Chairperson and hon members, let me start this way. Minister, this is the clearest expression of what the Constitution means when it says the three spheres are interrelated and interdependent, yet distinct. For me the clearest rationale for the existence of this department in the Presidency is to give practical expression to that view. In other words, the Constitution is a guide to how we as a government must behave politically and organisationally.
When the Constitution calls for co-operative governance, it wants that in practice, and of those of us who may have been worried about duplication and overlaps, I ask this question. How do you manage interdependency? How do you manage this interrelatedness, except through dialogue, constant continuous discussion and debate? This is the mechanism through which you do that. In my humble opinion, sir, you are doing that.
Secondly, stating the problems inside departments is really not original. This is what we do in our committees on a regular basis. It is not fresh intellectually, and it does not enhance dealing with those problems.
The department in its documentation identifies what it calls risks. For example, it discusses "buy in", and some people may not want to buy into what we are doing. They may not implement the recommendations that are made. The results of research and evidence given to them may not lead to improvements. These are the risks. But there are proposed solutions to these kinds of problems.
Hon Trollip makes an interesting observation about an example in the SAPS and says that the people there are not interested in monitoring themselves and self-correcting. At the same time he says that there is no need for an external bureaucratic structure - why do we need such a structure to do that from the outside? That is strange logic. I would have thought that this was precisely why we need others' eyes to look at what we are doing ourselves, for greater improvement and so on. You also can't say that the Protection of Information Bill is being railroaded. They now call it the Secrecy Bill! How is it being railroaded, in other words, rushed through? Those are public hearings by a properly constituted ad hoc committee of Parliament to consider those issues, listen to views and so on. Strangely, he wants the municipal systems legislation to be railroaded by the President. Hurry it up, and sign it fast! [Interjections.]