I think it is important to once more express my appreciation to all the members for their informative input. I sit here and learn every time. It is a mature engagement, which I always appreciate.
I will not respond to individuals. I may respond to some comments by individuals but I will not be able to respond to everybody individually.
This is a very involved, complicated and technical portfolio. I always feel that we are not getting enough space to engage. One cannot engage with all of these matters. If you look at Environmental Affairs, there is so much that we have to talk about, but we are not. We can't, in 132 minutes, deal with all of these things. Each of these branches has projects that are complex and involved.
I am appealing to the Members of Parliament to use the space they have to engage with us, for example member statements. I was a back-bencher for nine years, so I know these things. Please, engage with us through those other mechanisms that Parliament affords you. I am really imploring the Chairperson to lead in this regard. I know that it has happened here before.
I am saying this because there is an outstanding report that we need to discuss with Parliament. I also want to propose that we discuss it. When we were to leave for Copenhagen, we had to get a mandate from Parliament. I don't think we reported formally to Parliament in order to interrogate the contents. Now it's coming piecemeal and we are not doing justice to the report. It is a comprehensive report, especially as part of the preparation for the Conference of Parties, Cop 17.
Having said that, we really work from the premise, as Mr Luyenge and other members said, that South Africans have the right to a clean environment. That is the premise we are moving from. However, the challenge that we have as a developing country is the dynamic of balancing development with conservation, in the pursuance of sustainable development. That is the trickiest part of the function of Environmental Affairs.
I will try and cover, as broadly as possible, all of these issues raised by members. The Eskom loan suggests the responsible way in which we pursue development. Mr Greyling says we are reactive. The question he is asking is: are we committed, as a department, to ensuring that the constitutional rights of South Africans are realised? That is the question in a nutshell.
It is a very complex matter, given that we need electricity. Yesterday we were almost in a crisis situation because of electricity. We have a situation of energy poverty in our country. Some parts of the country do not have electricity. They have never seen it before. They literally live in darkness. KwaZulu-Natal is the darkest province. Along with that, there is poverty. All of those people trapped in darkness are people who are in poverty. As a catalyst for poverty alleviation, one needs electricity. That is the kind of challenge we have in maintaining balance. It is always going to be a challenge.
The wisdom of my predecessor was bringing long-term mitigation scenarios as studies to guide South Africa so that, in the process of pursuing development, we do it in a responsible way. What we are saying is that even the coal we burn to generate electricity has been accommodated in the long- term mitigation scenarios.
We need a period of transition and we need to level the playing fields. We can't be abrupt in moving away from using coal for power generation. It is not possible, because carbon is needed and the technology for renewable sources is at its lowest level of development. If you pursue clean technology, it means you are going to import. Importing will then lead to capital flight. You definitely have to import.
Look at carbon capture and storage. Where else is CCS? Carbon capture and storage is more Australian. It means, then, that we have to buy this technology from Australia, or else you need to allow for its development. If you want to access it in South Africa, you need to allow for its development. That transitional period is needed. We are at that point. We are transitioning towards less dependence on coal for power. I don't want to say we're totally moving away from it - that is also not possible. What is possible is for us to reduce our dependence on that fossil fuel.
It is more about the complexities around maintaining a balance. It is the biggest challenge I have. I appreciate all the concerns that colleagues and members are raising on this matter.
Rhino poaching is really a big challenge, Mr Morgan. In this year alone, 55 have already been poached. We are predicting that by the end of this financial year we will be at 163. Why are we not debating this in Parliament in the context of the International Year of Biodiversity so that we can look at what is happening to our fauna and flora in South Africa? It would give us a better opportunity to engage with each other on these matters.
We are working with many security forces and the South African Police Service, SAPS, are also involved. We are in the process of strengthening our capacity. As you correctly said, we are dealing with a sophisticated mafia from Asia and all over the world. We are working hard on this but it is very complex. The same applies to abalone. I agree that we need to work harder.
The criminal justice system is not friendly to dealing with environmental crimes. That is the other issue we are dealing with, in the context of an integrated approach to addressing these crimes.
The amendment of the South African Weather Service Act is under way. It will be dealing with issues of governance, etc. It will go out for public consultation and you will get the opportunity to deal with it.
On the issue of captive-bred lions, I have taken note of what you have said and we will be looking at various options to deal with lions kept in captivity. We are looking at the creation of sanctuaries and sterilisation. We are looking into the matter.
On the issue of Langebaan, I am not privy to the details of what you have raised. As you will appreciate, the Environmental Impact Assessment, EIA, competence is on two levels. If the project is a national project, it should have come to us. If it is a provincial project, it might be with your friend, Anton Bredell. Maybe you should speak to Anton. But we will pay attention to that.
On the issue of mining, we have started discussions with that Minister. I do not know what they will translate into. I do not know whether we will be able to create a structure, or where it will end up. We are engaging with mining and this is the product of that engagement. It is still at the draft stage but we can give it to members. We will get it and a copy will be made available. We are engaging and something is happening, namely the South African Mining and Biodiversity Forum. There is a document that will help us in dealing with all matters related to mining and biodiversity.
There was a proposal - I think it was made by the general - that we decentralise the law. That is already happening. Local government is involved in air quality and our laws are appreciative of that.
We are developing a policy on waste management.
I really want to thank all members. Information is always overflowing when we deal with matters here. That is the nature of this department. That is why I ask that we engage more. Thank you for a good debate. [Applause.]
Debate concluded.