Hon members, before we proceed to decide on the Votes and Schedule to the Appropriation Bill, I have to inform you that I have received proposed amendments to the Appropriation Bill from the Minister of Finance. The amendments are printed in the name of the Minister on today's Order Paper. The amendments are meant to effect technical corrections to the Bill, in terms of section 14 of the Money Bills Amendment Procedure and Related Matters Act, Act 9 of 2009, by creating new Votes without appropriation for new departments and correcting departmental names. I now recognise the hon Minister of Finance. [Applause.]
Mr Speaker, Mr Acting President, our guests from Kenya and hon members, my predecessor Minister Trevor Manuel tabled the Appropriation Bill in this House on 11 February 2009, based on the government structure which prevailed at that time, which was prior to the elections.
On 10 May 2009, President Zuma announced the appointment of Ministers and Deputy Ministers in terms of sections 91(2) and 93(1) of the Constitution of the Republic of South Africa. The portfolios of these Ministers required a reorganisation of departments, including the renaming of national departments and the establishment of new national departments to support the Ministers in executing their respective mandates.
The amendments being tabled today provide for the new Vote structure that gives effect to the new government structure. The 2009 Adjustments Appropriation Bill will provide a more detailed breakdown of the impact of the structural changes on the format of the Appropriation Bill. I hereby move the amendments as printed in my name on the Order Paper. Thank you. [Applause.]
Order! We now proceed to decide on the Votes and Schedule of the Appropriation Bill, as amended. I wish to thank parties for advising their staff on which Votes they intend making declarations on in order to record their objections and over which Votes they intend dividing. This information will greatly assist the process this afternoon.
I will put each Vote and ask parties for declarations of vote, as they have indicated. Members may make declarations of vote from the floor microphones if they wish. After that I will put the Vote for decision. I have been advised that, by agreement, declarations will be limited to two minutes. The bells will be rung for five minutes for the division on a vote, but only for one minute on subsequent divisions.
Amendments agreed to.
Vote No 1 - The Presidency - put.
Declarations of vote:
Chairperson, the violent protests and demonstrations taking place in our country on a weekly basis, the latest being in Diepsloot this past weekend, are of major concern to us. The Presidency should be reassuring all residents who say they have been waiting for 15 years for government to fulfil its promises.
The ACDP believes that ignoring and arresting protesters only is not the solution. Those who make promises, including the Presidency, should communicate with disgruntled members of the public and, where practically possible, give these members of the public new timeframes indicating when they can expect their concerns to be addressed.
The ACDP will support the budget of the Presidency as an indication to the Presidency that we want it to succeed in addressing the challenges facing our nation, particularly the challenge to provide clean running water, proper sanitation and decent houses for our people. I thank you.
Chairperson, the ANC supports the Presidency Budget Vote. In our view, it provides concrete directives and practical meaning to the five national priorities identified as an axis around which service delivery must be driven to push back the frontiers of poverty.
We are assembled here determined to fulfil that most solemn undertaking to build a nonracial, nonsexist, democratic and prosperous society in which all people are free from the shackles of exploitation, fear, want and disease.
The Presidency Budget Vote is our commitment to our people and before the eyes of the world that without decent work, the security of people, quality and accessible education and health services, the recovery of the humanity of all our people will remain a pipe dream.
The Presidency Budget Vote reflects the ruling party's commitment to serving the people of South Africa as a whole in line with the five priorities that the ANC put before the people of South Africa.
The establishment of the departments for planning, monitoring and evaluation will ensure that the government does not act in silos and that the Presidency exercises internal oversight of the executive branch of government. The commitment of the Presidency to subject itself and its administration to oversight by this Parliament augurs well for the entrenchment and deepening of democracy in South Africa.
The call for an activist Parliament and the endorsement thereof by this House will ensure that the resources made available by this House are utilised to provide quality and affordable services to all South Africans. Members of this House will hold the executive accountable, without fear or favour, for the delivery of quality, accessible and affordable services to all the people. Thank you very much. [Time expired.] [Applause.]
Vote agreed to.
Vote No 2 - Parliament - put and agreed to.
Vote No 3 - International Relations and Co-operation, formerly Foreign Affairs - put
Declarations of vote:
Chairperson, the ACDP will support this Budget Vote 3 on International Relations and Co-operation. We want to encourage government to continue rejecting attempts by the current chairman of the AU, Libya's Muammar Gaddafi, to coerce African states into forming the United States of Africa. We believe that priority should be given to strengthening regional bodies like SADC.
We further want to appeal to government to resist Muammar Gaddafi's reported alleged attempts to persuade African countries, including South Africa, which have ratified the International Criminal Court Treaty, to limit co-operation with it. This is particularly because the African countries he has targeted concluded that the ICC, International Criminal Court, was pursuing the same basic goals as the AU, and that the AU should engage more with the court. We appreciate South Africa's stance in saying we would not agree with Muammar Gaddafi. Thank you.
Chairperson, the ANC supports the Budget Vote for International Relations and Co-operation. It is our firm belief, as the ANC, that this Budget will advance the key strategic priorities in our engagement at the international level, which include the consolidation of our African agenda in terms of promoting peace, stability and human rights, the promotion of national interests in relation to the political and economic interest both in the south and in the north, and lastly, the promotion of multilateralism instead of unilateralism.
We believe very firmly that this budget goes a long way towards promoting that engagement with the progressive forces of the world, including issues of transforming the UN system. We support this budget, and want to make the ACDP comfortable in that, as part of that engagement in the African agenda, that is where we are engaging Gaddafi. Thank you.
Vote agreed to.
Vote No 4 - Home Affairs - put.
Declarations of vote:
The DA will support the Home Affairs budget because we believe that Minister Dlamini-Zuma is serious about her undertaking to turn the department around, and that she has been open and honest about problems facing the department. She has also announced measures to deal with those problems in her Budget speech on 26 June 2009.
For the benefit of this House, I would like to reiterate the call to the Minister to address the following priorities: the filling of existing vacancies; the eradication of existing backlogs within three months; the intensification of efforts to root out corruption in the department, especially with regard to new information that corruption in this department has risen by 415% between 2006 and 2008; and to launch an investigation into the cost of the Who am I Online project. Thank you.
Hon Chair and the House, Cope welcomes the budget by the Ministry, and further acknowledges that the department has committed itself to working with all citizens to make this department one of which the government can be proud.
During the department's Budget Vote, Cope highlighted the fact that this is the most crucial department in the life of every citizen in this country. This department continues to represent the commitment of government to ensure that no one is deprived of his or her rights and benefits as a result of not having an identity document. The current challenges, which continue to render the department ungovernable and conditions in it unbearable, remain a cause for concern for Cope. Some of these include, but are not limited to, ID forgery and fraud, which has not yet been rooted out. I want to allude to the fact that, as a result of these loose and reckless Home Affairs systems, the United Kingdom, after they realised that our identity document and passport are easily forged, has had to enforce a decision that all South Africans visiting that country now have to have a visa.
Cope calls on Home Affairs to fast-track the process of introducing the new passport with the new features, which will make it difficult to forge, or to use for any other act of corruption.
Cope pledges to assist the Ministry, more especially after the commitment that the Minister has made, but while we acknowledge the co-operation and the commitment by the Ministry, we continue, as Cope, to believe that the state that the department is in currently really deserves urgent attention.
It is on the basis of the founding principles of Cope, and of our commitment to a clean, transparent, and people-focused government that Cope will find it hard to sign this blank cheque of supporting the Budget Vote against the backdrop of all these significant areas of concern that we have raised. We believe these areas of concern really deserve an immediate and prompt response.
We, however, pledge our support and co-operation to the Ministry in its attempts to change the state of affairs in the department. Thank you.
Chairperson, while the IFP supports the Budget Vote for Home Affairs, there are certain concerns that we would like to raise.
The UK has imposed visa requirements on South African passport holders as a result of non-South Africans entering Britain with fraudulently obtained South African passports. The visa requirements were imposed after South African authorities had failed to adequately deal with the problem identified by the British authorities, despite being given an extra six months to do so. Corruption within this department is rife and must be eradicated if the worth of our passport is to be restored, and the department is to successfully fulfil its mandate. We wish you well, hon Minister. Thank you.
Chair, the ACDP would have thought that this department, more than any other, could have been divided and restructured. Migration, immigration and related issues, for example, surely need a dedicated and more specific response.
South Africa's Home Affairs department has been crippled by corruption and inefficiency over many years. In 2005 a young man won the sympathy of many South Africans when he held a Home Affairs official hostage with a fake gun, demanding his identity document - which is vital in every aspect of daily life - after a two-year wait for it.
We do appreciate, however, that turning this department around is going to be a mammoth task, but we are concerned by the shocking number of documents and files being lost. It is now almost expected by document seekers that they will have to apply more than once, if not many times, which is a costly exercise in time and money. People are waiting up to three years for approval of citizenship and permanent residence only to be told that documents are lost.
We can only hope that this budget will address issues of poor administration and corruption highlighted in the recent report by the US state department regarding fraudulent passports; identity documents and work permits; border security challenges; and socio-cultural attitudes and document fraud, which negatively affect government's ability to pursue and intervene in counterterrorism initiatives.
The ACDP notes the additional allocation for the World Cup, and is pleased to see preparations for the free and speedy World Cup events visa, which include separate facilities for soccer fans at airports to avoid congestion.
We are however, concerned that, with the smoke screen of the World Cup to shelter trafficking and terrorist agendas, we need to increase our capacity in this regard. The ACDP has grave concerns, but we will be supporting this budget as the new Minister attempts to tackle these enormous challenges. Thank you.
Chairperson, the ID wants to say thank you to the hon Minister, Dr Nkosazana Dlamini-Zuma. During the Home Affairs Budget Vote speech, I raised a specific concern about the level of service at the offices in Barrack Street. This concern had been brought to my attention by an ordinary member of the public. Just two days later, on a Sunday afternoon, I was called by the office of the Minister regarding my query. This matter was solved amicably within a week. [Applause.] The Minister has thus far lived up to her promise to be candid about the massive challenges in the department and to deal with the officials who do not provide proper service to our people.
The ID has closely followed her progress for the last two months and is also impressed with her commitment to root out corruption.
We, as the ID, are very happy that we finally have a Minister that is not scared to roll up her sleeves and clean up the Department of Home Affairs. We will join her in singing together, "Awuleth iwashing mashini". The ID supports the Budget. [Laughter.]
Chairperson, it is common cause that there are huge problems within this department. We have heard about some and experienced some of them. But it is also not true that everything is just wrong. There are many officials in that department who are doing their utmost to give a good service to the public.
I applied for a new passport on 8 May 2009 at the Malmesbury branch of the Department of Home Affairs. I downloaded the forms beforehand and completed them. It took me only 22 minutes to be serviced from my arrival up until I left, and it is less than eight weeks now but I have already received my new passport. I thank you very much for that. [Applause.]
I think it would be wrong for members today to vote against this Budget Vote because, even though we have lots of problems, let us give the Minister and the department a chance and see where we are next year. We all support the Budget. [Applause.]
Hon Chairperson, the issues raised by the opposition parties were dealt with frankly and honestly by the Minister and the Deputy Minister of Home Affairs in the budget debate of the department. There is a turnaround strategy in place to deal with the issues which members have raised, and some of the successes have been attested to by the members themselves.
The portfolio committee will nevertheless continue to ensure that the department complies with legislation and governance matters. The ANC supports the Budget Vote. Thank you. [Applause.]
Vote agreed to.
Vote No 5 - Public Works - put and agreed to.
Vote No 6 - Government Communication and Information System - put and agreed to.
Vote No 7 - National Treasury - put.
Declarations of vote:
Chairperson, the ACDP shares the Minister's concerns that we are already R18 billion behind in our revenue projections and that it is estimated that the budget deficit may rise to 7% of GDP, or an additional R50 billion to R60 billion will have to be found. Whilst our level of debt is relatively low by international standards, if our debt service costs rise, it will mean that government would have less money to spend.
Once the recession bottoms out, government will need to bring the deficit down again by curbing spending. The ACDP supports the finance Minister in this regard, who stated that the fiscus base to maintain government spending by borrowing was not limitless and that a period of fiscal consolidation must follow once the country emerges from recession. However, at this stage - and now there is an urgency for government to recognise and address the problem of wasteful and ineffective spending - we, as MPs, need to take up the challenge issued during the Budget speech that we should play a more active role in challenging accounting officers to plan their efficiency saving initiatives upfront and report regularly on progress. This is so particularly since we, as MPs, will be able to amend the budget next year.
How sympathetic can we be, when accounting officers of departments do not play their part? The ACDP also agrees that we need a thorough assessment of all government's programmes to see how we can improve value for money and identify areas where we can eliminate or reduce wastage. We need to ensure that as we spend more, we spend better. The ACDP will support this Budget Vote. Thank you.
Chairperson, the IFP will support this Budget Vote, and we would like to thank the hon Minister for the very frank and detailed responses he gave during the budget debate.
An area of concern is the support to municipalities. We find that the financial status of many municipalities around the country is disastrous, to say the least, and we think National Treasury has to make sure that the support to municipalities, whether it is administrative support or any other support, is forthcoming, so they can have good audit reports.
The other area that we would like National Treasury to look into in detail, is the performance audit of entities that are connected with government employees and doing business with national departments. If one reads this report you will find that there are many employees in government doing business as members of close corporations or their spouses are doing business with their own departments or with other government departments. This has to stop because there is a conflict of interest and Treasury regulations are being violated.
Monitoring and evaluation are going to be very important and we are very pleased by the response of the hon Minister and the department to look into these things. We support the Vote. Thank you.
Chairperson, hon Acting President and hon members, when we look at this Budget, as the ANC we are quite confident that the Budget addresses key priorities as stated in our manifesto. Also, despite the difficult situation we find ourselves in as a country, we are convinced that with the Budget, as outlined, and the objectives of Treasury and the relevant institutions such as Sars and Statistics SA, we can confidently say to our people out there that we are in no position to sacrifice their aspirations, particularly in areas of access to education, health, rural development and integration of the economies of these rural areas. We also see in this Budget that it is quite instructive that the issue of skills maintenance and retention within the department gives us confidence that, moving into the future, we will be able to manage the resources of the country without any doubt. We also see in the Budget itself that the area of economic transformation is quite central to ensuring that our people do not remain passive recipients of social grants, but that they will in actual fact become active participants and real players in the economy. We support this Budget, Chairperson, without any hesitation. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Vote agreed to.
Vote No 8: Public Administration Leadership and Management Academy - put and agreed to.
Vote No 9: Public Service and Administration - put and agreed to.
Vote No 10: Public Service Commission - put.
Declarations of vote:
Chairperson, while the IFP supports this Vote, I record the following concern. The IFP is firmly opposed to a single Public Service reiterated in the Budget Vote. Firstly, this will create a bloated, cumbersome and unmanageable Public Service open to more rampant corruption. More time will be absorbed in responding to bureaucratic challenges, instead of accelerated service delivery.
Secondly, this runs counter to the letter and spirit of the Constitution, which entrenches three distinctive interdependent and autonomous spheres of government. In actual fact, the IFP sees the collapse of provincial and local government structures as a centrist ploy by the department to amass all power in Pretoria, instead of taking government closer to the people, which is the hallmark of democracy. I thank you.
Chairperson, the Public Service Commission has been engaged in doing quite a good task, which the commission for public service and administration is acknowledging. Most of the reports that we deal with were compiled by this commission and, as a matter of fact, we all believe that this commission is really working very well.
I must indicate that noncompliance, even including corruption, has been exposed by the Public Service Commission. As a matter of fact, I am sure all of us on the committee do agree - those who attend, with the exception of the IFP, because they do not come to the committee meetings.
Even with the opposition we have been working constructively in terms of constructive criticism and by mapping a positive way forward. We've got a good spirit of working together, and we believe that we will definitely make an impact in moving forward. We would encourage the IFP to participate, and they will understand how we are moving forward. Thank you. [Applause.]
Vote agreed to.
Vote No 11 - Statistics South Africa - put and agreed to.
Vote No 12 - Arts and Culture - put.
Declaration of vote:
Chairperson, the DA supports this budget as the budget allocations are in line with the stated objectives of the different programmes. However, concern has to be raised regarding the qualified audit reports it has received in the past, specifically the findings of the qualified Auditor-General's report of 2007-08, namely the underspending of more than R21 million on Programme 2: Arts and Culture in Society and Programme 6: National Archives, Records, Libraries and Heraldic Services; insufficient evidence to substantiate the amount of more than R49 million relating to subsistence and travel expenditure; a possible irregular expenditure in the amount of more than R54 million; and noncompliance with the applicable legislation.
Although the Minister has replied to these matters in the Budget debate, we have to realise that these matters are extremely serious and can impede implementation.
Concern was also raised regarding the qualified audit finding received by some of the arts and culture institutions such as the National Library of SA, the Northern Flagship Institution and the SA State Theatre.
The DA will monitor the progress and implementation of the budget closely by requesting quarterly feedback to the portfolio committee.
Vote agreed to.
Vote No 13 - Education - put.
Declarations of vote:
Chairperson, the DA objects to the Education budget on the grounds that when it comes to schooling it does not provide adequate financial support for training, recruitment, in-service development, performance management, retention and salary, that is, the full value chain, for teachers in Grades 1 to 12.
It does not adequately provide for the professionalisation of Grade R teachers. The DA appreciates the fact that the Occupation-Specific Dispensation agreement for teachers was signed in April 2008, and that the general promise is for good teachers to be better paid.
Good teachers affect eternity by nurturing aspiring minds. The budget goes far, but it does not go far enough, to support them in the task that should charm, strengthen, steer and not dull the imagination of the young.
We have no difficulty with the budget for Higher Education but we have a little quarrel with the funds set aside for the SA Qualifications Authority, SAQA, the Council for Quality Assurance in General and Further Education and Training, known as Umalusi, and the Council on Higher Education.
Funding set aside for the National Student Financial Aid Scheme, NSFAS, is adequate, but our education authorities must find a solution to the underspending of those funds at university level.
Finally, we encourage the Ministry of Higher Education and Training to start negotiating with, rather than issuing instructions to the provinces over the structure for teacher training colleges. Thank you.
Chairperson, Cope supports the budget but wishes to place on record the following concerns: given the fact that Education gets the much bigger slice of the national Budget, we would expect the Ministers concerned to apply themselves to such critical success factors as improved conditions, especially in rural areas, for teachers and learners, so that teachers can teach and learners can learn. Also, government needs to conduct intensive teacher training on the many changes brought upon them, including the National Curriculum Statement.
Regarding Higher Education and Training, a number of learners who enter the education system somehow get lost in the process and never come out. We therefore need a tracker system to follow learner progress, or lack thereof, so that we can all influence the outcomes we wish to see. Thank you.
Chairperson, there is no doubt that our education system, despite budgetary allocations, which is the budget we support, remains seriously dysfunctional at all levels. Firstly, I want to express the IFP's concern about the implementation of policy by provinces, and the monitoring thereof by the Department of Education. Take, for example, the KwaZulu-Natal department of education, which awarded Indiza a multimillion- rand tender to deliver textbooks to schools across the province, which were never delivered. Hence, quality of education suffered.
Then, look at the feeding scheme in the Eastern Cape which has collapsed completely, and as we debate now, thousands and thousands of children in schools in the northern part of KwaZulu-Natal, covering the entire Umkhanyakude District, are not being fed because the feeding schemes there too have collapsed.
The IFP calls on the Minister of Education immediately to investigate these matters.
It is clearly due to a lack of proper monitoring by the Department of Education that such glaring dysfunctionality within the education system is allowed to continue.
The Department of Education has on numerous occasions admitted that our system remains the weakest at district level. Yet for two consecutive budgetary years there has been no allocation to strengthen and improve education at district level, where we need more subject advisors, more adequately qualified teachers and more teaching aids.
Lastly, schools cannot remain "black boxes" where nobody knows, including the hon Minister, what is going on inside there. Open up schools across the country urgently for routine inspections. We cannot allow unions to continue protecting their turf. I thank you.
Thank you, Chairperson. Education's significance in reducing poverty and accelerating long-term economic growth demands that it continues to utilise the largest portion of the national Budget. The ACDP supports Higher Education and Training plans to expand education opportunities for matriculants through an expanded college sector focusing on more teacher training sites, agriculture, nursing and the training of artisans.
We also note the expressed intention of the department to expand the school nutrition programme to high schools, reduce class sizes and increase the access of five-year-old Grade R learners. The ACDP believes that it is going to be important that the portfolio committee monitors progress in these crucial aspects.
One of the major problems with education today is that teachers are not allowed to be teachers. They are inundated with administration, lesson plans for every lesson, marking, assessments and never-ending forms to fill in. Our children are assessed and assessed again but they are not being taught. This rigid control dilutes the unique teaching ability of individual teachers, and our children have become statistics and not learners.
The capping of school fees is a highly contentious issue and should not be entered into lightly. Often interventions that appear to be obvious solutions have severe and damaging unintended consequences. Significant numbers of children between the ages of 7 and 15 have either never attended school or have dropped out for various reasons. Bringing these children into schools will necessitate targeted interventions to deal with varied circumstances.
The plight of our out-of-school children with disabilities is also a concern. The ACDP has serious concerns, particularly with OBE and curriculum deficiencies, and will not be supporting this budget. Thank you.
Chairperson, Deputy President of the Republic of South Africa, Ministers and Deputy Ministers of the Republic of South Africa, Members of Parliament of the Republic of South Africa, basic education concerns itself with those matters which, once learned, enable the learner to grasp all other matters whether trivial or complex. Concerns about the quality of education have been raised for many years. Today our schools are in trouble. Youth is in rebellion.
There can be no argument that the abiding issue in primary schools today is that of helping all children achieve adequate levels of literacy. Strangely, in a country showered with adequate resources, South Africans still find themselves with the highest levels of reading disabilities in the world, at least amongst those countries whose national goals include universal literacy.
Compounding the nationwide problem is the endemic and exceedingly high incidence of reading disability among our youth from disadvantaged backgrounds, aggravated by the absence of libraries and computer centres in their communities.
This reading problem is not new. Its existence and its apparent severity in our society have received widespread notice for many years, dating back to the apartheid era. Nonetheless, it is rapidly escalating in our schools and catching the attention of the media, which report that vast numbers of our primary school learners cannot read. These are the ones who get lost in big cities and fall prey to thugs who roam the streets, day and night.
Our highest priority as a nation must be placed upon solving the problem of illiteracy. Grave reading and writing deficiencies are considered to be major stumbling blocks in gaining access to a successful and happy life. Government must do more! [Time expired.]
Hon Chairperson, I hereby rise to support the Education Vote. Listening to the DA's objection, we, as the ANC, say that we have recognised the problem of education as one of the central issues to be tackled over the next five years. In fact, we will have to tell the voters that the DA has objected to the R140 billion spent in this budget.
We will make sure that early childhood development, ECD, is being expanded, the school nutrition programme is being expanded, the outreach to matriculants is being expanded and a critical focus on scarce skills is being dealt with.
In the Budget debate, we have also highlighted the reality that the focus must be placed on a training and skills revolution. We have, as a committee, identified that at least 40% of young people between the ages of 15 and 24 are unemployed; therefore, our interventions through this budget.
Today we have visited the National Student Financial Aid Scheme, NSFAS, and we have asked them to work in close partnership not only with schools, but also with higher education institutions. Therefore, as the ANC, we support this budget, but together we will be able to do more over the next 5 to 10 years. [Applause.]
Division demanded.
The House divided.
AYES - 265: Abram, S; Adams, P E; Adams, L H; Balindlela, Z B; Baloyi, M R; Bam-Mugwanya, V; Bhengu, P; Bhoola, R B; Bikani, F C; Blaai, B C; Bogopane- Zulu, H I; Bonhomme, T J; Booi, M S; Borman, G M; Botha, T; Botha, Y R; Burgess, C V; Buthelezi, M G; Carrim, Y I; Carter, D; Cebekhulu, R N; Chabane, O C; Chikunga, L S; Chiloane, T D; Chohan, F I; Coleman, E M; Cronin, J P; Cwele, S C; Dambuza, B N; Dandala, H M; Davies, R H; De Lange, J H; Dexter, P D; Dhlamini, B W; Diale, L N; Dikgacwi, M M; Dlamini, B O; Dlamini-Zuma, N C; Dlulane, B N; Dubazana, Z S; Dube, M C; Dunjwa, M L; Ebrahim, E I; Farisani, T S; Fihla, N B; Fransman, M L; Frolick, C T; Fubbs, J L; Gaehler, L B; Gasebonwe, T M A; Gcume, N P; Gcwabaza, N E; Gelderblom, J P; Gigaba, K M N; Gina, N; Godongwana, E; Gololo, C L; Gona, M F; Goqwana, M B; Greyling, L W; Gumede, D M; Gungubele, M; Gxowa, N B; Hajaig, F; Hanekom , D A; Hogan, B A; Holomisa, S P; Jacobus, L; Jeffery, J H; Johnson, M; Kekana, C D; Kenye, T E; Kganare, D A; Kganyago, N M; Khoarai, L P; Kholwane, S E; Khunou, N P; Kilian, J D; Komphela, B M; Koornhof, N J J v R; Kota-Fredericks, Z A; Kotsi, C M P; Kubayi, M T; Landers, L T; Lekgetho, G; Lishivha, T E; Luthuli, A N; Luyenge, Z; Maake, J J; Mabasa, X; Mabedla, N R; Mabuza, M C; Mac Kenzie, G P D; Madasa, Z L; Madikizela-Mandela, N W; Madlala, N M; Mafolo, M V; Magagula, V V; Magama, H T; Magau, K R; Magazi, M N; Magwanishe, G; Mahlangu-Nkabinde, G L; Makasi, X C; Makhuba, H N; Makhubela-Mashele, L S; Makhubele, Z S; Malale, M I; Malgas, H H; Maluleka, H P; Maluleke, J M; Manamela, K B; Manana, M C; Mandela, Z M D; Manganye, J; Mangena, M S; Manuel, T A; Mapisa-Nqakula, N N; Martins, B A D; Masango, F T-T; Mashatile, P; Mashiane, L M; Mashigo, R J; Mashishi, A C; Masutha, T M; Mataboge, D K; Mathebe, D H; Mathebe, P M; Mathibela, N F; Matladi, M N ; Matlanyane, H F; Matshoba, J M; Maunye, M M; Mavunda, D W; Mbili, M E; Mc Gluwa, J J; Mda, A; Mdakane, M R; Mdladlana, M M S; Mentor, M P; Mjobo, L N; Mkhize, H B; Mkhize, L N; Mkhulusi, N N P; Mlambo, E M; Mlangeni, A; Mmusi, S G; Mnguni, P B; Mnisi, N A; Mocumi, P A; Molao, S K; Molebatsi, M A; Molewa, B E E; Moloi-Moropa, J C; Morutoa, M R; Moss, L N; Motimele, M S; Motlanthe, K P; Motshekga, M A; Motshekga, M S; Mpontshane, A M; Msimang, C T; Msweli, H S; Mthethwa, E M; Mthethwa, E N; Mtshali, E; Mufamadi, T A; Mushwana, F F; Muthambi, A F; Nchabeleng, M E; Ndabeni, S T; Ndlovu, V B; Ndude, H N; Nel, A C; Nelson, W J; Nene, N M; Newhoudt-Druchen, W S; Ngcobo, B T; Ngcobo, E N N; Ngele, N J; Ngonyama, L S; Ngwenya, W; Ngwenya-Mabila, P C; Nhanha, M A; Nhlengethwa, D G; Njikelana, S J; Njobe, M A A; Nkwinti, G E; November, N T; Ntapane, S Z; Ntshiqela, P; Ntuli, B M; Ntuli, Z C; Nxesi, T W; Nyalungu, R E; Nyanda, S; Nyekemba, E; Oliphant, M N; Oosthuizen, G C; Padayachie, R L; Pandor, G N M; Peters, E D; Petersen-Maduna, P; Phaahla, M J; Phaliso, M N; Pilusa- Mosoane, M E; Poho, PD; Pule, D D; Radebe, B A; Radebe, G S; Radebe, J T; Ramatlhodi, N A; Ramodibe, D M; Rantsolase, M A; Rasool, E; Schneemann, G D; Sefularo, M; Segale-Diswai, M J; Selau, G J; Sexwale, T M G; Shabangu, S; Shiceka, S; Shilowa, M S; Sibanyoni, J B; Sibhida, N N; Singh, N; Sisulu, L N; Sithole, S C N; Sizani, P S; Skosana, J J; Skosana, M B; Smith, P F; Smith, V G; Snell, G T; Sogoni, E M; Sosibo, J E; Sotyu, M M; Stofile, M A; Suka, L; Sulliman, E M; Sunduza, T B; Surty, M E; Thabethe, E; Thobejane, S G; Tinto, B; Tlake, M F; Tolo, L J; Tseke, G K; Tsenoli, S L; Tshivhase, T J; Tshwete, P; Tsotetsi, D R; Turok, B; Twala, N M; Vadi, I; Van der Merwe, J H; Van der Merwe, S C; Van Schalkwyk, M C J; Vukuza- Linda, N Y; Williams, A J; Xaba, P P; Xasa, T; Yengeni, L E; Zikalala, C N Z; Zondi, K M.
NOES - 64: Boinamo, G G; Bosman, L L; Coetzee, T W; Davidson, I O; De Freitas, M S F; Doman, W P; Dreyer, A M; Du Toit, N D; Dudley, C; Duncan, P C; Ellis, M J; Farrow, S B; Figlan, A M; Fritz, A T; George, D T; Groenewald, P J; James, W G; Kalyan, S V; Kloppers-Lourens, J C; Kohler- Barnard, D; Kopane, S P; Krumbock, G R; Lamoela, H; Lee, T D; Lotriet, A; Louw, A; Lovemore, A T; Madisha, W M; Marais, S J F; Masango, S J; Maynier, D J; Michael, N W A; Mnqasela, M; Mokgalapa, S; Morgan, G R; Motau, S C; Mubu, K S; Mulder, C P; Ollis, I M; Pretorius, P J C; Rabie, P J; Rabotapi, M W; Schmidt, H C; Schmidt, J; Selfe, J; Shinn, M R; Smiles, D C; Smuts, M; Spies, W D; Steele, M H; Steyn, A; Steyn, A C; Swart, M; Swart, S N; Swathe, M M; Terblanche, J F; Van Dalen, P; Van Der Berg, N J; Van den Linde, J J; Van der Westhuizen, A P; Van Dyk, S M; Van Schalkwyk, H C; Waters, M; Wenger, M.
ABSTAIN - 2: George, M E; Mncwango, M A.
Vote accordingly agreed to.
Vote No 14 - Health - put.
Declarations of vote:
Chairperson, the Minister of Health has inherited the poisoned chalice from his predecessor, Minister Manto Tshabalala-Msimang. The fact that we have 12 000 vacancies for doctors and 42 000 for nurses did not happen on its own. It took careful and deliberate action or nonaction, as the case may be.
Due to the underfunding of health care, health professional salaries were eroded by inflation, and working conditions became unbearable. As people left, they were not replaced. This created an ever-increasing vicious circle. This year's budget is certainly no different as the underfunding continues.
The failure to make adequate provision for doctors' occupation-specific dispensation, OSD, increases - despite agreeing to this some two years ago - is of great concern to the DA. In order to pay doctors, you would have had to allocate R2,5 billion in the budget. Sadly, only R1 billion has been provided - a 60% shortfall in this regard.
The underfunding of the ARV programme to the tune of R7 million or 70% of the budget is also a great concern. This means that people who should be receiving these life-saving drugs will not be doing so, resulting in many people facing certain death.
The department has, in the past seven years, only received one unqualified audit report. Given the seriousness of the underfunding I have outlined, the Minister may consider cancelling, as a gesture, his Budget Vote dinner tonight in the Marks Building. I don't see the Minister, though, in the House at the moment.
Minister, the DA appreciates the fact that you are new in your position. We will support you when we believe you are correct. We are sceptical of what you will be able to achieve, given that many of your top officials are a hangover from the days of denial, garlic and beetroot. [Laughter.]
The fact that the department could not even deliver the strategic plan on time is an indication of this failure and inability. Unless a new and fresh set of ideals is put in place at the top of the department, we believe very little will change. I hope, Minister - I hope his colleagues will pass this message on to him - that next year the DA can stand here, in all honesty, and vote for the budget. Sadly, this year we cannot. Thank you.
Mr Chairperson, I have to state from the outset that I like the hon Minister and his deputy. They are my comrades. [Laughter.] But Cope is convinced that the Health Budget Vote for the 2009-10 financial year does not address the following.
There is no programme to ensure that hospitals and clinics are managed by qualified, skilled, efficient and effective managers. The hon Minister should conduct a skills audit to ensure that these institutions are properly managed. But it is clear that he has no intention to do so. Consequently, we must expect to still have long queues in hospitals. We must still expect dirty clinics and hospitals which are not properly staffed and without medicine. We will still hear more talk of infrastructure improvement without any implementation. We will hear more talk of the launch of some operation which sounds like a military operation, without any implementation plan.
The manner in which the Minister handled and continues to handle the OSD issue is indicative of forthcoming disasters. He is putting the lives of our people, especially the poor, at risk. The hon Minister knows that the rich can easily buy health services. Instead of implementing the agreement, he is attempting to reopen negotiations. He tells the nation that the doctors are on strike when he has locked them out. This backpedalling means that the Minister cannot be trusted to abide by the agreements he enters into.
Last month, the hon Minister informed this House that he will release a national health insurance, NHI, document within a few days. Since then, nothing has happened. We are still waiting for "some few days" to pass. These are some of the reasons why Cope does not support this Health budget. [Applause.]
Chairperson, the health care system of our country is in a dismal state. It does not promote the health of the millions of South Africans through an accessible, caring and high-quality health care system as it is meant to. The Department of Health has failed many South Africans who rely on it to provide them with quality health care. Drastic changes are needed if there is to be a real improvement in our health care system and an improved service to the many people who are reliant on it.
Once again, we, the IFP, do understand that the new Minister has inherited this system. We do hope that he makes strides in correcting it, but the IFP cannot support this Budget Vote. I thank you.
Chair, provincial spending intended to facilitate the roll- out of the Prevention of Mother-to-Child Transmission Programme, as well as expand access to antiretrovirals for people living with HIV, will have to be closely monitored. Reports that government will be short of R1 billion for HIV and Aids drugs in this financial year raise serious concerns. We cannot afford a repeat of the shortages experienced in the Free State earlier this year. South Africa has one fifth of the world's HIV-infected people. Yet, there has been no proper costing. So, we do not really know what we require to meet the need for treatment - this must be done.
Maternal, child and women's health and nutrition is another concern for the ACDP. Each year, according to statistics, 1 600 women die from complications in pregnancy and childbirth; 20 000 babies die before they are a month old; 75 000 children die before the age of five; and 20 000 children are stillborn. Shockingly, some have concluded that the easy way out of this dilemma is for women not to carry their babies to full term. In addition to statistics, hundreds of thousands more babies have been destroyed in their mothers' wombs in line with government policy.
Efforts to strengthen emergency medical services in line with the 2010 Fifa World Cup commitments are noted and welcomed. However, appalling conditions in hospitals with a drastic shortage of beds and staff do not appear to be a major consideration in this budget. The ACDP would like to give the new administration and the new Minister the benefit of the doubt. However, due to our grave concerns, including about the funding of abortion on demand, we cannot support this Vote. Thank you.
Chairperson, although the ID will be supporting this budget, we have to express the concern that this department has been chronically underfunded over the last 10 years. Unless we can address the budgetary allocations and increases thereof, we do not believe that we will address the fight against HIV/Aids, the poorly serviced public health sector and the ridiculously low salaries that some of our public health care doctors are receiving. I thank you.
Chairperson, I just want you to take note of my observation. I have never seen some of the members who were speaking here in the portfolio committee meetings. These members were supposed to be part of the Portfolio Committee on Health. Yet, they come here and tell us that they don't know this and that. Some of these things could have been answered in the portfolio committee. That's why they probably do not know anything about them.
The second statement we need to make is that, without sounding silly, I think we need a workshop about primary health care for some people so that they can understand what it means and, as such, will ask questions properly when we come to this meeting. [Applause.]
One of the reasons why more than 11 million people went to vote for the ANC was purely because of our promises - what we promised them we were going to do. There is no doubt about it that we are going to do what we promised we were going to do. One of the things we made promises on was the issue of inequities in this country that make the whole country unhealthy. We promised that we were going to correct these inequities. I have given an example that even those who can afford health services because they are rich, must remember that if somebody is not well, this is still going to affect them even if they are rich. That is why I gave the example that if my heart is normal, I cannot rejoice and think that it is healthy if my kidneys are not healthy. This is because if my kidneys are not healthy ... [Interjections.] I am not talking about mine but about those of all of us.
If your kidneys are not healthy, they are going to cause you to have high blood pressure. This high blood pressure is going to put a strain on your heart. When you have a strain on your heart, you are going to have cardiac failure or your heart might actually stop. So, do not think that because you are well-to-do now, you are not going to be affected by what's happening. [Interjections.] [Time expired.] [Applause.]
Division demanded.
The House divided.
AYES - 226: Abram, S; Adams, P E; Ainslie, A R; Baloyi, M R; Bam-Mugwanya, V; Bhengu, P; Bikani, F C; Bogopane-Zulu, H I; Bonhomme, T J; Booi, M S; Borman, G M; Boshigo, D F; Botha, Y R; Burgess, C V; Carrim, Y I; Chabane, O C; Chikunga, L S; Chiloane, T D; Chohan, F I; Coleman, E M; Cronin, J P; Cwele, S C; Dambuza, B N; Davies, R H; De Lange, J H; Diale, L N; Dikgacwi, M M; Dlamini-Zuma, N C; Dlulane, B N; Dubazana, Z S; Dube, M C; Dunjwa, M L; Ebrahim, E I; Farisani, T S; Fihla, N B; Fransman, M L; Frolick, C T; Fubbs, J L; Gasebonwe, T M A; Gcwabaza, N E; Gelderblom, J P; Gigaba, K M N; Gina, N; Godongwana, E; Gololo, C L; Gona, M F; Goqwana, M B; Greyling, L W; Gumede, D M; Gungubele, M; Gxowa, N B; Hajaig, F; Hanekom, D A; Hogan, B A; Holomisa, S P; Hoosen, M H; Jacobus, L; Jeffery, J H; Joemat- Pettersson, T M; Johnson, M; Kekana, C D; Kenye, T E; Khoarai, L P; Kholwane, S E; Khunou, N P; Komphela, B M; Kota-Fredericks, Z A; Kubayi, M T; Landers, L T; Lekgetho, G; Line, H; Lishivha, T E; Luthuli, A N; Luyenge, Z; Maake, J J; Mabasa, X; Mabedla, N R; Mabuza, M C; Madasa, Z L; Madikizela-Mandela, N W; Madlala, N M; Mafolo, M V; Magagula, V V; Magama, H T; Magau, K R; Magazi, M N; Magwanishe, G; Mahlangu-Nkabinde, G L; Makasi, X C; Makhubela-Mashele, L S; Makhubele, Z S; Malale, M I; Malgas, H H; Maluleka, H P; Maluleke, J M; Manamela, K B; Manana, M C; Mandela, Z M D; Manganye, J; Mangena, M S; Manuel, T A; Mapisa-Nqakula, N N; Martins, B A D; Masango, F T-T; Mashatile, P; Mashigo, R J; Mashishi, A C; Masutha, T M; Mataboge, D K; Mathebe, D H; Mathebe, P M; Mathibela, N F; Matladi, M N; Matlanyane, H F; Matshoba, J M; Maunye, M M; Mavunda, D W; Mbili, M E; Mc Gluwa, J J; Mdakane, M R; Mdladlana, M M S; Mentor, M P; Mjobo, L N; Mkhize, H B; Mkhize, L N; Mkhulusi, N N P; Mlambo, E M; Mlangeni, A; Mmusi, S G; Mnisi, N A; Mocumi, P A; Molebatsi, M A; Moloi-Moropa, J C; Morutoa, M R; Moss, L N; Motimele, M S; Motlanthe, K P; Motshekga, M A; Mthethwa, E M; Mthethwa, E N; Mtshali, E; Mufamadi, T A; Mushwana, F F; Muthambi, A F; Nchabeleng, M E; Ndabandaba, L B G; Ndabeni, S T; Nel, A C; Nelson, W J; Nene, N M; Newhoudt-Druchen, W S; Ngcobo, B T; Ngcobo, E N N; Ngele, N J; Ngwenya, W; Ngwenya-Mabila, P C; Nhlengethwa, D G; Njikelana, S J; Nkwinti, G E; November, N T; Ntapane, S Z; Ntuli, B M; Ntuli, Z C; Nxesi, T W; Nyalungu, R E; Nyanda, S; Nyekemba, E; Oliphant, M N; Oosthuizen, G C; Padayachie, R L; Pandor, G N M; Peters, E D; Petersen-Maduna, P; Phaahla, M J; Phaliso, M N; Pilusa-Mosoane, M E; Pule, D D; Radebe, B A; Radebe, G S; Radebe, J T; Ramatlhodi, N A; Ramodibe, D M; Rantsolase, M A; Rasool, E; Saal, G; Schneemann, G D; Sefularo, M; Segale-Diswai, M J; Selau, G J; Sexwale, T M G; Shabangu, S; Shiceka, S; Sibanyoni, J B; Sibhida, N N; Sisulu, L N; Sithole, S C N; Sizani, P S; Skosana, J J; Smith, V G; Snell, G T; Sogoni, E M; Sosibo, J E; Sotyu, M M; Stofile, M A; Suka, L; Sulliman, E M; Surty, M E; Thabethe, E; Thobejane, S G; Tinto, B; Tlake, M F; Tsebe, S R; Tseke, G K; Tsenoli, S L; Tshivhase, T J; Tshwete, P; Tsotetsi, D R; Turok, B; Twala, N M; Vadi, I; Van der Merwe, S C; Van Schalkwyk, M C J; Williams, A J; Xaba, P P; Xasa, T; Yengeni, L E.
NOES - 106: Adams, L H; Balindlela, Z B; Blaai, B C; Boinamo, G G; Bosman, L L; Botha, T; Buthelezi, M G; Carter, D; Cebekhulu, R N; Coetzee, T W; Dandala, H M; Davidson, I O; De Freitas, M S F; Dexter, P D; Dhlamini, B W; Doman, W P; Dreyer, A M; Du Toit, N D; Dudley, C; Duncan, P C; Ellis, M J; Farrow, S B; Figlan, A M; Fritz, A T; Gcume, N P; George, D T; George, M E; Groenewald, P J; James, W G; Kalyan, S V; Kganare, D A; Kilian, J D; Kloppers-Lourens, J C; Kohler-Barnard, D; Koornhof, N J J v R; Kopane, S P; Kotsi, C M P; Krumbock, G R; Lamoela, H; Lee, T D; Lotriet, A; Louw, A; Lovemore, A T; Mac Kenzie, G P D; Madisha, W M; Makhuba, H N; Marais, S J F; Masango, S J; Mashiane, L M; Maynier, D J; Mda, A; Meshoe, K R J; Michael, N W A; Mnguni, P B; Mnqasela, M; Mokgalapa, S; Molao, S K; More, E; Morgan, G R; Motau, S C; Mpontshane, A M; Msimang, C T; Msweli, H S; Mubu, K S; Mulder, C P; Ndlovu, V B; Ngonyama, L S; Nhanha, M A A; Njobe, M A; Ntshiqela, P; Ollis, I M; Poho, P D; Pretorius, P J C; Rabie, P J; Rabotapi, M W; Schmidt, H C; Schmidt, J; Selfe, J; Shilowa, M S; Shinn, M R; Singh, N; Skosana, M B; Smiles, D C; Smith, P F; Smuts, M; Spies, W D; Steele, M H; Steyn, A; Steyn, A C; Swart, M; Swart, S N; Swathe, M M; Terblanche, J F; Tolo, L J; Trollip, R A P; Van Dalen, P; Van Den Berg, N J; Van der Linde, J J; Van der Merwe, J H; Van der Westhuizen, A P; Van Dyk, S M; Van Schalkwyk, H C; Waters, M; Wenger, M; Zikalala, C N Z; Zondi,