Deputy Speaker, we are currently finalising an assessment of protest marches as part of profiling the municipality in terms of the local government turnaround strategy implementation - in this regard responding to the factor of accelerating service delivery. We will accordingly produce a report by the end of November.
Guided by the trend analysis and through our own experiences as we engage with protesting communities, we have found that most of the grievances that the people raised on average relate to the following areas: electricity- related questions such as allegations of high tariffs; the long waiting time for access to and the use of electricity consumption in some areas; sanctions on this as a default mechanism for cost recovery; water supply shortcomings; housing delivery questions relating to long waiting time or allocation; administration anomalies; unfinished projects; quality leadership of municipalities; and in some instances, questionable responsiveness. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Acting Speaker, thank you, hon Minister, for your response. We acknowledge that your department is busy with the assessment. We request that this report be submitted to the portfolio committee early in January. While this report is being processed, what measures is your department putting in place to avoid further occurrences? I thank you. [Applause.]
Acting Speaker, thank you very much. Certainly we will provide the report to the portfolio committee. And then, on the issue of what we are doing at the moment, I want to indicate that on a case-by-case basis in areas where we deal with questions of protest, we respond according to the issues indicated. And, of course, on a day-to-day basis in terms of our routine functions we are working together with all sector departments in the areas where questions that are raised have to be addressed. So, that is what we continue to do on a day-to-day basis. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Madam Acting Deputy Speaker, thank you, Minister, for your answer. Many of these frustrations, which you have identified as a root cause of service delivery protests, seem to come down to basic municipal infrastructure service delivery. So, surely, it must be a major concern to you, Minister. The declining rate of municipal infrastructure grant spending over the last four financial years has seen municipalities with some of the most deprived and poverty stricken communities, with the least household access to basic services, sending hundreds of millions of rand back to central government on an annual basis. And so, I would like to ask from you today in the House: What measures are you going to put in place, apart from the workshops and meetings which you referred to in the annual report, to address this to ensure that municipalities are spending this money and that communities are getting this infrastructure laid on there, giving access to the basic services which have been promised for the last 14 years? [Applause.]
We decided to have a dedicated approach profiling each municipality so that when we respond to the challenge in a particular municipality, we do not do that in a generalised manner, since there is no one-size-fits-all intervention to deal with issues related to challenges in a municipality. We continue to do that so that, as the hon member has indicated, in the area of spending, we focus on each municipality, provide dedicated interventions, mindful of the fact, of course, that in terms of section 154 of the Constitution, we deal with these matters jointly with provincial departments. So yes, it is true. Issues that are being raised by communities are issues that are of concern, which is why we have decided to have a dedicated focus to then say, let us deal with these five priority issues. If we do so, we will find a way whereby the community will have confidence and derive some satisfaction out of the activities. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Acting Speaker, Minister, I am not very sure that your investigations will serve much purpose. This is because three years ago, when this country was convulsed in service delivery protests, the President sent Ministers out all over the place, Parliament set up an ad hoc committee, which sent us all over the place. I went to the North West and the situation was dire, but since then it got worse.
If you look at the number of municipalities under administration - the SIU investigating corruption, non-submission of financial statements and all these indicators - things have gone downhill despite the investigations at the time. This is despite your turnaround strategy, which is delivering nothing in the North West. So my question would be whether, certainly in respect of the North West, your investigations are a waste of time. Your government's ability to address the matter suggests you are incompetent in doing so and that you do not have a solution to what is going on in that province. Thank you.
Deputy Speaker, the hon member says he is not convinced that the investigation will lead us to a situation where we address the problems. I am convinced, and the hon member, as a member of the portfolio committee, will understand, that we deal with issues for what they are and not in a generalised fashion, as I have indicated.
In the case of the North West, there are quite a number of areas which we are embarking upon. I understand that some of the issues might not have the hon member convinced. However, let me state that when you conduct an investigation you should not generalise; you become focused and, chances are, you will be responding accordingly. If you embark on a generalised investigation you will have serious problems.
On the issue of the North West, we will present a report to the portfolio committee or through the portfolio committee that discusses how we will deal with those issues. These assessments are part of the work that will deal with those issues for what they are, point by point. Thank you very much.
Deputy Speaker, independent scientific research is always the best, and no government can address the needs of the people without that. However, the statistics maintained by the SAPS indicate that, since 2009 and 2010, crowd unrest incidents have increased from 718 in those years to well over 1000 incidents per year since then.
The mood of citizens has therefore changed from patience to dissatisfaction, as shown by posters carried by protesters displayed by the SA Broadcasting Corporation, SABC, and other media. It has become clear that South Africans have become impatient with the following: The ANC government's lip service to rooting out corruption in all spheres of government, but in particular in local municipalities; shoddy work done by service providers from road construction to housing construction; obscene salaries paid to municipal managers and officials who treat people with disdain; and jobs for pals and contracts for the politically connected. Thank you.
Acting Speaker, hon member, we use lessons learnt from independent research and our own investigations, and we don't undermine any findings that have to do with issues of local government. That is why we are saying we combine all sources of information that would deal with these issues. However, we don't only read about how people feel; we have to engage the people so that we come to understand exactly what those issues are. That is why I indicated that we are dealing with this investigation. Thank you very much.
Clarity regarding roles of PSETA and Palama
282. Mrs J C Moloi-Moropa (ANC) asked the Minister for the Public Service and Administration:
(1) Whether the conflict in the roles of Public Service Sector Education and Training Authority (PSETA) and the Public Administration Leadership and Management Academy (Palama) has been cleared; if not, why not; if so, what are the relevant details;
(2) what will happen to the 1% levy that her department is expected to pay towards PSETA? NO3359E
Acting Speaker, hon Moloi-Moropa, the question you asked is a question that has been on my mind for a very long time. I have been trying to track down the Minister of Higher Education and Training in order for us to solve this matter amicably. I have not found him in any of the places that I frequent. [Laughter.] [Interjections.]
Acting Speaker, please protect me, because I want to suggest to the Minister of Higher Education and Training that the Public Service Education and Training Authority, PSETA, resorts under public administration. I did not know how it came to be under his mantle until I did some research for this particular question and I discovered that, while most God-fearing people were in church, one Sunday in November 2009 the Minister of Higher Education and Training issued a statement and said, "from Sunday 1 November 2009, the Department of Higher Education and Training assumes responsibility over skills development and training in government". He said this on a Sunday. [Laughter.]
Most people came back from church to discover that the skills training sector belonged to the Minister of Higher Education and Training. I am in consultation with him and, in the meantime, Chairperson of the Portfolio Committee on Public Service and Administration, we are making do with what we have.
We have established very collegial relations between PSETA and the Public Administration Leadership and Management Academy, Palama, to see that we can work together and get ourselves out of this situation. And we have moved away from the original concept of Palama providing programmes to the public sector. We are now establishing Palama as a national training college for public service.
I know that this is a matter that hon Marais is also very concerned about, because he asked a similar question. I therefore have resolved that I will provide the portfolio committee with the full detail of where we are in relation to this restructuring of Palama.
In relation to the 1% levy that you are asking which is expected from PSETA, I have crafted a Cabinet memo which will be submitted very soon to ensure that all government departments provide us with the 1% that is required so that we can ensure that Palama has the necessary resources. Thank you.
Acting Speaker, thank you for the response, hon Minister. While there will be negotiations to return the PSETA that was taken on a Sunday, we would like to find out from the Minister if the same Palama has been promising to embark on a Palama indaba, where they will be co-ordinating various stakeholders to engage and discuss how to co-ordinate the skills development in the country. It has taken a bit of time, but with your explanation that we are now moving to the school of government, possibly that is coming together. We would like to know, as this House, what plans have been put in place to move towards that school of government; how ready are we to move along this school of government and possibly also take on board the Palama indaba that should take place as promised? Thank you.
As of October this year, Palama began to restructure itself, first by providing a compulsory training course for all public servants. In October 2013, we expect that the school of government will be fully functional. As we speak, Palama is in the process of ensuring that that does take place. We have also invited Members of Parliament to come for some training at the school of government. Perhaps the first month of the operation of the school of government will be dedicated to Members of Parliament, just to test the efficacy of the school of government. We think that we will be on course and will be operational by October next year. Thank you.
Acting Speaker, Minister, thank you very much for your answer. Minister, can you tell us, in terms of both Palama and PSETA, what are the benchmarks, criteria or standards for training and building the capacity of public servants, and whether these two institutions have proper curriculums and a syllabus developed for training the ideal public servants? Thank you.
Acting Speaker, I just got a note which says that I am not pronouncing the school properly, it is not Phalama but Palama. I think the note probably came from the Deputy President. [Laughter.]
Acting Speaker, some of the responsibilities of Palama are to ensure: that the sector skills plan is in place; that the learning programmes are worked out; that workplace skills, plans and allocating grants are provided; that education and skills development programmes are monitored; and that learning programmes are providing for themselves.
We have been able to do this in conjunction with Palama because, as you know, Palama's responsibility was that of a service provider, outsourcing the work that would otherwise be done by the school of government to the various institutions of higher learning. What we are doing now is to restructure that and use PSETA as a conduit to ensure the accreditation of all those courses that we are currently working on to ensure that they are accredited with the SA Qualifications Authority, SAQA.
As we are in this transitional phase it will be very difficult to answer your question specifically, except that we are working with them to ensure that their role is now that of making sure that our qualifications standards are acceptable and accredited. Thank you.
Minister, a lot of what I was going to ask has been answered. I was going to ask if you are confident that human resource development in the public sector is functioning effectively; and if not, what challenges remain? But you have made it clear that the Minister of Higher Education and Training is, in fact, your challenge. What, in your opinion, still needs to be done to ensure that the two entities function optimally?
I will have a meeting with the Minister of Higher Education and Training and perhaps invite the hon member to that particular meeting. I think that I have dealt with this matter; we are not meeting the target. One of the first things that we did, which I reported to the portfolio committee as a development in our negotiations with unions, was an acceptance by unions that it is absolutely important for everybody who is in the Public Service to undergo compulsory training programmes. We realised that we were falling short of our own requirements and we were not meeting the standards that we have set ourselves. Hon Acting Speaker, I think the question that the hon member is asking has been covered. Thank you.
Acting Speaker, madam Minister, I trust that you will find the hon Minister of Higher Education and Training soon, otherwise there will have to be a price tag on his head or we will have to use a lost and found column. From your wide experience in government and from the places you frequent, is there a notion that communists believe that they can take the law into their own hands? Because the responsibility that you cite, Madam Minister, should, by decree, be that of the President of this country. He assigns responsibilities, and maybe we need to remind the communists that we are living in a constitutional democracy. I just want to know what your comments are with regard to that, Madam Minister. Thank you. [Interjections.]
That's below the belt. [Laughter.] That is a comment way below the level I operate at. [Laughter.] Hon Singh, the shift of the responsibility for the Setas to the Department of Higher Education and Training came about from the restructuring of the education department and the split between basic education and higher education.
Now, I did not understand how this PSETA, which is responsible for the public service and training programmes of the Public Service, could have fallen under this department. But I woke up too late to do anything about it. I am quite convinced that the necessary steps were taken, that the necessary law made provision for this, and that this was a proclamation from the President. What alarmed me is that it happened when most people, like you and I, were in church. Thank you.
Steps to prevent and remedy departmental overexpenditure
299. Mrs H Lamoela (DA) asked the Minister of Women, Children and People with Disabilities:
(1) Whether, with reference to her department's overexpenditure of R23 million in the 2011-12 financial year, any steps have been taken to prevent such (a) overexpenditure in line with section 39(2)(a) of the Public Finance Management Act, Act 1 of 1999, as well as (b) unauthorised expenditure; if not, what is the position in this regard; if so, what are the relevant details;
(2) what remedial measures were imposed by National Treasury in terms of section 39(2)(c) of the Act to prevent this overexpenditure;
(3) whether her department has complied with these remedial measures; if not, why not; if so, what are the relevant details?