test that I described earlier on. To repeat, there were 142 potential candidates including eight Eskom employees. A shortlist of 17 was provided by the search agency. Eight of the candidates withdrew; six were interviewed by the board; four were shortlisted for competency test; out of the four three were then shortlisted and they went through the processes of the competency test; there were further discussions by the board; the President had appointed a few Ministers to interview two of them; and Mr De Ruyter emerged as the candidate to be chosen.