Yesterday, I made a ruling using Chapter 2(9)(3) of our Constitution, that at no stage shall this House, the National Council of Provinces, discriminate against anyone on the basis of practices of people, or religious or cultural belief, after a point of order made by the hon Mtileni. I can see, today, that the hon Mtileni is still trying to challenge that ruling by what he is doing. I appeal to him to do what is right.
Yesterday, a member wore a hat in mourning, for your information. The Constitution is very clear in Chapter 2(9)(3). So, the hat that you are wearing is not part of what is contained in Chapter 2 of the Constitution. Therefore, do what is right. Respect the House, hon Mtileni. I'm not recognising you to speak. I'm requesting you to take off your hat. [Interjections.] Come again?
I'm challenging you on that one. You see ...
Hon Mtileni, can you please respect the House and take off the hat?
We are in a part of this country where a male person is allowed to put on a hat. That is why, today, I'm challenging you.
Let me read it for you.
You can read it.
Take your seat so that I can read it for you. Chapter 2 of our Constitution, hon Mtileni, states "the state may not unfairly discriminate directly or indirectly against anyone on one or more grounds, including race, gender, sex, pregnancy, marital status, ethnic or social origin, colour, sexual orientation, age, disability, religion, conscience, belief, culture, language and birth".
Yesterday when you raised the point of order, you challenged somebody who was wearing a hat, mourning the death of a family member. Today, you are still trying to prove a point. I'm appealing to you now to take off that hat, in respect. I've already read it for you.
Chairperson ...
I'm not recognising you to speak, Mtileni. I'm not engaged in a debate with you. Can you take it off?
It's a ruling!
Mtileni, it's a ruling. [Interjections.] No. Order! Mtileni, it's a ruling.
But Chairperson ...
You are not recognised.
This was what you were supposed to have indicated, but still I know that ...
I've already indicated.
... still I know that... [Inaudible.]
Mtileni, you are not recognised.
... because you were supposed to have asked him too. You know, it is un-African for an hon member of this House to wear a hat.
Oh, do you know that? Can you take it off?
That's why I'm challenging you ...
Can you take it off?
There are many ways to mourn a person without having to wear a hat in the House ... a House like this one.
Can you take it off? Can you take your seat and take your hat off? Thank you.
Chairperson, perhaps the hon Mtileni falls under "pregnancy" - we don't know. [Laughter.]
My greetings go to the hon Minister, the Deputy Minister, hon members and special delegates in the House. On 25 May every year, we mark unity in Africa. This year, it is 52 years since the founding of the Organisation of African Unity, which was the predecessor to the African Union. It is sad to note that during this important month, where we identified ourselves as a society in Africa, we have experienced issues of xenophobic attacks on foreign nationals. I must say that those people are husbands of some of us. Some are wives and others are children.
It might be that we do not know our origins. You just find yourselves in a certain place in South Africa, and not knowing your origins, you attack yourselves. In Zimbabwe, for example, we have kaMzilikazi, which relates directly to KwaZulu-Natal. There is a full village in Zambia where there are people who went into exile and did not come back to South Africa. Do we have to attack them when they come back home? It is regrettable.
Those activities or actions that were done by those people were criminal. It is not because, as South Africans, we are xenophobic. We want to condemn this in the strongest terms, and express appreciation for the work done by this department in collaboration with other departments.
Home Affairs is both a security and a service delivery department. The two are interdependent. Without a secure national population register, our birth certificates and identity documents would lose all their value. No other country would accept our passports.
Every person living in South Africa would be at risk if there were no effective controls at ports of entry or enforcement of immigration law. Just as seriously, we would not attract or retain foreign nationals with the critical skills needed to expand our economy and few tourists would visit our country. Therefore, it is very important that we have something that we identify ourselves with, as South Africans.
We appreciate the excellent work done by the Minister and the Deputy Minister, together with the team in that department. I will focus more on some of the achievements that this department has registered. Excellent work cannot be achieved without being ethical, patriotic and professional. These are the qualities that we have witnessed from this department from the beginning of the Fifth Parliament, when we started engaging with it. Minister, we want to thank you very much for the good work that you are doing in the department. It is noticed by the committee.
I would like to commend the department for the programme aimed at creating an efficient, paperless environment. This began with equipping offices to issue ID smart cards and passports using new processes. This is, indeed, part of building a comprehensive national identity system that uses biometrics to secure the identity of all who live in South Africa, regardless of whether one is a South African or a foreign national. This department touches all of us, whether you are already in the country or are one of those who are entering the country illegally. This will improve all our lives, and it depends on all citizens working together with the department to defend our identities and citizenships.
This corruption that is taking place is not only amongst our officials. Those citizens within the country who are agreeing to perform corrupt deeds are equally guilty. In this regard ...
... ngitsandza kugcugcutela bantfu bakitsi kutsi abaciniseke kutsi nabayotfolwa umntfwana esibhedlela, bambhalise kungakapheli emalanga lange- 30 atelwe. Kunetibhedlela letinemahhovisi eLitiko Letasekhaya. Ababhalise bantfwana bangakayi emakhaya.
Loku kwenta kutsi kube lula kutsi nasekabuyile ekhaya angasabi nesidzingo sekuya kulamahhovisi eLitiko Letasekhaya. Loku futsi kwenta kube lula kutsi lelitiko lati kutsi libabhalisile basesesibhedlela ngembi kwekutsi baye emakhaya. (Translation of Siswati paragraphs follows.)
[... I would like to encourage our people, when they go to hospital to give birth, to make sure that they register their newborns within 30 days of birth. There are hospitals that have Department of Home Affairs offices on their premises. Let babies be registered before they go home.
This makes it easier for the mother when she arrives home. She does not need to go to Home Affairs offices. This makes it easier for the department, as well, knowing that it has already registered them while they were still in hospital, before they could be discharged.]
We are encouraging parents to register the birth of their children within 30 days.
I would like to commend the department on the following achievements between 2009 and 2014. Firstly, in dealing with late birth registration, the department introduced the National Population Registration campaign. This mobilised officials and communities to record over 1 million invisible citizens and reduce late birth registration. I must say that this has been a challenge for the country because that is where most corrupt activities were taking place - people would come and say it is a late registration. We commend the department, as it has come up with a programme on that one.
Secondly, the department had amended civic and immigration legislation. As a result, the department had addressed security gaps and improved service delivery, including among the vulnerable groups. We have witnessed that the security of birth certificates has been improved. It is unlike before, where one could just forge them. These are the matters of security the Minister was referring to. For example, the Department of Home Affairs is now asking for both parents' details when registering a child. The front office that has been in the pipeline for sometime is now available for the first time to print the full birth certificate.
Hon Minister, I just want to indicate that with the new ID smart cards, we know that there is a grace period for the elderly, who can still collect theirs later at no fee. However, there are some challenges in terms of distances, because we do not have offices in all the areas. Perhaps we could have a mobile unit per province with all the required equipment.
There is a case at hand, the issue of Spoegrivier, in Northern Cape. These Afrikaans words are very difficult for me to pronounce! The majority of citizens there are elderly people who are not able to travel to Springbok to collect their ID documents. It's not only in that area. It's happening in all provinces. Therefore, we are requesting that we consider that every province should have a mobile unit with all the facilities required to issue the ID smart cards.
Thirdly, with regard to our immigration services, a centralised adjudication hub was established for permits and visas. This reduced fraud and corruption, enabling gains in efficiency.
Lastly, the stakeholder forum, chaired by the Speakers or mayors at local level, is really assisting, because now, the department is involving all the relevant stakeholders.
We have witnessed a major information technology breakthrough in the design and development of the new systems within the department, including the roll out of the ID smart cards. The refurbishment programme continued and included transforming 70 paperless offices to new, fully digital processing for identity documents. That is why the hon Minister was saying that you can pay on your system and make an appointment. You only go there to have photographs taken and finger prints done. It is very progressive, and we really appreciate that.
In terms of enhancing our immigration affairs, we note that the department is aiming to introduce two Bills: the Refugees Amendment Bill and the Border Management Agency Bill. We really appreciate that because the management of our borders has been a big challenge for a while. This is largely due to the fact that the Immigration Affairs programme objective is still underfunded. We would like more resources to be allocated to the department, so that it is able to perform all the objectives, as expected. As I said earlier, we all depend on those departments. If you look at it from a distance, it does not look like a very important department, but at the end of the day, it is the most important department.
We are not here to only identify the positives, but also to identify some challenges facing the department. To highlight a few, "unfavourable audit opinion" is not in our vocabulary in the committee. We only want to speak "clean audit". The administration should pull up their socks to make sure that we get a clean audit. We acknowledge that we have a number of offices that are not in the country. That is contributing towards the outcomes of the Auditor-General because you cannot account for some of the issues. That we acknowledge. At the very least, let's settle for an unqualified audit opinion.
We still hear stories of some department officials who collude with criminal syndicates to steal identity and even citizenship. We therefore need robust and visible action to be taken in order to combat fraud and corruption.
There is still a highly uneven quality of infrastructure in terms of our offices. Hon Minister, I know the department was talking about branding our offices, last year. We would want to see a Home Affairs office identity so that when I arrive there, I don't have to read whether it is Home Affairs, or not. They must be branded so that they are clearly visible.
As a committee, we are therefore satisfied that, after engaging with the department, it is aligned to the National Development Plan, NDP, all strategic documents of government and, especially, the manifesto of the ruling party.
We therefore support the Budget Vote of the department. Thank you.
Hon Chairperson, hon Minister and Deputy Minister, the House and guests in the gallery, I greet you again in the name of freedom, fairness and opportunities, as prescribed by the Values Charter of the DA.
Recently, we witnessed the violent attacks that claimed the lives of foreigners here in South Africa. When this tragedy reoccurred, it should have become clearer that the ANC-led government has failed to control the influx of illegal foreigners, failed to educate South Africa about the role foreigners played during our struggle, and failed to protect the human rights of foreign nationals. Indeed, this is a testimony on how you are failing millions of South Africans, every single day.
We know South Africa is a better place to live in than it was before 1994. As leaders of our society, we need to question our weaknesses and failures, but not in a manner that serves to score political points over one other.
The failures of the Department of Home Affairs have weakened our freedom. The recent violent attacks against foreign nationals in our country are living testimony to this. We, as the DA, condemn this in every possible sense. Violent attacks on any person, be it a legal or illegal immigrant, are unacceptable. No good comes from violent behaviour. This serves only to advance the interests of hooligans and gangsters.
The Minister has failed to invest in border security and in resourcing the inspectorate. Minister, you don't need crime intelligence to give you the reasons for the violence long after the violence starts. We have one crisis after the next in immigration. Yet, you see fit to invest only 15% of the budget in Immigration Affairs. This department has been under-resourced for many years and the poor results are starting to show.
Hon Minister, 333 000 people have overstayed their visas, since 2010. Where are these people and why has your department not traced them? Why could they not be repatriated? Not even your own department can put a figure to it. How are you taking responsibility in your own department? This is a complete failure on your part.
Minister, tell South Africans that the Lindela Repatriation Centre is overcrowded, with appalling living conditions. It is about time you admitted you are struggling to manage the numbers. Your department has a notorious track record when it comes to human rights violations and noncompliance with the Immigration Act. That is why the High Court has ruled against your department many times, costing the taxpayer millions of rand in legal fees. That is not contained in your speech. You skipped it!
Tell South Africans the truth. They need to know and they have the right to know. Like many of your ANC peers in the other departments who have wasted the money of our people, you could have used the money to tackle our biggest issue and the biggest problem of South Africa, which is to employ more youth and create job opportunities.
The Minister omits the fact that, recently, the Constitutional Court ruled that a prisoner held in custody must not be deported to face the death penalty in Botswana. The Department of Home Affairs ignored that order and deported him anyway. Why? What consequences are there for those involved in this violation of the court ruling and the human rights of the individual concerned? To date, your Department of Home Affairs has remained silent. When are you going to take responsibility for your own department?
The recent, newly introduced immigration regulations are still having a negative impact on our tourism industry. When coupled with the negative image that the recent xenophobic violence has had on our country, the tourism industry is heading for some very turbulent times ahead. Our future is in jeopardy, in this regard.
Our country is hugely dependent on the billions of rand that are being generated in the tourism sector. Thousands of jobs are now at stake. What, then, is your department's plan, Minister, to undo the damage and make South Africa an easier destination to visit? We need this capital. The DA has written to the Tourism Complaints Officer, Mirriam Setwaba, to investigate and address this department and its draconian visa regulations that will come in into effect on 1 June 2015.
Sorry, hon Mpambo-Sibhukwana. Hon Ntlake?
Chairperson, I rise on a point of order: I think the speaker is out of order.
It has gone from 3,24 to 2, ...
Hon Mpambo-Sibhukwana, no.
I am concerned about the time.
Why are you rising?
I am concerned about time. This is my time. [Interjections.]
She is misleading the public with these allegations that she is making.
That is not a point of order. Hon Tlake, please take your seat. Hon Mpambo-Sibuhukwana, continue.
The Department of Home Affairs plays a central role in protecting the rights and freedom of all citizens. However, this cannot be done with the declining revenue allocations to this department. With the little money that is made available to run such a massive department, it is critical that the Minister take steps to reduce the wasted expenditure on legal fees.
The DA will not sit back and watch the ANC destroying every state institution as it pleases. Our freedom and democracy belong to all of us and we, as democrats, will continue to fight to protect them.
Hon Mpambo-Sibhukwana, I am sorry. Yes, hon Dikgale?
Chairperson, I rise on a point of order: Rule 33 states that no member may interrupt another member who is addressing the Chair, except to call attention to a point of order or a question of privilege. Then, Rule 30(a) states that we have freedom of speech in the Council. So, the hon member rose on a point of order and the hon member who is at the podium did not allow her to raise whatever she wanted to raise. She kept on interrupting. I think this is out of order. I am asking you to rule on that, Chair. [Interjections.]
Order, members, order! The point of order is sustained. If there is a speaker on the floor and you can't ...
[Inaudible.]
You know, hon Mpambo-Sibhukwana, never, ever repeat that. It was totally out of order.
Thank you, Chair.
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi) Can you take your seat, hon Mpambo- Sibhukwana? Hon Labuschagne? Alright, you are recognised.
Chair, according to the Rule that the hon Dikgale used, she ruled you, as the Chair, out of order for not ruling on the point of order of the hon member who stood up. Is that parliamentary? Thank you.
No, that is not a point of order. Order, members! The hon Tlake was not raising a point of order. That is why it was not sustained. The hon Digkale has raised a point of order and I sustained it. That is why I made a ruling. So, continue, hon Mpambo- Sibhukwana.
Hon Chairperson, the DA is keeping a close eye on this department before we take it over and fix what you have broken.
As they say in Afrikaans, "Beloftes maak skuld." Ons sal ons beloftes nakom. [Promises create debt. We shall keep our promises.] We promise you - and this is a promise, not a threat.
I just want to say that not all citizens have access to the Internet Wi-Fi system, as you do. Those who are fortunate to have this will get every help from your department, but not every citizen at grassroots level does. Freedom, fairness and opportunity are more than just the DA's Values Charter. It is what South Africa is ready for as we head into the 2016 election.
Kuhlwile ngoku mawethu. Asinakho ukufihla amakhuba kulinywa. Masingaqhwayeli emva okweenkukhu. Inkululeko namathuba ngokulinganayo kuMzantsi Afrika uphela. Ndifuna ukunixelela ukuba isizwe sethu ngoku sithungulule. Isukile la nwebu ibikhona yathungulula. Ithungulule nje uza kubona ngezenzo. Ayisekho imibundlwana kungoku nje; unendlebe nje unetyala.
Mawethu, ndifuna ukunixelela ke ukuba kuhlwile kwaye kuhlwile nje kuza kuthi qheke ukusa kube mhlophe okwekhephu. Siza kudibana singoyikani nje. Into esinganayo yidyudyu. Ingevane nengcangcazela yeyona nto ingekhoyo. Apho siya kudibana khona kuphaya kwizikhululo zovoto. [Kwaqhwatywa.] (Translation of isiXhosa paragraphs follows.)
[Colleagues, we do not have much time. We cannot pretend that what is there is not there. Freedom and opportunities must be enjoyed equally by all South Africans. I want to tell you that our people out there can now see the difference. They are aware of the world around them. You see the end results because of this awareness. Everybody understands what is going on. You snooze, you lose.
Colleagues, I want to tell you that time is against us and things will only get much better. We will meet on the battlefield. We are not cowards. We will meet at the voting stations. [Applause.]]
Hon House Chair, hon Minister, Deputy Minister, hon Acting Chief Whip of the NCOP, hon Members of the NCOP, special delegates, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen, I think we are running a very serious risk in this House. It seems as if some hon members have two personalities. I am saying that precisely because it appears that, in our committees where we engage the departments, certain hon members have particular personalities. However, when they come to the House they have different personalities which we do not know. For example, what happened just a few weeks ago when we met? We had an engagement with the department and the same hon member on my left, who has just left the podium, praised the department and welcomed the budget. Yet now, all of a sudden here today ... [Interjections.]
Hon Chair, we determined yesterday that the hon Stock doesn't know his left from his right. So, can we please stop with that? [Laughter.]
That is not a point of order. Continue, hon Stock.
We keep making the point that it is important for us to stick to principles. It is very important, even if it is difficult for you to come here wanting to score cheap political points because you are obsessed with the ANC-led government. There is nothing wrong with your coming here and appreciating all the good things that were done by the ANC-led government, and acknowledging and highlighting some of the challenges. There is no problem with that. We are very clear in terms of that. We are moving South Africa forward. We are not apologetic and we are not going to be pulled back by some of these sound bites that come from the left-hand side.
We recently witnessed some of the violent attacks on some of our brothers and sisters from other countries. We, as South Africans, should be clear. No grievance justifies violence against any person, regardless of their nationality or immigration status. We are very clear that we are one, and we are one Africa. We have been struggling with late birth registrations which, in turn, contribute to the backlogs experienced by the Department of Social Development in registering children for social assistance. On that note, I am pleased to hear the announcement made by the department that they are taking steps to end the late registration of births as a widespread practice, as of 31 December 2015, for example. This is thanks to the progress that we have made in the National Population Registration campaign and the ongoing risks associated with the late registration of births. From 1 January 2016, the registration of all births after 30 days will have to undergo a rigorous process to prove that the child really is a South African citizen.
In terms of enhancing our immigration affairs, we note that the department envisages introducing two Bills. The Minister has already alluded to the Refugees Amendment Bill of 2015 and the Border Management Agency Bill. The former would address the processes and procedures relating to, amongst others, the adjudication, review and appeal processes pertaining to asylum seekers and refugees.
On the issue of the Border Management Agency Bill, the Department of Home Affairs should engage with stakeholders. They have already started to initiate that process in order for us to ensure that all concerned and interested persons make their input. We hear that the Department of Defence is also part of this initiative, as the role of the Department of Defence is to protect the integrity of our country, including controlling our borderline. However, it is the responsibility of the Department of Home Affairs to ensure that the movement of people in and out of the country is well managed. In that context and in line with the Border Management Agency, we should also ensure that the borders are, for example, fenced, so that people use the ports of entry in a very structured and controlled way.
In conclusion, there are a few issues which I want to highlight for the hon Minister and Deputy Minister, as well as the department. The following issues are actually to be considered by the department in the next financial year. We also take this opportunity to welcome some of the initiatives initiated by the ANC-led government in response to the 2008 attacks and recent attacks on foreign nationals.
Firstly, the Counter-Xenophobia Unit of the Department of Home Affairs conducted assessments to determine the causes of xenophobia-related violence and to develop intervention strategies. It participated in SABC2 and SABC3 television programmes to gauge the public's view in order to raise awareness about xenophobia.
Secondly, the development of an early warning system by a visible policing forum is needed.
Thirdly, regarding the National Joint Operational and Intelligence Structure and the Provincial Joint Operational and Intelligence Structure, several recommendations have been made about the need for a co-ordinated and integrated approach to respond, inter alia, and particularly with regard to violence against foreign nationals.
Fourthly, an immigration stakeholder forum, comprising national, provincial and local government departments, was launched in Pretoria on 13 April 2015.
Fifthly, the Department of Home Affairs is also a standing member of the UN High Commissioner for Refugees, UNHCR, Protection Working Group, that was established after the 2008 xenophobic attacks.
Sixthly, the Department of Home Affairs also took the initiative to report to Parliament on stakeholder engagements on integration, in May 2015. It had partnered with the City of Tshwane and hosted 12 workshops with the metro police between January and March 2015 on the rights and responsibilities of asylum seekers and refugees.
Finally, in its presentation on regional migration trends and regional integration, the Department of Home Affairs indicated that various policies and initiatives have been undertaken in respect of migration.
We also support this Budget Vote because, in terms of the allocation of the budgeted amount of the department, we think it will actually make a positive contribution towards taking South Africa forward.
Siyaqhuba. Siyasebenza. [We are moving forward. We are working.] Re dira go tlala seatla. [We are working very hard.] I thank you. [Applause.]
Modulasetilo, ke kopa gore o ntemose nako ya me ke kgone go itse gore e tsamaya jang ... [Tsenoganong.] Ke kopa sentle. Motl Modulasetilo, ke kopa gore o ntemose nako e ke e neetsweng ke batla go simolola ka ngangisano ya me. Ke a leboga. Ke a lo dumedisa. Lo rata gore re na le kgatlhego e e feteletseng ka ANC, mme ga lo bone gore le lona le na le kgatlhego eo ka EFF.
Tona, ke kopa gore jaaka lo tle lo fe batho diphasele tsa dijo, lo dire seo gape le ka makwaloitshupo. Nna ke tswa kwa Kapa Bophirima, kwa Kuruman, ga Motlharo, e leng karolo e e humanegileng thata. Ke itse ka fa batho ba sokolang thata ka teng ka Lefapha la Merero ya Selegae, ka jalo ke kopa gore lo tiise mo go direleng batho. [Tsenoganong.] Ga ke re kantoro ya lefapha ga eyo; didimala ke a bua! (Translation of Setswana paragraphs follows.)
[Ms N P MOKGOSI: Chairperson, please tell me how much time is allocated to me so that I can time myself. [Interjections.] Deputy Chairperson, please tell me how much time is allocated to me so that I can start with the debate. Thank you. I greet you all. You keep on saying we are obsessed with the ANC but you fail to realise that you have the same obsession with the