Chairperson and hon members, at the extended Cabinet lekgotla in January 2006, the national government together with the Premiers and the SA Local Government Association, Salga, adopted the Five-Year Local Government Strategic Agenda from 2006-2011.
Three strategic priorities were adopted to define the nature of our work in strengthening our overall system of local government. These priorities were: firstly, mainstreaming hands-on support to local government to improve municipal governance, performance and accountability; secondly, addressing the structure and governance arrangements of the state in order to better strengthen, support and monitor local government; and lastly, refining and strengthening the policy, regulatory and fiscal environment for local government and giving greater attention to the enforcement measures.
Today, the Local Government Laws Amendment Bill before this House must be seen as part of our implementation of the third strategic priority, which is about refining and strengthening the policy, regulatory and fiscal environment for local government. Refining the policy environment for local government is an intrinsic part of the commitment on the part of the Department of Provincial and Local Government to ensure that local government delivers services to the people. The Local Government Laws Amendment Bill of 2007 is one important step in this direction. As you may be aware, other processes will also follow. For example, the House will be aware that a significant policy review of provincial and local government is currently underway under the stewardship of the Department of Provincial and Local Government.
In general, the Local Government Laws Amendment Bill effects amendments that refine, adjust and align core local government legislation, such as the Local Government: Municipal Demarcation Act of 1998, the Local Government: Municipal Structures Act of 1998, the Local Government: Municipal Systems Act of 2000 and the Local Government: Municipal Property Rates Act of 2003. It also repeals legislation that has become redundant.
The policy intentions of the amendments contained in the Bill serve to, among others, specifically improve fiscal alignment, planning and budgeting; promote the uniform interpretation and application of the law; enhance performance management in local government; further refine and remove impediments in the implementation of municipal property rates; promote practices in good governance; and ensure alignment of legislation pertaining to local government.
The Department of Provincial and Local Government welcomes the additional amendment adopted by the Select Committee on Local Government and Administration that strengthens the role of ward committees in public participation. The Bill that was presented to the select committee provided for a significant improvement of the role of the ward committee to further deepen democracy, and community involvement in local development projects.
The select committee has added to this improvement by now making it possible for the members of the ward committee to elect their own chairperson of the committee, instead of the previous dispensation where the ward councillor was the chair by law.
The select committee has also aligned the term of office of the ward committee with that of the council, i.e. five years, making for greater stability in the administration and life cycle of the ward committee. Other matters deliberated on by the select committee ensured greater alignment of the participation of staff members in elections with the Public Service Amendment Act of 2007. Furthermore, the Bill defines the meaning of "close family member" when providing for the involvement of municipal staff and political office bearers in procurement matters, and strengthening the role and involvement of the National Council of Provinces in matters relating to nonperformance and maladministration in municipalities, and providing for flexibility in dealing with matters relating to intergovernmental planning and the demarcation of boundaries and the adjustments of the division of powers and functions between districts and local municipalities.
I appreciate the important role that the NCOP continues to play as an integral part of the democratic process and as envisaged by our Constitution. In this regard, I would like to thank the members of the Select Committee on Local Government and Administration, under the able leadership of Mr Sicelo Shiceka, for the lively discussions and for managing a consensus on key matters amongst affected stakeholders on some matters of the Bill. I would also like to thank all stakeholders who provided useful comments and insights on various clauses of this Bill. I urge all the members of the NCOP to vote for the adoption of the Bill so that we can now follow the process for its final deliberation by the Portfolio Committee on Provincial and Local Government of the National Assembly. I thank you. [Applause.]
Chairperson, I must say that I appreciate the words of the Deputy Minister. This was the first time in four years that I have been singled out by the Minister to thank me for the role that I played! [Interjections.]
House Chairperson, Deputy Minister, colleagues, officials from the department, members of the media houses, ladies and gentlemen, we are today passing a piece of legislation that is adding to the process of change and transformation. This process was started in 1994 in a democratic breakthrough.
We are now almost 14 years into a democratic dispensation. We have learnt a lot of lessons in the process. Based on those experiences we are making these amendments, which are dealing with three pieces of legislation, creating an omnibus instrument that will be able to ensure that it adds to the arsenal for change and transformation. This tool is a precursor to an extensive process of a White Paper which is aimed at reflecting on our footsteps to date, going down memory lane.
This process was characterised by vigorous and serious engagements, particularly with regard to the fact that there is a view, Deputy Minister, in the committee that there's some denudation of the powers and functions of provinces in this respect. Whether that is done by commission or omission is something that has to be told by historians.
We are engaging in this process to look at the role of provinces. We say, if there is any review of the role of provinces, that must be put in the open so that all and sundry can make a contribution that will ensure that these matters are dealt with and handled collectively by all of us.
Let me go down memory lane and look at how provinces and this House were created.
The decision to create provinces was not taken lightly. It was preceded by intense political debate, and compromise as well as extensive research and consultation at a local and international level. It was arguably the most contentious part of the negotiation process.
The pros and cons of a federal system and the creation of constitutionally guaranteed powers and functions characterised much of the constitutional debate and the discourse that took place between 1990 and 1996. Prior to the creation of nine provinces, South Africa historically had four provinces, 10 homelands and nine development regions. None of these had wide political credibility, support or legitimacy. Four questions arose at the time when negotiations commenced: Why should there be a second tier of government? How should they be demarcated? What should be their powers? How should their powers be protected?
It was widely recognised in the constitutional debate that, owing to its history, its size, geographical features, development needs and population composition, South Africa would require some form of provincial government. Their concern, however, was that a balance had to be found between defining the role of provinces as a formal sphere of government with guaranteed powers and their importance to national integration, nation-building and minimum standards of development for the entire nation.
The legacy of the dreaded homeland system was so fresh in the minds of many, particularly the liberation movements that they were fiercely opposed to any form of entrenched provincial system of government. I quote:
The ANC's vision of a future form of state is based on the view that territorial divisions brought about by apartheid, specifically the independent homelands, must be reversed. The shift which has occurred within the ANC towards greater powers of provinces still does not place the ANC within the group who advocates a federal outcome.
Various reasons were forwarded at the time in favour of the creation of provinces, for example, the size of South Africa makes it impossible to be governed by only national and local governments. The population composition of South Africa requires some form of regional organisation to allow, informally, for cultural, regional and language diversity. Decentralisation to regional and local governments in developed and developing countries have been shown to build capacity and lead to more efficient government.
Political and civil society formations in South Africa were already organised in some form or basis, for example labour unions, political parties, sporting bodies, religious groupings, agricultural organisations and business bodies.
Provinces would be the best way to build national unity, while at the same time recognising diversity and the rise of minority political groupings.
Decentralisation would encourage experimentation and creativity at provincial levels. Decentralisation would build leadership in government and administrative sectors. Decentralisation would enhance the accessibility of government and decision-making. Decentralisation would bring government closer to the people.
Provinces are recognised by the 1996 Constitution of the Republic as a separate sphere of government. The reason why the word "sphere" rather than "level" is used in the Constitution is to make sure that it emphasises that there is no hierarchy between governments. It means there should be no big brother and small brother.
It encourages co-operative relationships between the spheres of government. It means there is no sphere of government that can encroach on the powers of another sphere of government, as opposed to the potential situation in a unitary system. A unitary system refers to a level, indicating hierarchical relationships between the respective levels of government.
Each sphere has constitutionally guaranteed powers and functions, although the national Parliament is empowered to legislate on a set of minimum norms and standards applicable to the entire nation. Each sphere is required to exercise its powers in a manner that does not encroach on the geographical, functional or institutional integrity of another sphere.
This House is the custodian of Chapter 3 of the Constitution. It means we must continuously be vigilant at all times in ensuring that there is no sphere of government that encroaches on the powers of another sphere of government. That is our responsibility, because we are looking at the interests of everyone in this House.
The committee supports the Bill with amendments made as they were defined by the Deputy Minister, and I hope that our colleagues are going to define and explain other amendments that we have made as well as the entire Bill, but we believe as the committee that this Bill is creating new possibilities in ensuring that democracy is entrenched in our society. This Bill, we believe, takes us forward on the road of ensuring that the system of government in this country of co-operative relationships is entrenched.
In conclusion, allow me to thank the Department of Provincial and Local Government for its contribution; National Treasury; the Demarcation Board and Adv Adhikane for their enlightened and robust contributions, particularly amongst themselves in the task team. I must also thank members of the committee for their insightful contributions, which have managed to enrich the Bill, and staff members for their dedication, commitment and support to the committee.
Deputy Minister, we agreed as the committee that we would prefer it if future Bills could be introduced by executive authorities so that we can engage in political questions, rather than them being introduced by officials. At the same time the committee is waiting anxiously for this extensive process of the White Paper on Local Government and the White Paper on Provincial Government. We want to make a contribution to that process so that it can benefit from our collective experience as the leadership. Thank you very much, Chairperson. [Applause.]
Voorsitter, Adjunkminister en agb kollegas, die doel van hierdie wysigingswet is om bestaande wette te versterk en in ooreenstemming te bring met die nuwe omstandighede wat tans heers. Daar is met die beraadslaging bewys dat hierdie gekose komitee nooit gebruik sal word as 'n rubberstempel nie. Die Adjunkminister het dit so pas bevestig en ons s vir haar baie dankie.
Die DA verskil wel oor die koppeling tussen die Minister van Plaaslike Bestuur en die Minister vir die Staatsdiens en Administrasie. Hierdie is twee verskillende departemente en behoort vir altyd onafhanklik van mekaar te bly.
Waar ons egter nie verskil nie, is dat die Nasionale Raad van Provinsies 'n belangrike rol in wetgewing kan en moet speel, soos nou deur hierdie komitee bewys is. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)
[Mr J W LE ROUX: Chairperson, Deputy Minister and hon colleagues, the aim of this amending Bill is to strengthen existing Acts and to bring them in line with the new prevailing conditions. Through this deliberation it has been proven that this select committee will never be used as a rubber stamp. The Deputy Minister has just confirmed the aforementioned and we want to thank her for that.
The DA certainly disagrees with regard to linking up the Minister of Local Government and the Minister for Public Service and Administration. These are two different departments and should remain independent of each other.
However, we do not disagree with the fact that the National Council of Provinces could and should play an important role in legislation, as has now been proven by this committee.]
Chairperson, I would like to touch on some of the important clauses that were amended, starting with clause 6, which deals with ward committees.
Firstly, a metro or a local council must develop a policy to determine the criteria on which out-of-pocket expenses will be calculated and paid; secondly, a budget allocation must be made from the municipal coffers; and thirdly, the MEC must monitor all aspects of the policy. It is important to force councils to be fair to ward committee members without wasting taxpayers' money.
As far as the employment contracts of municipal managers are concerned, the committee decided that the municipal manager's term must not exceed six months after the election of the next council of a municipality. It is important that a new council must, if necessary, be free to appoint its preferred municipal manager.
As far as the participation of staff members in elections is concerned, the committee decided that the candidate needs only to resign his position after being elected, and not when he is accepted as a candidate. It will be grossly unfair to expect from a candidate to lose his position of employment in the event of the candidate not succeeding in an election.
The committee was united in its efforts to fight corruption. As far as doing business with the council is concerned, a councillor, as well as his or her close family, may not be beneficiaries. Right through the country, councillors have benefited from contracts with their councils, and this unacceptable practice must now stop.
Section 102 of the Local Government: Municipal Systems Act is amended by the addition of subclause 3. I quote the subclause:
A municipality must provide an owner of a property in its jurisdiction with copies of accounts sent to the occupier of the property for municipal services applied to such a property if the owner requests such an account in writing from the municipality.
This is a very important clause because, in the past, property owners were in the dark as to what outstanding amounts were due. Only when the property was sold would the outstanding amounts come to the notice of the owner. In such cases, the transfer of the property could not take place until all debts had been settled.
Lastly, I would again like to thank the chairperson of this committee for the impartial and effective way in which he conducts the business of the committee. Thank you.
Chairperson, hon Deputy Minister, hon members, comrades and friends ...
... ngizothi angiqale nje ngiveze ukuthi uma sikhuluma ngohulumeni wasekhaya, sikhuluma ngohulumeni obalulekile ngoba sonke lapha akekho ongahlali kuhulumeni wasekhaya, ngisho uMongameli uqobo lwakhe uhlala ewadini. Ngakho-ke kufanele njalo sazi ukuthi izinqumo esizithathayo akekho umuntu lapha okuthiwa unguzwelonke uma ngabe kukhulunywa ngewadi ngoba sonke sihlala emawadini, kuhulumeni wasekhaya.
Engifisa ukukuveza lapha kubahlonishwa yilokhu kokuthi unyaka wezimali komasipala awuhambisani nonyaka wezimali onjengokahulumeni kazwelonke. Siyazi ukuthi laphaya unyaka wezimali komasipala uqala ekuqaleni kukaJulayi bese uphela ekupheleni kukaJuni onyakeni olandelayo. Lokhu-ke ngikuphakamisa ngoba ngifuna ukuthi sikuqonde lapha esikwenzile ngesikhathi sichibiyela lo Mthethosivivinywa, akuthi uma kuzothintwa imingcele yomasipala, kofanele sazi ukuthi ukuthinteka kwaleyo mingcele kumbe ukusebenza kokuthinteka komngcele kuzosebenza njalo uma kuqala unyaka wezimali, ukuze izimali lezi ezisuke sezabelwe ngokwamawadi noma omasipala zikwazi ukuthi zabiwe ngendlela eyiyo.
Lokhu sikubona ngokuthi esizamile ukukwenza lapha njengekomiti ukuthi uma kuzothinteka imingcele yomasipala kuzofanele ukuthi bonke abantu ababambe iqhaza bangedlulwa bashiywe, bese kutholakale sekukhulunywa nabalaphaya phezulu bezange abantu bathintwe bonke. Lokhu sikubonise ngokuthi sikuveze laphaya ukuthi ikomiti eliklama imingcele esikhundleni sokuthatha isikhathi eside njengezinyanga eziyisithupha, sasibone ukuthi kungakuhle ukuthi isikhathi esingathi siningi kunaso sonke kube izinyanga ezine.
Saphinde futhi sakuveza laphaya ukuthi uNgqongqoshe wezaseKhaya esifundazweni kofanele ukuthi uma ebona kudingekile ukuthi isikhathi sibe sifushane kunalokho, kube nguye othatha isinqumo kodwa ngemuva kokuxhumana noNgqongqoshe wezeziMali kazwelonke.Senzela ukuthi kungabi khona ukushayisana kutholakale ukuthi imali uyinqumile uNgqongqoshe wesifundazwe kanti uNgqongqoshe wezeziMali kazwelonke akazi. Senzela futhi ukuthi kungavele kugxume kuvele kube nguNgqgongqoshe woHulumeni beziFundazwe nezaseKhaya kazwelonke othintana kuphela noNgqongqoshe wezeziMali bese benquma. Sithi-ke bonke laba abathintane uma kukhona uguquko olufanele ukwenziwa kumasipala wasekhaya.
Ngiyadlula lapho ngiza lapha esigabeni se-139 lapho sithola khona ukuthi uNgqongqoshe wohulumeni basekhaya osesifundazweni unamandla okuhlakaza uhulumeni kumasipala. Sithi-ke into ebiba yinkinga lapha, uma ngingakhumbuza iNdlu noSihlalo wami ohloniphekile uShiceka, ukuthi ngesikhathi sivakashele abaQulusi lapha kumasipala wabo, sahlangabezana nenkinga ngesikhathi uhulumeni wasekhaya kamasipala wawusuhlakaziwe uNgqongqoshe. Sathola ukuthi ikomiti yewadi ayazi ukuthi izosebenza kanjani ngoba yayingasenaye usihlalo. Phela isigaba se-139 sithi uma kuhlakazwa umkhandlu, wonke amakhansela abe eseyaphuma bese kufanele kwenziwe ukhetho olusha.
Ngaleso sikhathi kwatholakala ukuthi amakomiti amawadi awasakwazi ukuhlangana ngoba osihlalo bawo abasekho. Yikho-ke sivele nalo mthetho othi koba kuhle ukuthi usihlalo wekomiti lewadi akhethwe yibo labantu abayishumi laba esithi bakhethwe abantu ukuthi babe sekomitini lewadi. Ngakho sithi asibanikeze ilungelo lokuthi bamkhethe usihlalo ukuze noma ungahlakazwa umkhandlu kodwa kwazeke ukuthi kuxhumaneke nabantu futhi kukhulunywe nabo ngenqubekela phambili.
Sithi-ke, njengohulumeni onakekelayo oholwa uKhongolose, okuningi esikwenzile lapha sikwenzele ukuthi abantu bakwazi ukubamba iqhaza uma kuthathwa izinqumo ngabo futhi kungatholakali zikhala emoyeni nje kukhulunywe ngabantu bese kuthathwa izinqumo. Sithi abantu kusukela phansi laphaya abambandakanywe ukuze bakwazi ukuthi uma kukhulunywa ngokuphathwa kwabo nabo babekhona. Baye basho njalo ukuthi ayikho into engathi ngaphandle kwethu.
UKhongolose uyawuxhasa lo Mthethosivivinywa nezichibiyelo ohamba nazo. Ngiyabonga. (Translation of isiZulu paragraphs follows.)
[... let me start by pointing out that when we are talking about local government, we are talking about the most important sphere of government because among all of us here, not even a single one of us is not from a local government, even the President himself comes from a ward. We must therefore always know that there is no one here who can claim to be solely concerned with issues of national interest only when crucial decisions about wards are taken, because we all live in wards.
What I want to highlight to the hon members is that the municipalities' financial years do not coincide with that of the national government. We know that their financial year starts at the beginning of July and ends at the end of June the following year. I mention this because I want us to understand the whole process that when we amended this Bill, we had to know that the affected boundaries would only start working at the beginning of the financial year, so that the funds which were allocated according to the wards or the municipalities could be properly allocated.
What we have tried to do here as a committee is that when the municipal boundaries are affected, none of the stakeholders should be left out. We don't have to find ourselves engaging with the top officials whilst we did not consult with people on the ground. We have highlighted this by pointing out to the Demarcation Board that instead of taking a longer time, like six months, it should take the maximum of four months.
We have also pointed out that the relevant provincial minister of local government should be the one who decides on the timeframe if he feels that the time allocated should be shorter than that, but this should only happen after consultation with the national Minister of Finance. Such consultation would avoid confusion whereby the relevant provincial minister allocates funds only to find that the Minister of Finance knows nothing about that.
We also want to avoid the bypassing of protocol whereby the national Minister of Provincial and Local Government would only consult the Minister of Finance and then take final decisions, without the involvement of other relevant stakeholders. We are therefore saying all the above-mentioned people should consult one another when there are changes that need to be done in municipalities.
The other important point here is section 139 which states that the provincial minister of local government has the power to dissolve the local council. What we are saying, therefore, is that the problem here was that - if I can just remind the House and my hon chairperson, Mr Shiceka - when we visited the AbaQulusi Municipality, we found that there was no local council, hence the MEC had dissolved it. We discovered that the ward committee did not know how it would operate because it did not have a chairperson anymore. As we all know, section 139 states that when the municipal council is dissolved, all the councillors forfeit their positions and then a new election is held.
At that time we found that the ward committees could not hold meetings anymore because their chairpersons were no longer in office. That is why we came up with the rule which states that the chairperson of the ward committee should be elected by the same 10 people who are said to have been elected by the people to be in the ward committee. We are therefore saying that, let us give them the right to elect the chairperson so that, even if the council is dissolved, at least it would still be possible for them to meet with people and talk to them about development.
We are therefore saying, as the ANC-led and a caring government, everything we have done here is for the people. And they need to play a role when decisions affecting them are taken. Things should not be simply said into the air. And the people must be involved when decisions about them are taken. We are saying people from the grassroots level should be involved when decisions about their governance are taken. As they always say, "nothing about us, without us".]
The ANC supports this Bill with amendments. Thank you.
Chairperson, hon Deputy Minister, hon members, it is commendable to see that the Department of Trade and Industry has been mandated to contribute to the regional economic development. It is also commendable to see that the DTI will increasingly partner with the Department for Provincial and Local Government and other role players in strengthening local economic development initiatives.
Local government is much closer to the people on the ground than any of the three spheres of government. The implementation of policies and the bringing of service delivery to the people is the responsibility of local government. However, the crux of the matter is that we see our people running around dissatisfied in the streets demonstrating their feelings.
We look forward to seeing the lives of our people being uplifted by the sphere of government that is closest to them. Inefficiencies need to be addressed. When complaints reach our offices in relation to alleged corruption by local government officials, we, the people of South Africa, have the right to know the outcomes of those complaints if any disciplinary action was taken. But, most of the time, a deadly silence deafens us.
The Minister of Sport and Recreation asked the question: "Why the suspicion?" He asked the question in Potchefstroom when the NCOP took Parliament to the people. I will answer that question. It is because most of the time people are not informed of the outcomes of investigations, whether they are positive or negative. We see written complaints of nepotism and tenders being taken by councillors, like in Naledi Municipality in the Free State. We need to rectify what needs to be rectified for the sake of our people and our country. This Bill needs to speak, in order to rectify. I thank you, Chairperson.
Chairperson of the House, hon Deputy Minister and hon members, local government is the backbone of the community. Small jobs must be kick-started by municipalities. Yes, municipalities are not sources of job creation, but their image should attract the eyes of individuals and even visitors from far countries.
It is the UCDP's view that priority for jobs in municipalities should be given to people in that particular municipality. Access should be given to constituencies to list their needs in their local vicinity.
Amongst other things, councillors must be aware of their surroundings, for example, knowing the statistics of their wards. They must strive to differentiate between those people who need assistance with grants and those who are healthy enough to be able to work. Administration of funds should be balanced to meet people's needs. The UCDP requests that mayors, municipal managers, officials, councillors, stakeholders and the people at large in the North West should work hand in hand to make a success, in order to stimulate the spirit of interest and to imprint love and pride in the people from the municipality. The UCDP supports the Bill. I thank you, Chairperson.
Chairperson, hon Minister, Deputy Minister, my chairperson, colleagues and comrades ...
Laat ek net 'n bietjie Afrikaans praat. Hierdie komitee van plaaslike regering is 'n dinamiese komitee. Ek is vandag stomgeslaan deur die DA wat so rustig is. Ek wonder of daar iets in die paaseiers was wat hulle soeter gemaak het.
Dit wys dat hulle verstaan. Dit is die teenoorgestelde van die ID en die UCDP. Hulle is nie deel van die komitee nie en hulle was nie deel van die in diepte gesprek in die komitee nie en daar is nie 'n begrip van wat eintlik aangegaan het nie. Ek wil net vir die agb Le Roux s ek dink nie die wetgewing is 'n proses waarmee ons wil begin om, soos hulle s, "'n kick-start" te gee aan die "single Public Service" nie. Ek dink hierdie wetgewing is daarop gemik om die uitdagings, wat ons nou opgetel het in plaaslike regering, aan te spreek, dit te verbeter en reg te maak.
Ons sal gedurig verander, want in die toekoms sal nie een van ons wat hier sit kan s dat ons ondervinding het van wat in die toekoms gaan gebeur nie. Ek het al gehoor manne praat van hulle vorige lewe. Maar daar kan nie teruggegaan word na die verlede toe nie. Ons moet die verlede gebruik om te bepaal hoe ons na die toekoms gaan kyk. So, transformasie en verandering gaan by ons bly solank ons en di wat n ons kom, lewe. Daar is voortdurend verandering en aanpassing en uitdagings wat ons die hoof sal moet bied.
Ons behandel 'n hele paar goed in hierdie wetgewing. Ons kyk na amptenare wat hulle beskikbaar wil stel as raadslede en ons s - en dit is mos nou net menslik - dat wanneer die kandidaat geslaagd is en aangestel word as raadslid, dan moet hy bedank as amptenaar. So nie skep ons werkloosheid, want as hierdie man nie die verkiesing wen nie, sit hy sonder 'n werk as hy te vroeg bedank.
Ons kyk ook na die termyn van munisipale bestuurders. U weet, die ding van munisipale bestuurders en amptenare is ook 'n uitdaging vir ons. Wanneer 'n politieke party 'n raad oorneem en as daar 'n ander burgemeester is - en ons sien dit gebeur - word die munisipale bestuurder ook in die pad gesteek. Ek is bekommerd hieroor, want hier is geld betrokke. Die munisipale bestuurder word nou 'n lywige bedrag geld betaal want sy termyn is mos nog nie om nie. Hy moet nou uitgekoop word, en di manne kry baie geld.
Somtyds lyk dit my of mense aansoek doen, sodat hulle maar weer kan gaan en 'n goeie som geld daaruit kry. Dit is nie 'n gesonde ding nie, want hierdie geld kan vir dienslewering gebruik word.
Saam hiermee is die tendens dat elke verskil of dingetjie in 'n raad nou na 'n hof toe gesleep word. Dit veroorsaak duur hofgedinge en kostes. Dit het finansile implikasies. U weet, in arm rade op die platteland is dit 'n groot verlies wanneer geld aan hofonkostes bestee word. Dit is ook een van die groot probleme in die Wes-Kaap. Die LUR het dit al 'n paar keer vir ons genoem. Ons s in die Wes-Kaap dat ons te doen het met maak-'n-las-rade, want ons het gedurige veranderings as gevolg van koalisievorming. Vandag stem twee partye saam en hulle raak ontslae van die ander party se lede. Dit het tot gevolg dat 'n ander burgermeester en ander munisipale bestuurders aangestel word en dit veroorsaak onstabiliteit. Dis een van die dinge waarna ek dink ons moet begin kyk. Koalisivorming moet ook in 'n mate aangespreek word.
U sal by sommige rade vind dat 'n eenmanpartytjie, wat net uit een lid bestaan, die hele raad swaai in 'n rigting. Dit is nie demokrasie nie, want die man het 'n paar stemme en die meerderheid en die raad moet nou maar geswaai word. Dit is wat ons in Afrikaans noem, die stert swaai nou die kat in die rondte. Ons kan nie dat die stert die kat in die rondte swaai nie. Jy kry rade waar die meerderheidsparty nie regeer nie, want jy kry 'n party wat met klomp ander klein partytjies saamsmelt om die party in die meerderheid te kry. Sulke koalisievorming moet rens aangespreek word.
Ek het 'n maklike taak om laaste te praat, want met die kapasiteit in hierdie komitee en met almal wat al alles ges het, kan ek net vir u s: Minister, ek voel vandag bly dat ek die ondersteuning van die DA het. Ek kan dit amper nie glo nie, maar dit wys dat ons goed saamwerk in die komitee. Ek vra dat ons hierdie wetgewing ondersteun. Daar gaan nog kom, want ons gaan gedurig verander ten gunste van dienslewering aan ons mense. Baie dankie. [Applous.] (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)
[Allow me to speak a bit of Afrikaans. This committee on local government is a dynamic committee. I am totally speechless today that the DA is that quiet. I wonder whether there was something in their Easter eggs that made them sweeter.
It shows that they understand. It is completely the opposite with regard to the ID and UCDP. They are not part of this committee and they were not part of the in-depth discussion that took place in this committee, and there is clearly no understanding as to what actually transpired. I would just like to say to the hon Le Roux, I do not think this legislation is the process with which we want to, as they say, kick-start a single Public Service. I think this legislation is aimed at addressing the challenges that we have encountered at local government, and at improving and rectifying it. We will constantly have to change, because not one of us sitting here can predict what the future has in store. I have heard of people speaking about their previous lives. However, we cannot return to the past. We have to use the past to determine how we are going to view the future. Therefore, transformation and change will be with us for as long as we, and those who come after us, are alive. There will be constant changes and adjustments and challenges that we shall have to overcome.
This legislation addresses a number of issues. We have officials who want to make themselves available as councillors and we are saying that - and of course it is only human - when the candidate has been successful and is then appointed as a councillor, he then has to resign as an official. If not, we are creating unemployment because if this man does not win the election, he will be without employment if he should resign prematurely.
We are also considering the term of office of municipal managers. As you are aware, this issue pertaining to municipal managers and officials is also a challenge to us. When a political party takes control of the council and a different mayor is appointed - and we see this happening - the municipal manager is also given the boot. This is of concern to me as there is money at stake. The municipal manager is then given a huge payout as his term of office has not yet expired. He has to be paid out and these people are highly paid.
Sometimes it seems to me as if people only apply so that they can be relieved of their duties just to gain a tidy sum of money in the process. This is not a healthy state of affairs, as this money can be used for service delivery.
In conjunction with this, there is the tendency lately that every disagreement or issue in a council is now taken to a court. This results in costly lawsuits and incurs costs. It has financial implications. You know it is a huge loss for poorer councils in the rural areas when money is spent on lawsuits. This is also one of the great challenges in the Western Cape. The MEC has mentioned this to us on number of occasions. In the Western Cape we are saying that we are dealing with "maak-'n-las" councils, because we have continual changes as a result of the formation of coalitions. Today, two parties may agree and they will then get rid of the members of the other party. This results in the appointment of a new mayor and other municipal managers which causes instability. That is one of the issues which I think we should start looking at. The formation of coalitions should also be addressed to some extent.
You will find within some councils that a small one-man party, consisting of a single member, can change the direction of the whole council. That is not democracy, because this man has only a few votes and the majority in the council has to change in that direction now. This is what is commonly known in Afrikaans as the tail now wagging the dog. We cannot let the tail wag the dog. You find councils where the majority party is not the ruling party, because you find a party that has formed a coalition with a number of other smaller parties to enable it to obtain the majority. Such coalitions have to be addressed somehow.
I have the easy task of being the last speaker and because of the capacity in this committee and with everybody else having said what needed to be said, I can only say: Minister, I am happy today that I have the support of the DA. I can hardly believe this, but it shows we have a high level of co- operation in the committee. My request is that we support this legislation - and there will be more to follow - as there will be constant change in favour of service delivery to the people. Thank you. [Applause.]]
Chairperson and hon members, I would like to take this opportunity to thank everyone for participating in such a constructive debate. I was most impressed, because this sphere of government is the most important one of all, as it touches the heart of our people. I really want to thank you from the bottom of my heart.
I am not going to say much, but I just want to alleviate the chairperson's concerns regarding consultation processes. I think you raised it very sharply and I think the issues that you have raised about which you are concerned - the role of provinces and the power of provinces, etc - during the review process, are issues that need to be thrashed out very strongly and vigorously, as you did earlier on with the officials in the select committee. I think we must be alert that those issues will be dealt with, and I wish to thank you also for raising a number of very strong issues.
The second thing I also want to alleviate is the concern of the hon Le Roux regarding the working relationship between the Department of Provincial and Local Government and Minister Geraldine Fraser-Moleketi's department. You see, it is important, hon member, that as government we talk to one another. We shouldn't work above each other. We need an intergovernmental relationship. It is for consultation. If there is an area that affects a particular department, let's consult, let's talk to one another so that we can best bring about results to the advantage of our people. I think it is just consultation and working together and it is necessary for us to do so, and these two Ministries should work together.
There is another concern that worried me about the hon Le Roux. Perhaps that is my concern at the moment. Maybe when we deal with the process, we will be able to work out these concerns much better. My concern is with an official who is helped to become a candidate, but who is employed by the municipality. Now, the suggestion is that he should not resign until he is appointed or has won whatever position he is standing for. The concern is the resources of government, because then it would be unfair to another person who is, perhaps, unemployed, who is also a candidate and who doesn't have access to those resources. Then he has full access to these resources. It is a bit unfair, but we can still debate it. That is the concern at the back of my mind.
Hon Ntuli, I fully agree with you, sir, that this is something that has been raised a number of times, namely the issue of these different financial years. The financial years of local government and national are not the same; local government's is much later and they also complain about fiscal dumping. When it is the end of the financial year, a particular department will simply throw in the money and say that we have given you a lot of money, so what have you done with the money? We regard that as fiscal dumping. So, I agree with you, and maybe it is something that we should actually look into and also review during the review process.
To the hon member from the ID, you know, sometimes it is very easy for people to throw accusations around. I always say to people - when they say that the councillors are corrupt, the mayors are corrupt, there is a lot of nepotism taking place, and also in terms of tendering processes - go to the police station. The easiest thing is to go to the nearest police station and report those cases. Don't make wild allegations here. Go to the nearest police station. You are a politician. Go to the nearest police station and say: So-and-so has done this. Thank you. [Applause.]
Debate concluded.
Thank you, hon Deputy Minister. Order, hon members!
I shall now put the question. The question is that the Bill, subject to the proposed amendments, be agreed to.
In accordance with Rule 63, I shall first allow political parties the opportunity to make their declarations of vote if they so wish. Is there any party that wants to make a declaration? No? In the absence of any declarations, we will proceed. We shall now proceed to the voting on the question. Those in favour will say "Aye". Those against will say "No".
HON MEMBERS: Aye!
I think the "Ayes" have it. The majority of members voted in favour. I therefore declare the Bill, subject to the proposed amendments, agreed to.
Bill, subject to proposed amendments, agreed to in accordance with section 75 of the Constitution.