R H; De Lange, J H; Diale, L N; Dikgacwi, M M; Ditshetelo, I C; Dlakude, D E; Dlamini, B O; Dlodlo, A; Dlomo, B J; Dubazana, Z S; Dube, M C; Duma, N M; Ebrahim, E I; Fransman, M L; Frolick, C T; Fubbs, J L; Gasebonwe, T M A; Gaum, A H; Gcwabaza, N E; Gelderblom, J P; Gigaba, K M N; Gina, N; Gololo, C L; Goqwana, M B; Gumede, D M; Hlengwa, M; Huang, S - B; Jacobus, L; Jeffery, J H; Kekana, C D; Kenye, T E; Khoarai, L P; Kholwane, S E; Khumalo, F E; Khunou, N P; Koornhof, G W; Kubayi, M T; Landers, L T; Lekgetho, G; Lesoma, R M M; Line-Hendriks, H; Lishivha, T E; Luyenge, Z; Mabasa, X; Mabedla, N R; Mabuza, M C; Madlala, N M; Madlopha, C Q; Mafolo, M V; Magagula, V V; Magama, H T; Magubane, E; Magwanishe, G; Makasi, X C; Makhuba, H N; Makhubela-Mashele, L S; Makhubele, Z S; Makwetla, S P; Malale, M l; Malgas, H H; Maluleka, H P; Maluleke, J M; Manamela, K B; Manana, N C; Mangena, M S; Manuel, T A; Mapisa-Nqakula, N N; Mashigo, R M; Mashishi, A C; Masilo, J M; Masutha, T M; Mathebe, D H; Mathibela, N F; Matlanyane, H F; Matshoba, J M; Mavunda, D W; Mayatula, S M; Maziya, A M; Mdakane, M R; Mfulo, A; Mgabadeli, H C; Mjobo, L N; Mkhize, H B; Mkhulusi, N N P; Mlambo, E M; Mmusi, S G; Mnisi, N A; Mocumi, P A; Mohai, S J; Mohale, M C; Mohorosi, M; Mokoena, A D; Molebatsi, M A; Molewa, B E E; Moloi-Moropa, J C; Moloto, K A; Moni, C M; Moss, L N; Motlanthe, K P; Motsepe, R M; Motshekga, M S; Motshekga, M A; Mpontshane, A M; Msweli, H S; Mthethwa, E N; Mthethwa, E M; Mufamadi, T A; Mushwana, F F; Muthambi, A F; N'wamitwa-Shilubana, T L P; Nchabeleng, M E; Ndabandaba, L B G; Ndabeni, S T; Ndebele, J S; Ndlazi, A Z; Ndlovu, V B; Nel, A C; Nelson, W J; Nene, N M; Newhoudt-Druchen, W S; Ngcengwane, N D; Ngcobo, B T; Ngcobo, E N N; Ngele, N J; Ngubeni-Maluleka, J P; Ngwenya- Mabila, P C; Nhlengethwa, D G; Njikelana, S J; Nkoana-Mashabane, M E; Nkomo, S J; Nkwinti, G E; Nonkonyana, M; November, N T; Ntuli, Z C; Ntuli, B M; Nxesi, T W; Nxumalo, M D; Nyalungu, R E; Nyanda, S; Nyekemba, E; Oliphant, M N; Oosthuizen, G C; Pandor, G N M; Peters, E D; Petersen- Maduna, P; Phaahla, M J; Phaliso, M N; Pilane-Majake, M C C; Pilusa- Mosoane, M E; Pule, D D; Radebe, J T; Radebe, B A; Radebe, G S; Ramatlhodi, N A; Ramodibe, D M; Ramokgopa, G; Schneemann, G D; Segale-Diswai, M J; Selau, G J; September, C C; Sibanyoni, J B; Sibiya, D; Sindane, G S; Singh, N; Sisulu, L N; Sithole, S C N; Sithole, K P; Sizani, P S; Skosana, M B; Smith, V G; Snell, G T; Sogoni, E M; Sonto, M R; Sosibo, J E; Suka, L; Sulliman, E M; Sunduza, T B; Surty, M E; Thabethe, E; Thibedi, J D; Tobias, T V; Tsebe, S R; Tseke, G K; Tsenoli, S L; Tshabalala, J; Tsotetsi, D R; Turok, B; Twala, N M; Van Der Merwe, L L; Van der Merwe, S C; van Rooyen, D D; Van Schalkwyk, M C J; van Wyk, A; Wayile, Z G; Williams, A J; Williams- De Bruyn, S T; Ximbi, D L; Xingwana, L M; Yengeni, L E; Zikalala, C N Z.

NOES - 82: Adams, L H; Alberts, A D; Berend, S R; Bhanga, B M; Boinamo, G G; Bosman, L L; Botha, T; Coetzee, T W; Davidson, I O; De Freitas, M S F; Diemu, B C; Dreyer, A M; Du Toit, N D; Duncan, P C; Eloff, E H; Esau, S; Ferguson, B D; Gcume, N P; George, M E; Greyling, L W; Groenewald, P J; Harris, T; Hoosen, M H; James, W G; Kalyan, S V; Kganare, D A; Kilian, J D; Kloppers-Lourens, J C; Kohler-Barnard, D; Koornhof, N J J v R; Kopane, S P; Krumbock, G R; Lamoela, H; Lee, T D; Lekota, M G P; Lorimer, J R B; Lotriet, A; Lovemore, A T; Mackenzie, G P D; Madisha, W M; Marais, S J F; Max, L H; Maynier, D J; Mazibuko, L D; McGluwa, J J; Michael, N W A; Mileham, K J; Mnqasela, M; More, E; Mosimane, C K K; Motau, S C; Mubu, K S; Mulder, P W A; Mulder, C P; Ndude, H N; Nhanha, M A; Njobe, M A A; Ollis, I M; Paulse, S; Rabie, P J; Ramatlakane, L; Robinson, D; Rogers, F A; Ross, D C; Schafer, D A; Schmidt, H C; Selfe, J; Shinn, M R; Steenhuisen, J H; Steyn, A; Steyn, A C; Stubbe, D J; Swart, M; Swathe, M M; Terblanche, J F; Van den Berg, N J; Van Der Linde, N J; Van Der Westhuizen, A P; Van Dyk, S M; Van Schalkwyk, H C; Waters, M; Watson, A.

Vote accordingly agreed to.

Vote No 9: Government Communication and Information System - put.

Declarations of vote:

Madam Deputy Speaker, for the sake of progress, we will just record our objection.

Hon Deputy Speaker, the ANC supports Budget Vote No 9. We ought to approach the production and dissemination of information as a public commodity and service in its own right, rather than taking the cynical short-sighted view of information as an afterthought or political football.

The Government Communication and Information System, GCIS, is a critical national institution and asset in the process of ensuring that government does more, people benefit more and, once they benefit more, they are able to contribute more to improving conditions around them. This is the true spirit of working together. The ANC supports the Budget Vote. Vote agreed to (Democratic Alliance, Congress of the People and Independent Democrats dissenting).

Vote No 10 - National Treasury - put.

Madam Speaker, you did not ask for declarations. The DA would like to make a declaration on Budget Vote No 10.

Oh, the DA.

Declarations of vote:

Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker.

Our economy is in a state. Unemployment is stuck at 38% and growth has collapsed to less than 1%. It is not legitimate to keep blaming the global financial crisis for this underperformance. Other developing countries are currently managing between 4% and 6% growth.

It is also not fair, Minister Manuel, to blame quantitative easing for every depreciation in the rand. The hon Manuel says the President must have moved every emerging market currency when he made his now famous remark three weeks ago. Well, on that day, the rand declined by five times more than the JP Morgan emerging markets currency index did. This was on the day when the President was meant to be restoring confidence in the economy.

It is fair to say, however, that the situation would have been much worse if Treasury had conceded to Cosatu's populist demands on fiscal policy in recent years. Therefore, the DA will support this Budget Vote because Treasury has held the fiscal line.

However, if Cosatu continues to block Treasury's efforts to introduce microeconomic reforms for the labour market, if state capacity has not improved so that infrastructure spending can increase to 10% of gross domestic product, GDP, and if growth-killing taxes are increased to fund the system that leaks billions of rands to corruption, then the DA will not be able to support future Treasury Budget Votes. I thank you.

Any other party wishing to make a declaration?

Thank you hon Deputy Speaker. Hon Harris, I am not surprised by your about-turn. Earlier on, we had our deliberations in the committee session and you made an undertaking that you would not make a declaration. Your maverick acrobatics are becoming very common to us in the committee.

It is globally recognised that we have one of the most stable financial sectors in the world. This is largely due to the skills and sophistication that the National Treasury has brought to the financial sector through the necessary legislation and regulation. Within the parameters of shaping fiscal and monetary policy, the National Treasury is first and foremost leading debates in these areas and is, again, globally looked upon in this field.

Perhaps to remind the victims of short memory and amnesia, let me remind them about the fact that all this is happening because this is National Treasury under the leadership of the ANC. This Budget Vote deserves all our support because it is a living example of the constitutional principles of co-operative governance and intergovernmental relations among the three spheres of government.

It practically assists in providing support for all three spheres of government so as to ensure the building of effective and efficient public finance and budget management in the provision of social and basic services at provincial and local government levels. This Budget Vote is crucial for the realisation of basic services much needed by all, particularly the masses of our people who were denied such services for years. Any opposition to this Budget Vote is merely an act of clutching at straws. As the ANC, we support Budget Vote No 10. Thank you. [Applause.]

Vote agreed to.

Vote No 11 - Public Enterprises - put Declarations of vote:

Thank you, Deputy Speaker. The Department of Public Enterprises is the custodian of state-owned entities that has a direct effect on millions of South Africans and the economy as a whole. Never before has a bigger mockery been made of the South African public by allowing yet another government bailout of a R1, 5 billion to our financially inept national carrier, SA Airways.

Instead of taking the obvious financially sound decision of either privatising or entering into a public- private partnership as, coincidently, encouraged by the Presidential Review Commission, as South Africans, we are forced to watch good millions and millions of rands being thrown after bad.

We are also forced to watch as one of the most important projects in our country's history, the Medupi Power Station, fall behind schedule, resulting in costs escalating to millions. Thousands of former Transnet employees live on the breadline daily and still we cannot get a firm and direct assurance from Transnet that the plight of the suffering and hardworking South Africans will be sorted out and that they will be allowed to live out their golden years with dignity. This is just not good enough and South Africans deserve better. [Applause.]

Adjunkspeaker, in die begrotingsdebat het die agb Minister verskeie kere verwys na hoe hy swart ekonomiese bemagtiging, SEB, gaan uitbrei by sy departement. Ek het hom toe gewaarsku, en ek het vir hom ges SEB, oftewel BEE, staan nie vir swart ekonomiese bemagtiging nie. Dit staan vir "black elite enrichment". Dis wat ek vir die agb Minister ges het.

Die Minister het ook gespog hoe hy regstellende aksie gaan toepas. Toe hy gereageer het, het hy aan my ges dat ek agter is. Agb Minister, ek is u so ver vooruit dat u dink ek is agter. Ek het eintlik al rondom gegaan om u vooruit te wees, want u tree tot nadeel van die land op. 'n Tipiese voorbeeld is wat ons nou bevind het met blanke mans wat aansoek gedoen het vir vlienierslisensies by die SA Lugdiens.

U skud u kop. Ek s vir u dis rassisties. Hulle het die toetse geslaag. U het hulle gevat na 'n hotel toe. U het die psigometriese toetse gedoen, maar u s - u departement s - geen blanke mans kan vlieniers word in die SA Lugdiens nie, terwyl dit die belastingbetaler is wat elke keer die SA Lugdiens moet uithelp weens swak finansile bestuur. Ek s vandag vir u: As u wil h Suid-Afrika moet vorentoe gaan, as u wil h ons moet 'n wen-land word, moet u wegdoen met SEB en die rassediskriminasie van regstellende aksie. [Tussenwerpsels.] Die VF Plus sal nie die begrotingspos ondersteun nie. Ek dank u. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)

[Mr P J GROENEWALD: Deputy Speaker, in the budget debate the hon Minister referred on numerous occasions to how he is going to expand black economic empowerment, BEE, in his department. I warned him then, and I told him BEE does not stand for black economic empowerment. It stands for "black elite enrichment". This is what I told the hon Minister.

The Minister also bragged how he is going to implement affirmative action. When he responded he told me that I am behind the times. Hon Minister, I am so far ahead of you that you think I am behind you. I have actually lapped you to get ahead of you, because you act to the disadvantage of the country. A typical example is the case that we now have regarding white males applying for pilot licenses at the SA Airways.

You shake your head. I am telling you, it's racist. They passed the tests. You took them to a hotel. You did the psychometric tests, but you said - your department said - no white males can become pilots in the SA Airways, while it is the taxpayer who every time bails out the SA Airways because of bad financial management. I am telling you today: If you want South Africa to go forward, if you want our country to become a winning country, you must get rid of BEE and the race discrimination of affirmative action. [Interjections.] The FF Plus will not support the Budget Vote. I thank you.]

Chairperson, this Vote carries with it the responsibility to assist in building the capacity of the state and the objectives of a developmental state whilst ensuring that the state-owned companies and enterprises remain financially viable and lead in the strategic government development objective within a clearly defined public mandate.

However, what are the facts about this department? Firstly, this department has now received clean audits from the Auditor-General for nine consecutive years. Secondly, it is rated by the Auditor-General as one of the three best-run government departments in the Public Service. Thirdly, the Isibuko Dashboard in the Department of Public Enterprises is regarded as one of the best project management tools in the Public Service and can potentially be shared with all other government departments. Despite these facts, the DA and now the FF Plus still deem it fit to ask for a declaration on this Vote, not to praise but to oppose. This is an attitude of ``If it moves, criticise it''.

The following are facts about the state-owned entities: Eskom is keeping the lights on despite the cold nights we have experienced in the last couple of days and weeks, and through the combined efforts of the majority of South Africans to beat the peak. However, the opposition comes here to criticise.

Despite the turmoil in aviation industry worldwide, not one single SA Airways flight has been grounded, but you come and criticise. Denel ... [Interjections.]

Order, hon members! Order!

Denel Aerostructures is being turned around. They are breaking even. They are on the up, but you come here and criticise.

Transnet is continuing with one of the largest infrastructure investment- spending programmes in the history of this country and in the history of Transnet, but you come, make a declaration, and oppose this Budget Vote. The ANC will support the Budget Vote. [Applause.] [Time expired.]

Division demanded.

The House divided:

AYES - 234:Abram, S; Adams, P E; Adams, L H; Bam-Mugwanya, V; Berend, S R; Bhanga, B M; Bhengu, F; Bhengu, P; Bhengu, N R; Bikani, F C; Bonhomme, T; Booi, M S; Borman, G M; Boshigo, D F; Botha, Y R; Botha, T; Bothman, S G; Burgess, C V; Buthelezi, M G; Cebekhulu, R S; Cele, M A; Chiloane, T D; Chohan, F I; Coleman, E M; Cwele, S C; Dambuza, B N; Daniels, P N; Davies, R H; De Lange, J H; Diemu, B C; Dikgacwi, M M; Ditshetelo, I C; Dlakude, D E; Dlamini, B O; Dlodlo, A; Dlomo, B J; Dubazana, Z S; Dube, M C; Duma, N M; Ebrahim, E I; Ferguson, B D; Fransman, M L; Fubbs, J L; Gasebonwe, T M A; Gaum, A H; Gcume, N P; Gcwabaza, N E; Gelderblom, J P; George, M E; Gigaba, K M N; Gina, N; Gololo, C L; Goqwana, M B; Gumede, D M; Hlengwa, M; Huang, S - B; Jacobus, L; Jeffery, J H; Kekana, C D; Kenye, T E; Kganare, D A; Khoarai, L P; Kholwane, S E; Khumalo, F E; Khunou, N P; Kilian, J D; Koornhof, N J J v R; Koornhof, G W; Landers, L T; Lekgetho, G; Lekota, M G P; Lesoma, R M M; Line-Hendriks, H; Lishivha, T E; Luyenge, Z; Mabasa, X; Mabedla, N R; Mabuza, M C; Madisha, W M; Madlala, N M; Madlopha, C Q; Mafolo, M V; Magagula, V V; Magama, H T; Magubane, E; Magwanishe, G; Makasi, X C; Makhuba, H N; Makhubela-Mashele, L S; Makhubele, Z S; Makwetla, S P; Malale, M l; Malgas, H H; Maluleka, H P; Maluleke, J M; Manamela, K B; Manana, N C; Manganye, J; Mangena, M S; Manuel, T A; Mapisa- Nqakula, N N; Mashatile, S P; Mashigo, R M; Mashishi, A C; Masilo, J M; Masutha, T M; Mathebe, D H; Mathibela, N F; Matlanyane, H F; Matshoba, J M; Mavunda, D W; Mayatula, S M; Maziya, A M; Mdakane, M R; Mfulo, A; Mgabadeli, H C; Mjobo, L N; Mkhize, H B; Mkhulusi, N N P; Mlambo, E M; Mmusi, S G; Mnisi, N A; Mocumi, P A; Mohai, S J; Mohale, M C; Mohorosi, M; Mokoena, A D; Molebatsi, M A; Molewa, B E E; Moloi-Moropa, J C; Moloto, K A; Mosimane, C K K; Moss, L N; Motsepe, R M; Motshekga, M A; Mpontshane, A M; Msweli, H S; Mthethwa, E M; Mufamadi, T A; Mushwana, F F; Muthambi, A F; N'wamitwa-Shilubana, T L P; Nchabeleng, M E; Ndabandaba, L B G; Ndabeni, S T; Ndebele, J S; Ndlazi, A Z; Ndlovu, V B; Ndude, H N; Nel, A C; Nelson, W J; Nene, N M; Newhoudt-Druchen, W S; Ngcengwane, N D; Ngcobo, E N N; Ngcobo, B T; Ngele, N J; Ngubeni-Maluleka, J P; Ngwenya, W; Ngwenya-Mabila, P C; Nhanha, M A; Nhlengethwa, D G; Njikelana, S J; Njobe, M A A; Nkoana- Mashabane, M E; Nkomo, S J; Nonkonyana, M; November, N T; Ntuli, B M; Ntuli, Z C; Nxumalo, M D; Nyalungu, R E; Nyanda, S; Nyekemba, E; Oliphant, M N; Oosthuizen, G C; Pandor, G N M; Peters, E D; Petersen-Maduna, P; Phaahla, M J; Phaliso, M N; Pilane-Majake, M C C; Pilusa-Mosoane, M E; Pule, D D; Radebe, G S; Radebe, B A; Ramatlakane, L; Ramatlhodi, N A; Ramodibe, D M; Ramokgopa, G; Schneemann, G D; Segale-Diswai, M J; Selau, G J; September, C C; Sibanyoni, J B; Sibiya, D; Sindane, G S; Singh, N; Sisulu, L N; Sithole, S C N; Sithole, K P; Sizani, P S; Skosana, M B; Smith, V G; Snell, G T; Sogoni, E M; Sonto, M R; Sosibo, J E; Suka, L; Sulliman, E M; Sunduza, T B; Surty, M E; Thabethe, E; Thibedi, J D; Tobias, T V; Tsebe, S R; Tseke, G K; Tsenoli, S L; Tshabalala, J; Tsotetsi, D R; Turok, B; Twala, N M; Van Der Merwe, L L; van Rooyen, D D; Van Schalkwyk, M C J; van Wyk, A; Wayile, Z G; Williams, A J; Williams-De Bruyn, S T; Xaba, P P; Ximbi, D L; Xingwana, L M; Yengeni, L E; Zikalala, C N Z.

NOES - 61:Alberts, A D; Boinamo, G G; Bosman, L L; Coetzee, T W; Davidson, I O; De Freitas, M S F; Dreyer, A M; Du Toit, N D; Duncan, P C; Eloff, E H; Esau, S; Greyling, L W; Groenewald, P J; Hill-Lewis, G G; Hoosen, M H; James, W G; Kalyan, S V; Kloppers-Lourens, J C; Kohler-Barnard, D; Kopane, S P; Krumbock, G R; Lamoela, H; Lee, T D; Lorimer, J R B; Lotriet, A; Lovemore, A T; Marais, S J F; Max, L H; Maynier, D J; Mazibuko, L D; McGluwa, J J; Michael, N W A; Mileham, K J; Mnqasela, M; More, E; Motau, S C; Mubu, K S; Mulder, P W A; Mulder, C P; Ollis, I M; Rabie, P J; Robinson, D; Rogers, F A; Ross, D C; Schafer, D A; Schmidt, H C; Shinn, M R; Smiles, D C; Steenhuisen, J H; Steyn, A C; Steyn, A; Stubbe, D J; Swart, M; Swathe, M M; Terblanche, J F; Van den Berg, N J; Van Der Linde, N J; Van Dyk, S M; Van Schalkwyk, H C; Waters, M; Watson, A.

Vote accordingly agreed to.

Vote No 12 - Public Service and Administration - put.

Declarations of vote:

Hon House Chairperson, we support the Vote. However, we want to indicate that we are concerned about the slow process of arriving at the cooling-off system for officials who do business with the state. That process has been dragging on and on without end.

We also want to raise the issue about senior managers' continued failure to declare their interests as they continue to do business with the department. That requires action by the Minister of the Department of Public Service and Administration.

We are also concerned about the issue of corruption and the slow pace of the recovery of money that has been siphoned by officials who have, in fact, corrupted the state. The provision of the Public Finance Management Act, PFMA, is not necessarily being implemented in terms of the recovery of the money, including in respect of unauthorised and irregular expenditure.

Hon Chairperson, Minister Sisulu must firstly be commended for her indications to tackle the difficult challenges facing the Public Service, specifically those identified in the National Development Plan and the Public Service Commission's report, like corruption and the inefficiency of the state.

Currently we do not have a capable state, a professional Public Service or the required competencies due to cadre deployment, corruption, inadequate tertiary training and basic school education that favour the politically connected, friends and family, and political influence in financial transactions.

The strategies by the Minister, including the School of Government, the anticorruption bureau and the consequences of the Public Administration Bill, must be funded from only this Budget Vote No 12. The Minister has indicated that she will have to seek extra funding from National Treasury to achieve all of our objectives.

However, with the gross domestic product, GDP, below 1%, increasing deficits on both the budget account and the trade account of the balance of payments, and a consumer price index, CPI, of 6%, there are no indications that this will materialise.

There are not enough attainable efforts being demonstrated to curb corruption, to determine a broader definition of family who would be prohibited from entering into business transactions with the state, and to prevent staff from serving on political party executive structures. Minister, without this, corruption will not stop.

The private member's Bill from the DA was a sincere effort to contribute to a more viable alternative. Both the School of Government and the anticorruption bureau will require huge amounts of funding to be successful. There are more viable alternatives. For instance, the Public Administration and Leadership Management Academy, Palama, and the School of Government cannot perform the services that are currently available at tertiary institutions, universities and further education colleges. There's also ... [Time expired.]

Hon Chairperson, I just need to indicate that Public Service and Administration has a huge task and it's just an institution on its own. It is an engine for ensuring that the entire government functions. I am sure that most of you follow and have heard what the Minister normally says about the issue of an engine that should function. So it's not a small task.

As the committee for Public Service and Administration, we have been overseeing Public Service and Administration over all these years, and we remain completely satisfied with the good progress achieved thus far.

Currently, as we speak, there is remarkable innovation and good progress being achieved in turning around deliverables in the Public Service. Critical intervention has been sorted out in key areas where there are major challenges. I am sure that most of you have been following the progress that has been achieved. We applaud the energy, zeal and willingness of the Minister, who is seated here, in diligently executing her duties, particularly with regard to innovation.

With regard to the declaration of interest, we as the committee have been briefed on the good progress that the department is making. We are aware that there is an issue but there is also good work that is being done by the department.

With regard to the Public Finance Management Act vis vis the Public Service Act, there is an amendment that will correlate those areas that we thought might be grey areas. Actually, if we are fair enough, we should say that, on the anticorruption bureau, we have heard the department talking about the collaboration of institutions and departments in terms of making this a reality. We have always complained that they work in silos. We should be saying, well done, with regard to the collaboration which we heard will be happening, including in Palama. Thank you, Chair. [Applause.]

Vote agreed to (Democratic Alliance, Independent Democrats and Freedom Front Plus dissenting).

Vote No 13 - Statistics South Africa - put and agreed to.

Vote No 14 - Arts and Culture - put.

Hon Chairperson, there is a declaration.

There was no indication that there would be a declaration, but I will give you the opportunity to do so.

Voorsitter, gemeet aan die monitre waarde van Kuns en Kultuur se begroting, kan die departement dalk as 'n mindere gesien word. Trouens, Kuns en Kultuur is die kern van voortgesette strewes om te versoen en Suid-Afrikanisme te bevorder en te maak werk. Misluk ons daarmee gaan die swaarverdiende demokrasie daarmee saam oor die afgrond.

Die DA ondersteun die begroting; maar die Pan-Suid-Afrikaanse Taalraad, Pansat, en die SA Erfenishulpbronagentskap, SAEHA,is swak bestuur. Sonder sterk politieke rigtinggewing en bestuur het Pansat en SAEHA vyf jaar vermors.

Pansat moet 'n leidende rol speel om die talewetgewing toe te pas en die bestuur daarvan te reguleer. SAEHA het net een aspek van Suid-Afrika se erfenis om te bewaar. Indien Pansat oor die volgende vyf jaar misluk, is dit die einde van veeltaligheid in Suid-Afrika. Ek wil dit beklemtoon: As Pansat misluk, is dit die einde van veeltaligheid in Suid-Afrika.

Dis in ons hande of veeltaligheid gaan sevier en ons erfenis bewaar gaan word. So is dit, Voorsitter. (Translation of Afrikaans speech follows.)

[Mr N J VAN DEN BERG: Chairperson, judging by the monetary value of the Arts and Culture budget, this department could possibly be viewed as inferior. As a matter of fact, Arts and Culture is at the core of continued endeavours towards reconciliation and the promotion of South-Africanism and making it work. Should we fail in this regard, the hard-earned democracy would be ruined as well.

The DA supports the budget; however, the Pan South African Language Board, PanSALB, and the South African Heritage Resources Agency, SAHRA, has been poorly managed. As a result of a lack of proper political direction and management, PanSALB and SAHRA had wasted five years.

PanSALB should play a leading role in respect of implementing language legislation and regulating the management thereof. SAHRA has to preserve but one aspect of South Africa's heritage. Should PanSALB fail over the next five years, it would be the end of multilingualism in South Africa. I want to emphasise this: Should PanSALB fail, it would be the end of multilingualism in South Africa.

It is in our hands to determine whether multilingualism will triumph and whether our heritage will be preserved. That is the way it is, Chairperson.]

Hon Chairperson, I just want to say thank you, once again, to hon Van Den Berg for the show, because he is very much aware that we have just been busy with the Pan South African Language Board, Pansalb, interviews of the board. Secondly, I want to further state that he is very aware that Pansalb state is now stabilising because there is an acting CEO who has implemented the turnaround strategy that the portfolio committee has accepted as well. We also want to further state that Pansalb is coming on board and the portfolio committee is happy that it is about to bring about stability.

On the issues of the Superfund Amendments and Reauthorisation Act, Sara, as much as I agree with him, last week - not long ago - the turnaround strategy was brought to the portfolio committee, which was happy about it, and those issues were raised there.

However, he is not saying that some of the issues that are challenges for Sara are those structural issues of apartheid where people, before democracy, wrote 100-year leases for R1. You know, they are leases for just R1 to hire a place. Historical places have all been taken by white people who were advantaged by then. How do you have a lease of R1 for a house that is worth a million? I think those are the things that we must say that, in the transformation process, are part of the issues that are causing problems.

As this Parliament we are the ones, as the ANC, who have adopted and declared that South Africa is a multilingual country. He is not stating that we are still fighting for change in terms of languages spoken in South Africa, starting with schools that are still refusing to teach African languages. I think we must stop making shows and agree on transformation. Thank you. [Applause.]

Vote agreed to.

Vote No 15 - Basic Education - put.

Declarations of vote:

Chairperson, the business of education is about doing everything possible to provide a learning environment that nurtures capable and confident young adults ready to make the most of every opportunity. South Africa will sadly, for the most part, continue to be denied quality education. An amount of R17,6 billion has bought us an annual performance plan that allows Minister Motshekga and her officials to tick the boxes alongside unchallenging targets. The only target in the plan that is directly linked to learner outcomes is the matric pass rate and that target is 74%, lower than what was achieved last year.

The plan has no targets for the following: The percentage of schools with the very basic level of infrastructure or having access to a library; the percentage of learners with a textbook for each subject; the number of learners who have received workbooks; the percentage of Grade 3, 6 or 9 learners performing at the required numeracy or literacy levels; the number of Grade 12 learners passing mathematics or physical science; and no targets for the number of Grade 12 learners who become eligible to study towards a Bachelors degree.

The DA cannot be aligned with this sidestepping of the constitutional obligation to properly educate our children.

Chairperson, Cope cannot support this Budget Vote because Education has, during the past three years, received the biggest slice of the Budget but failed to deliver on quality education. Our education system continues to be crippled by poor administration, lack of infrastructure, frequent policy changes and corrupt tender practices.

The Minister of Basic Education continues to violate the Constitution and she denies millions of South African children access to quality education. A lack of learner material and poor school infrastructure must be cited as part of learners' deprivation of quality teaching and learning. The lack of adequate school infrastructure remains a serious constraint to teaching. Thousands of schools have no functioning ablution facilities, no libraries and no laboratories. They are still without textbook delivery, etc. How can we then blame the children for the poor results?

The Minister demonstrates a flagrant disregard for the judiciary, despite the settlement agreement endorsed by the Bisho High Court that she would publish the minimum norms and standards for school infrastructure by 15 May 2013. She failed to do that. Judge Duguda of the Bisho High Court has now agreed to hear the matter on an urgent basis. We do not support this. Thank you. [Time expired.] [Applause.]

House Chairperson, the IFP supports this Budget Vote. However, the system continues to show symptoms of an ailing system. Look at the provinces who have failed to spend all of their infrastructural grants. Look at Limpopo, which had to suspend mid-year examinations because of a lack of funding.

I admit that there are many variables for this ailing system. Grade R teachers, for instance, are not adequately trained to teach our children, neither are they adequately paid and, as a result, they lack the enthusiasm to teach our children.

We read, for instance, in the recent report that the graduation rate for first degree graduates stands at 12% this year. This is attributed to poor education at the basic level.

Going back to Grade R teachers, we understand that the average payment for a Grade R teacher is R4 000 per month. This is unacceptable. We therefore urge the department to bring about the standardisation of payment of Grade R teachers because we still have these disparities across the provinces when it comes to the payment of Grade R teachers. We have seen, for instance in KwaZulu-Natal, teachers going to strike because of the plight of Grade R teachers ... Thank you. [Time expired.]

Voorsitter, die Minister ontvang die grootste gedeelte van die begrotingskoek, en dis in orde so, mits dit reg aangewend word. Daar is heelwat werk in die departement wat gedoen moet word, want ons skole is werklikwaar in 'n baie groot gemors.

Die Minister het egter nog nie aangetoon dat sy met begrotings kan werk en al die dienste kan lewer wat nodig is vir die departement en vir die kinders van Suid-Afrika nie. 'n Paar voorbeelde verdien om genoem te word: die afskaling en verengelsing van Afrikaanse skole; die gebrek aan aflewering van skoolboeke in die algemeen; en die gebrek aan die bou van nuwe moedertaalonderrigskole. Daarom kan ons aan die einde van die dag nie die begrotingspos ondersteun nie. Dankie. (Translation of Afrikaans speech follows.)

[Adv A D ALBERTS: Chairperson, the Minister receives the largest piece of the budget pie, and rightfully so, provided that it is spent correctly. Quite a lot of work needs to be done in the department, because our schools are really and truly in a huge mess.

However, the Minister has not yet shown that she is competent to work with budgets and to ensure that all the services needed are delivered to the department and the children of South Africa. A few examples are worth mentioning: the downscaling and anglicising of Afrikaans-medium schools; the nondelivery of textbooks in general; and failure to build new schools for mother tongue education. That is why, at the end of the day, we cannot support the Budget Vote. Thank you.]

Hon Chairperson, when it comes to the declarations made, everything that members have said was discussed within our committee meeting. Even early childhood development, ECD, was discussed this morning. When it comes to matters raised by the FF Plus, I am not going to answer to that because the Freedom Front Plus never attends our meetings. [Interjections.]

Chairperson, I rise on a point of order: We discussed this on numerous occasions - that not all parties serve on all portfolio committees. The hon member should know that and not score that kind of cheap political points in the House. [Interjections.]

What I would like to say is that the DA and Cope -with the small ID adding its voice - are rejecting this budget. [Laughter.] They have objections. What is being said actually? Let the people of the Western Cape hear. They are saying no to conditional grants. Secondly, there are five conditional grants. They are saying no to school infrastructure, nutrition, technical secondary school recapitalisation, HIV/Aids programmes and the Dinaledi programme.

I would like the Western Cape to know that they are rejecting these grants. [Interjections.] They are not accepting them.

What I would like to say to the parties that accepted it is that they agree on the grants for the learners of the Western Cape because, when it comes to our learners, it is a constitutional imperative that quality education should be given and these, as I said, all contribute to quality education. I would like to say thank you to the FF Plus, APC, UCDP, ACDP and the majority party for supporting this budget. I also want to thank the Minister and the Deputy Minister for doing such good work. Thank you. The ANC supports this Budget Vote. [Time expired.][Applause.]

Division demanded.

The House divided:

AYES - 214: Abram, S; Adams, P E; Bam-Mugwanya, V; Bhengu, P; Bhengu, F; Bhengu, N R; Bikani, F C; Bonhomme, T; Booi, M S; Borman, G M; Boshigo, D F; Botha, Y R; Bothman, S G; Burgess, C V; Buthelezi, M G; Cebekhulu, R S; Cele, M A; Chiloane, T D; Chohan, F I; Cwele, S C; Dambuza, B N; Daniels, P N; Davies, R H; De Lange, J H; Diale, L N; Dikgacwi, M M; Ditshetelo, I C; Dlakude, D E; Dlamini, B O; Dlodlo, A; Dlomo, B J; Dubazana, Z S; Duma, N M; Ebrahim, E I; Fransman, M L; Fubbs, J L; Gasebonwe, T M A; Gaum, A H; Gcwabaza, N E; Gelderblom, J P; Gigaba, K M N; Gina, N; Gololo, C L; Goqwana, M B; Gumede, D M; Hlengwa, M; Huang, S - B; Jacobus, L; Jeffery, J H; Kekana, C D; Khoarai, L P; Kholwane, S E; Khumalo, F E; Khunou, N P; Koornhof, G W; Kubayi, M T; Landers, L T; Lekgetho, G; Lesoma, R M M; Line- Hendriks, H; Lishivha, T E; Luyenge, Z; Mabasa, X; Mabedla, N R; Mabuza, M C; Madlala, N M; Madlopha, C Q; Mafolo, M V; Magagula, V V; Magama, H T; Magubane, E; Magwanishe, G; Makasi, X C; Makhuba, H N; Makhubela-Mashele, L S; Makhubele, Z S; Makwetla, S P; Malale, M l; Malgas, H H; Maluleka, H P; Maluleke, J M; Manamela, K B; Manana, N C; Manganye, J; Manuel, T A; Mapisa- Nqakula, N N; Mashatile, S P; Mashigo, R M; Mashishi, A C; Masutha, T M; Mathebe, D H; Mathibela, N F; Matlanyane, H F; Matshoba, J M; Mavunda, D W; Mayatula, S M; Maziya, A M; Mdakane, M R; Mfulo, A; Mgabadeli, H C; Mjobo, L N; Mkhize, H B; Mkhulusi, N N P; Mlambo, E M; Mnisi, N A; Mocumi, P A; Mohai, S J; Mohorosi, M; Mokoena, A D; Molebatsi, M A; Molewa, B E E; Moloi- Moropa, J C; Moloto, K A; Moss, L N; Motlanthe, K P; Motsepe, R M; Motshekga, M A; Motshekga, M S; Mpontshane, A M; Msimang, C T; Msweli, H S; Mthethwa, E M; Mthethwa, E N; Mufamadi, T A; Mushwana, F F; Muthambi, A F; N'wamitwa-Shilubana, T L P; Nchabeleng, M E; Ndabandaba, L B G; Ndabeni, S T; Ndebele, J S; Ndlazi, A Z; Ndlovu, V B; Nel, A C; Nelson, W J; Nene, N M; Newhoudt-Druchen, W S; Ngcengwane, N D; Ngcobo, B T; Ngele, N J; Ngubeni- Maluleka, J P; Ngwenya, W; Ngwenya-Mabila, P C; Nhlengethwa, D G; Njikelana, S J; Nkoana-Mashabane, M E; Nkwinti, G E; Nonkonyana, M; November, N T; Ntuli, B M; Ntuli, Z C; Nxesi, T W; Nxumalo, M D; Nyalungu, R E; Nyanda, S; Nyekemba, E; Oliphant, M N; Oosthuizen, G C; Pandor, G N M; Peters, E D; Phaahla, M J; Phaliso, M N; Pilane-Majake, M C C; Pilusa- Mosoane, M E; Pule, D D; Radebe, J T; Radebe, G S; Radebe, B A; Ramatlhodi, N A; Ramodibe, D M; Ramokgopa, G; Schneemann, G D; Segale-Diswai, M J; Selau, G J; September, C C; Sibanyoni, J B; Sibiya, D; Sindane, G S; Singh, N; Sisulu, M V; Sithole, S C N; Sithole, K P; Sizani, P S; Skosana, M B; Smith, V G; Snell, G T; Sogoni, E M; Sonto, M R; Sosibo, J E; Suka, L; Sulliman, E M; Sunduza, T B; Surty, M E; Thabethe, E; Tobias, T V; Tsebe, S R; Tseke, G K; Tsenoli, S L; Tshabalala, J; Tsotetsi, D R; Twala, N M; Van der Merwe, S C; Van Der Merwe, L L; van Rooyen, D D; Van Schalkwyk, M C J; van Wyk, A; Wayile, Z G; Williams, A J; Williams-De Bruyn, S T; Xaba, P P; Ximbi, D L; Xingwana, L M; Yengeni, L E.

NOES - 78: Adams, L H; Alberts, A D; Berend, S R; Bhanga, B M; Boinamo, G G; Bosman, L L; Coetzee, T W; Davidson, I O; De Freitas, M S F; Diemu, B C; Dreyer, A M; Duncan, P C; Eloff, E H; Esau, S; Ferguson, B D; Gcume, N P; George, M E; Greyling, L W; Harris, T; Hill-Lewis, G G; Hoosen, M H; James, W G; Kalyan, S V; Kganare, D A; Kilian, J D; Kloppers-Lourens, J C; Kohler- Barnard, D; Koornhof, N J J v R; Kopane, S P; Krumbock, G R; Lamoela, H; Lee, T D; Lekota, M G P; Lorimer, J R B; Lotriet, A; Lovemore, A T; Mackenzie, G P D; Madisha, W M; Marais, S J F; Max, L H; Maynier, D J; Mazibuko, L D; McGluwa, J J; Michael, N W A; Mileham, K J; Mnqasela, M; More, E; Mosimane, C K K; Motau, S C; Mubu, K S; Mulder, P W A; Mulder, C P; Nhanha, M A; Njobe, M A A; Ollis, I M; Paulse, S; Rabie, P J; Ramatlakane, L; Robinson, D; Rogers, F A; Ross, D C; Schafer, D A; Schmidt, H C; Shinn, M R; Smiles, D C; Steenhuisen, J H; Steyn, A; Steyn, A C; Stubbe, D J; Swart, M; Swathe, M M; Terblanche, J H; Van den Berg, N J; Van Der Linde, N J; Van Dyk, S M; Van Schalkwyk, H C; Waters, M; Watson, A.

Vote accordingly agreed to.

Vote No 16 - Health - put.

Declarations of vote:

House Chair, the DA objects to the Health budget due to the failure of the department to provide adequate and accessible health care to all South Africans, according everyone dignity and respect. More funding should also be made available for primary health care. According to the Auditor-General, the vacancy rate is 31% which, in turn, negatively impacts upon service delivery.

We are in agreement with the report entitled Vacancies and the impact on service delivery produced by the Auditor-General, as we too have witnessed the following at first hand during our visits to the provinces.

There are shortages of specialists, which affect the admission of patients, and there is a lack of appropriate specialist care; the shortage of staff results in overworked and demoralised personnel; a lack of staff in the infrastructure unit resulted in projects not being finalised on time; in addition, poor workmanship was not detected early thereby resulting in unnecessary expenditure for corrective measures; newly built facilities are not being utilised due to a shortage of staff and equipment; a human resource plan is not in place as per the requirement of the Public Service regulation; not all senior managers signed performance agreements; and the lack of ambulances and personnel in emergency medical services has a huge impact on the national norm for response times.

The DA urges the Minister to come up with a plan of how he is going to overcome the crises facing the provincial Departments of Health. Thank you.

Chair, I urge this House to support Budget Vote No 16. I do not think that, as the ANC, we have ever denied the fact that there are challenges in Health; we have always accepted that. But I challenge anybody to beat the ANC in making sure that the department moves in the right direction. [Interjections.] There is no party in South Africa that can do better than the ANC. [Applause.]

One of the things that had never been done in South Africa, probably in the world, is changing life expectancy statistics in just five years, with people living longer. The introduction of universal coverage is something that is mishandled by most departments of health in the whole world, but South Africa has managed to start universal health coverage.

The motion that was read today demonstrates that even the global world recognises that South Africa has done well in dealing with HIV and Aids. This was said by the Secretary-General of the United Nations. [Applause.] We are not saying that we have done everything, but it shows that, under the ANC, South Africa is moving in the right direction. Thank you. [Applause.] Vote agreed to (Democratic Alliance and Independent Democrats dissenting).

Vote No 17 - Higher Education and Training - put:

Declarations of vote:

Chairperson, we are looking at the Higher Education and Training budget and it seems as if the right things are being done, and that substantial funds are allocated to the different sectors, specifically for students' accommodation and infrastructure improvement of further education and training, FET, colleges.

However, the problem is that the funding is focused on enrolment growth rather than improving the actual educational process. The question then is whether that is money well spent.

If we look at the increase in the funding made available to the National Student Financial Aid Scheme, NSFAS, it does seem that the NSFAS is contributing to increasing participation but, unfortunately, not to increasing successful participation. The low success rate of students receiving financial assistance from NSFAS is extremely worrying.

However commendable the efforts are to turnaround the FET colleges, one has to question whether the plan to centralise all colleges under the national department is the answer. It is one thing to say you want to control everything but it is quite another whether you have the capacity to do so.

In this regard, we have to take serious note of the fact that not only are certificates outstanding for months and even years, but students do not get their results from the department timeously.

A further point of concern is the service delivery by the different Sector Education and Training Authorities, Setas. Once again, outstanding certificates remain a problem as well as the administration and management of the Setas. There are even instances where training providers have to wait for up to a year before contracts are finalised. The question is whether the millions spent by the Setas translate into a skilled workforce. The answer is no.The DA cannot support this Vote.

Hon Chairperson, this time around, I hope the chairperson of the committee on higher education and training - unlike the chairperson of the committee on basic education - will hear me when I say that the IFP supports this Vote.

We acknowledge that the department is making the further education and training, FET, institutions of choice for those who desire to further their studies. However, our argument is that, for this to happen, three things must be done: Firstly, there must be an improvement in the curriculum which is currently being offered at these institutions. Our observation is that there is a mismatch between what is produced by the FETs and what is required by the markets.

Secondly, we argue that there must be a vigorous improvement in the infrastructure, especially in those FETs which were previously owned by black people because, again, there is a disparity. When you go to these campuses, you find that some of them are really haunted by the lack of equipment, and if there is any equipment, it is very old.

Thirdly, there must be an improvement in the qualifications of the lecturers at these institutions. I thank you.

Chairperson, I think it must be noted that both hon Lotriet and Mpontshane are making quite good contributions in our committee deliberations. It has been clearly raised by the portfolio committee to the department that we would like them to sort out the issues of certification for the further education and training, FET, learners and those that are enrolled under the sector education and training authorities, setas.

We are well aware that some of the service providers in the Seta system are people that are offering unaccredited programmes, which is, in fact, theft of money from our people. I am surprised that Prof Lotriet could rise here and demand that we must advocate payments for service that is not provided to our people.

I think the department does give considerable endowments to our universities to deal with the issue that is being raised about the low throughput rates in our country. We cannot, as a department, go and offer lessons in a classroom. We should as a society support the institutions in order for them to have programmes that are responsive to the needs of our youth in the country. Concerning the issue raised by hon Mpontshane about the improvement of programmes in the FET sector, just a few weeks ago, the Minister released a framework to guide the sector about qualifications. Historically, one could be a teacher and a lecturer, and now there is going to be a specific lecturer qualification for people who will participate in that sector. I think as the ANC we would like this Parliament to approve Vote No 17. Thank you.

Vote agreed to (Democratic Alliance and Independent Democrats dissenting).

Vote No 18 - Labour - put.

Declarations of vote:

Minister, while we have a sense that you wish to be fair towards all South Africans, your hands are tied by Luthuli House. We have serious problems with many aspects of the labour regime.

While we agree with the protection of workers against overbearing employers, it is our view that certain aspects thereof restrict economic growth and employment creation. For instance, there are the race-based policies which allow the reservation and non-filling of important positions in government that lead to diminish service delivery, as indicated by our very own Auditor-General.

We do believe that there is a way around these policies to ensure a truly inclusive economy. We will speak to the Minister regarding these ideas, but until then, unfortunately, we cannot support this Vote.

Chairperson, central to building the economy is the question of workers' rights, as outlined in our Constitution. This Vote has the delicate but decisive purpose to ensure that poor relations between employers and workers are dealt with in the most appropriate forums.

The basic rights to organise and to strike must remain entrenched if we are to ensure that we strengthen our existing labour relations framework. Negotiations and participative collective bargaining structures at national, industrial and workplace levels play an effective role in the development of our economy and contribute towards growth. Practices which fall outside of this framework can only lead to regression and complicate the need to grow the economy through providing decent work and job opportunities.

The opposition's declaration is underpinned by the fact that they have been unable to come to terms with the labour dispensation that the Constitution has brought into existence, and they instead fight the very spirit and intention of the Constitution that they profess to defend. The ANC supports this Budget Vote. [Applause.]

Vote agreed to (Democratic Alliance, Independent Democrats and Freedom Front Plus dissenting).

Vote No 19 - Social Development - put

Declarations of vote:

Chairperson, the Department of Social Development's responsibility is to ensure that the most vulnerable in our society are taken care of. Despite this mandate, three key subprogrammes' funding have been slashed: Firstly, the funding for the subprogramme dealing with substance abuse has been reduced by 18% despite the pandemic swooping across our country and despite the President declaring this as a national emergency. Secondly, funding towards the youth has been slashed by 29%, which again should have been used in developing our youth and steering them away from harmful substances; and thirdly, the department has cut funding to older persons by a staggering 33%.

This clearly shows that the department has deliberately gone for soft targets while refusing to cut wasteful expenditure in other areas such as the National Development Agency, NDA, who have awarded themselves a 600% increase for the expenditure of the board and over 900% increase for new furniture for the board. The average salary of the employees at NDA is over half million rand each.

Other areas of concern are the Child Protection Register. It is irrelevant if there are 430 entered names on the register of 305. It is a disgrace that it is so low.

We still do not have a national drug master plan which is supposed to be the blueprint in the fight against substance abuse.

Despite having 3,8 million orphans in our country we still have a shortfall of over 50 000 social workers for the Children's Act alone. The DA cannot simply turn a blind eye to the plight of millions of vulnerable people in our country while the department cuts the budget to essential service. The DA cannot support this budget. I thank you.

The ANC supports Budget Vote No 19. Why do we support this Vote? It is because it provides social assistance to 15 million South Africans every month and because the child support grant is reaching 12 million children. It reached this number in 2012 and is proving to be a good tool in the reduction of child poverty. You can go to the annual report of United Nations Children's Fund, Unicef; it is there in black and white.

The Western Cape government has cut all their social development programmes. They have closed off funding to the paralegal offices that have been there, helping our people before apartheid. So they have closed that funding off, and they have left many of our vulnerable groups without support in the Western Cape.

A DA council in the Eastern Cape has circulated a racist e-mail, saying the ANC was producing dumb idiots who wait for handouts. It also said Zuma is leading a country where a quarter of schoolgirls are HIV-positive, because Africans spread the disease more than any one else in the world.

Because of the ANC-led government, more children are receiving the child support grant than at any time in the history of South Africa. We are serving our people with dignity. We will now universalise the old age grant in the next five years.

The number of children also benefiting from Early Childhood Development, ECD, in ANC-led provinces is increasing. The budget is an investment in the future of our children, the youth, the people with disabilities, the vulnerable women and especially our aged. [Applause.]

Division demanded.

The House divided: AYES - 226: Abram, S; Adams, P E; Bam-Mugwanya, V; Berend, S R; Bhengu, P; Bhengu, N R; Bhengu, F; Bikani, F C; Bonhomme, T; Booi, M S; Borman, G M; Boshigo, D F; Botha, Y R; Bothman, S G; Burgess, C V; Cebekhulu, R S; Cele, M A; Chiloane, T D; Chohan, F I; Coleman, E M; Cwele, S C; Dambuza, B N; Daniels, P N; Davies, R H; De Lange, J H; Diale, L N; Dikgacwi, M M; Dlakude, D E; Dlamini, B O; Dlodlo, A; Dlomo, B J; Dubazana, Z S; Dube, M C; Duma, N M; Ebrahim, E I; Ferguson, B D; Fransman, M L; Fubbs, J L; Gasebonwe, T M A; Gaum, A H; Gcume, N P; Gcwabaza, N E; Gelderblom, J P; George, M E; Gigaba, K M N; Gina, N; Goqwana, M B; Gumede, D M; Hlengwa, M; Huang, S - B; Jacobus, L; Jeffery, J H; Kekana, C D; Kenye, T E; Khoarai, L P; Kholwane, S E; Khumalo, F E; Khunou, N P; Kilian, J D; Koornhof, G W; Koornhof, N J J v R; Kubayi, M T; Landers, L T; Lekgetho, G; Lekota, M G P; Lesoma, R M M; Line-Hendriks, H; Lishivha, T E; Luyenge, Z; Mabasa, X; Mabedla, N R; Mabuza, M C; Madisha, W M; Madlala, N M; Madlopha, C Q; Mafolo, M V; Magagula, V V; Magama, H T; Magwanishe, G; Makasi, X C; Makhuba, H N; Makhubela-Mashele, L S; Makhubele, Z S; Makwetla, S P; Malale, M l; Malgas, H H; Maluleka, H P; Maluleke, J M; Manamela, K B; Manganye, J; Mangena, M S; Manuel, T A; Mapisa-Nqakula, N N; Mashatile, S P; Mashigo, R M; Mashishi, A C; Masilo, J M; Masutha, T M; Mathebe, D H; Mathibela, N F; Matlanyane, H F; Matshoba, J M; Mavunda, D W; Mayatula, S M; Maziya, A M; Mdakane, M R; Mfeketo, N C; Mfulo, A; Mgabadeli, H C; Mjobo, L N; Mkhize, H B; Mkhulusi, N N P; Mlambo, E M; Mmusi, S G; Mnisi, N A; Mocumi, P A; Mohai, S J; Mohorosi, M; Mokoena, A D; Molebatsi, M A; Molewa, B E E; Moloi-Moropa, J C; Moloto, K A; Moni, C M; Mosimane, C K K; Moss, L N; Motlanthe, K P; Motsepe, R M; Motshekga, M A; Motshekga, M S; Mpontshane, A M; Msimang, C T; Msweli, H S; Mthethwa, E M; Mthethwa, E N; Mufamadi, T A; Mushwana, F F; Muthambi, A F; Nchabeleng, M E; Ndabandaba, L B G; Ndabeni, S T; Ndebele, J S; Ndlazi, A Z; Ndlovu, V B; Nel, A C; Nelson, W J; Nene, N M; Newhoudt-Druchen, W S; Ngcengwane, N D; Ngcobo, E N N; Ngcobo, B T; Ngele, N J; Ngubeni-Maluleka, J P; Ngwenya, W; Ngwenya- Mabila, P C; Nhanha, M A; Nhlengethwa, D G; Njikelana, S J; Njobe, M A A; Nkoana-Mashabane, M E; Nkwinti, G E; Nonkonyana, M; November, N T; Ntapane, S Z; Ntuli, B M; Ntuli, Z C; Nxesi, T W; Nxumalo, M D; Nyalungu, R E; Nyekemba, E; Oliphant, M N; Oosthuizen, G C; Pandor, G N M; Peters, E D; Petersen-Maduna, P; Phaahla, M J; Phaliso, M N; Pilane-Majake, M C C; Pilusa-Mosoane, M E; Pule, D D; Radebe, B A; Radebe, J T; Radebe, G S; Ramatlakane, L; Ramatlhodi, N A; Ramodibe, D M; Schneemann, G D; Segale- Diswai, M J; September, C C; Sibanyoni, J B; Sibiya, D; Sindane, G S; Sisulu, M V; Sithole, S C N; Sithole, K P; Sizani, P S; Smith, V G; Snell, G T; Sogoni, E M; Sonto, M R; Suka, L; Sulliman, E M; Sunduza, T B; Surty, M E; Swart, S N; Thabethe, E; Thibedi, J D; Tobias, T V; Tsebe, S R; Tseke, G K; Tsenoli, S L; Tshabalala, J; Tsotetsi, D R; Turok, B; Twala, N M; Van der Merwe, S C; Van Der Merwe, L L; van Rooyen, D D; Van Schalkwyk, M C J; van Wyk, A; Wayile, Z G; Williams-De Bruyn, S T; Xaba, P P; Ximbi, D L; Xingwana, L M; Yengeni, L E.

NOES - 59: Alberts, A D; Boinamo, G G; Bosman, L L; Coetzee, T W; Davidson, I O; De Freitas, M S F; Dreyer, A M; Du Toit, N D; Duncan, P C; Eloff, E H; Esau, S; Greyling, L W; Groenewald, P J; Hoosen, M H; Kalyan, S V; Kganare, D A; Kohler-Barnard, D; Kopane, S P; Krumbock, G R; Lamoela, H; Lee, T D; Lorimer, J R B; Lotriet, A; Lovemore, A T; Marais, S J F; Max, L H; Maynier, D J; Mazibuko, L D; McGluwa, J J; Michael, N W A; Mileham, K J; Mnqasela, M; More, E; Motau, S C; Mubu, K S; Mulder, C P; Mulder, P W A; Ollis, I M; Rabie, P J; Robinson, D; Ross, D C; Schafer, D A; Schmidt, H C; Shinn, M R; Smiles, D C; Steenhuisen, J H; Steyn, A C; Steyn, A; Stubbe, D J; Swart, M; Swathe, M M; Terblanche, J F; Van den Berg, N J; Van Der Linde, N J; Van Der Westhuizen, A P; Van Dyk, S M; Van Schalkwyk, H C; Waters, M; Watson, A.

Vote accordingly agreed to.

Vote No 20 - Sport and Recreation South Africa- put.

Declarations of vote:

Hon Chairperson, the IFP applauds the Department of Sport and Recreation for its drive to celebrate and reward the achievements of our sports heroes. However, spending R65 million, of which the Department of Sport and Recreation is forking out a massive R21 million on awards, is beyond excessive and makes a mockery of the collective struggles of many sporting aspirants who languish daily to realise their full potential in the absence of sporting infrastructure and resources.

The IFP agrees that we should celebrate sports in this country, but we should do so by giving the different codes all the resources they need, rather than throwing an extravagant party that caters to the desires of the elite. Therefore, sport should not be approached with the Minister's humdinger or razzmatazz attitude, but with the seriousness it deserves as an agent for social change and nation-building.

Since 1994, promises have been made that every school will have a sports field and a sports facility; yet this has not happened. The continual absence of these things entrenches inequality in sport. The excessive spending on the sport awards takes that inequality to another level. Whilst the IFP supports this Budget Vote, we cannot support excessive spending such as that on the sport awards. I thank you.

Chairperson, the ANC wishes to reiterate its support for the Budget Vote of the Department of Sports and Recreation. In all situations, excellence and merit are recognised. It is an international practice that all athletes are recognised for their good efforts and performance in sport. The high-performance programme is part of the sports development process.

We acknowledge the efforts made by the department to develop sports through mass participation, whilst we also recognise the value added by our high- performance athletes at the international level. That is why we fully support the funding of sport awards by both government and the private sector.

The sport education budget is about development and transformation. We are a country that believes that sport has the power to change the world. It has the power to unite in a way that little else does. It speaks to the youth in a language that they understand. It can create hope where there is despair. It is more powerful than government in breaking down the racial barriers. I thank you. [Applause.]

Division demanded.

The House divided:

AYES - 232: Abram, S; Adams, P E; Bam-Mugwanya, V; Berend, S R; Bhanga, B M; Bhengu, F; Bhengu, N R; Bhengu, P; Bikani, F C; Bonhomme, T; Booi, M S; Borman, G M; Boshigo, D F; Botha, Y R; Bothman, S G; Burgess, C V; Cebekhulu, R S; Cele, M A; Chiloane, T D; Chohan, F I; Coleman, E M; Cwele, S C; Dambuza, B N; Daniels, P N; Davies, R H; De Lange, J H; Diale, L N; Diemu, B C; Dikgacwi, M M; Dlakude, D E; Dlamini, B O; Dlodlo, A; Dlomo, B J; Dubazana, Z S; Dube, M C; Duma, N M; Ebrahim, E I; Ferguson, B D; Fransman, M L; Fubbs, J L; Gasebonwe, T M A; Gaum, A H; Gcume, N P; Gcwabaza, N E; Gelderblom, J P; Gigaba, K M N; Gina, N; Gololo, C L; Goqwana, M B; Gumede, D M; Hajaig, F; Hlengwa, M; Huang, S - B; Jacobus, L; Jeffery, J H; Kenye, T E; Kganare, D A; Khoarai, L P; Kholwane, S E; Khumalo, F E; Khunou, N P; Kilian, J D; Koornhof, N J J v R; Koornhof, G W; Kubayi, M T; Landers, L T; Lekgetho, G; Lekota, M G P; Lesoma, R M M; Line-Hendriks, H; Lishivha, T E; Luyenge, Z; Mabasa, X; Mabedla, N R; Mabuza, M C; Mackenzie, G P D; Madisha, W M; Madlala, N M; Madlopha, C Q; Mafolo, M V; Magagula, V V; Magama, H T; Magubane, E; Magwanishe, G; Makasi, X C; Makhubela-Mashele, L S; Makhubele, Z S; Makwetla, S P; Malale, M l; Malgas, H H; Maluleka, H P; Maluleke, J M; Manamela, K B; Manganye, J; Mangena, M S; Manuel, T A; Mapisa-Nqakula, N N; Mashatile, S P; Mashigo, R M; Mashishi, A C; Masilo, J M; Masutha, T M; Mathebe, D H; Mathibela, N F; Matlanyane, H F; Matshoba, J M; Mavunda, D W; Mayatula, S M; Maziya, A M; Mdakane, M R; Mfeketo, N C; Mfulo, A; Mgabadeli, H C; Mjobo, L N; Mkhize, H B; Mkhulusi, N N P; Mlambo, E M; Mmusi, S G; Mnisi, N A; Mocumi, P A; Mohai, S J; Mohorosi, M; Mokoena, A D; Molebatsi, M A; Molewa, B E E; Moloi- Moropa, J C; Moloto, K A; Moni, C M; Mosimane, C K K; Moss, L N; Motlanthe, K P; Motsepe, R M; Motshekga, M S; Motshekga, M A; Mpontshane, A M; Msimang, C T; Msweli, H S; Mthethwa, E M; Mthethwa, E N; Mufamadi, T A; Mushwana, F F; Muthambi, A F; Nchabeleng, M E; Ndabandaba, L B G; Ndabeni, S T; Ndebele, J S; Ndlazi, A Z; Ndlovu, V B; Nel, A C; Nelson, W J; Nene, N M; Newhoudt-Druchen, W S; Ngcengwane, N D; Ngcobo, B T; Ngcobo, E N N; Ngele, N J; Ngubeni-Maluleka, J P; Ngwenya, W; Ngwenya-Mabila, P C; Nhanha, M A; Nhlengethwa, D G; Njikelana, S J; Njobe, M A A; Nkoana-Mashabane, M E; Nkwinti, G E; Nonkonyana, M; November, N T; Ntapane, S Z; Ntuli, Z C; Ntuli, B M; Nxesi, T W; Nxumalo, M D; Nyalungu, R E; Nyanda, S; Nyekemba, E; Oliphant, M N; Oosthuizen, G C; Pandor, G N M; Peters, E D; Petersen- Maduna, P; Phaahla, M J; Phaliso, M N; Pilane-Majake, M C C; Pilusa- Mosoane, M E; Radebe, B A; Radebe, J T; Radebe, G S; Ramatlakane, L; Ramatlhodi, N A; Ramodibe, D M; Schneemann, G D; Segale-Diswai, M J; September, C C; Sibanyoni, J B; Sibiya, D; Sindane, G S; Singh, N; Sisulu, M V; Sithole, K P; Sithole, S C N; Sizani, P S; Smith, V G; Sogoni, E M; Sonto, M R; Sosibo, J E; Suka, L; Sulliman, E M; Surty, M E; Swart, S N; Thabethe, E; Thibedi, J D; Tobias, T V; Tsebe, S R; Tseke, G K; Tsenoli, S L; Tshabalala, J; Tsotetsi, D R; Turok, B; Twala, N M; Van Der Merwe, L L; Van der Merwe, S C; van Rooyen, D D; Van Schalkwyk, M C J; van Wyk, A; Wayile, Z G; Williams, A J; Williams-De Bruyn, S T; Xaba, P P; Ximbi, D L; Xingwana, L M; Yengeni, L E.

NOES - 62: Alberts, A D; Boinamo, G G; Bosman, L L; Coetzee, T W; Davidson, I O; De Freitas, M S F; Dreyer, A M; Du Toit, N D; Duncan, P C; Eloff, E H; Esau, S; Greyling, L W; Groenewald, P J; Harris, T; Hill-Lewis, G G; Hoosen, M H; James, W G; Kalyan, S V; Kloppers-Lourens, J C; Kohler- Barnard, D; Kopane, S P; Krumbock, G R; Lamoela, H; Lee, T D; Lorimer, J R B; Lotriet, A; Lovemore, A T; Marais, S J F; Max, L H; Maynier, D J; Mazibuko, L D; McGluwa, J J; Michael, N W A; Mileham, K J; Mnqasela, M; More, E; Motau, S C; Mubu, K S; Mulder, C P; Mulder, P W A; Ollis, I M; Rabie, P J; Rogers, F A; Ross, D C; Schafer, D A; Schmidt, H C; Shinn, M R; Smiles, D C; Steenhuisen, J H; Steyn, A C; Steyn, A; Stubbe, D J; Swart, M; Swathe, M M; Terblanche, J F; Van den Berg, N J; Van Der Linde, N J; Van Der Westhuizen, A P; Van Dyk, S M; Van Schalkwyk, H C; Waters, M; Watson,